Fuel Consumption on 2.3 Ducato?

Malta1

Hi All

Looking for some advice from you mechanically minded heads out there

I have a 2003 Fiat Ducato (2.3jtd) coach built. It has 45,000 km on the clock and running well.
We were out on the van for the weekend and I have calculated that I was getting 20mpg (14L/100km in new money ). The majority of the driving was motorway and we were not pushing any harder than about 100kph

First question is.......does this sound very heavy on juice or is it standard for the 2.3?

Just one thing that might be of note, If the van is running, and you are standing outside, you can hear a "hissing" noise from the engine bay. When we bought the van, we had it checked by our mechanic and he heard the noise......he initially though that it was a turbo issue but having connected the van to diagnostics, no errors showed up for the turbo. The mechanic then put the "hissing" noise down to a leaving vac/air line and indicated that there was no concern

Given the heavy fuel consumption, I am wondering if there might be a problem with the fuel air mix causing excessive fuel burn? (kinda like your central heating oil burner)

Perhaps 20mpg is as good as it gets

The van has not been remapped and as I understand it, remapping doesn't really effect your fuel consumption rather it gives higher end torque?

Many thanks

coolvale

i dont know about the 2.3.
i have a 2.8 turbo & a few checks i done it was around 29 - 32 mpg.
i did have a problem with a whistling noise like air escaping & a loss of power found i had to change gear more especially on hills.
the cause was a hose loose.
check the hose clips for tightness even if they look ok.
im not saying that is your trouble.
good luck.

mcquill

I have the 3.0Lt Diesel (08) in a coach built CI Mizar, getting about 24-26 MPG. Your consumption does sound excessive.

Malta1

mcquill wrote: »

I have the 3.0Lt Diesel (08) in a coach built CI Mizar, getting about 24-26 MPG. Your consumption does sound excessive.

Cheers for the info guys

Now the big question...........how do I fix it???

Please dont suggest "a big hammer"

Aidan_M_M

Ah , the magic of Diagnostics.... They won't show up simple mechanical problems like a loose boost pipe , or a stuck wastegate.... You need a mechanic willing to get his hands dirty , the old fashioned way . That older gen2.3 should do 25mpg anyway . What sort of coachbuilt is it?

Malta1

Dethleff....Espirit
its the van that you "almost" done the timing belt on.....almost casue you couldnt get a time slot that worked for both of us

Macspower

Sounds heavy alright.. just check your calculations before you go spending money.. what formula did you use?

Malta1

the sums are right all right (if that makes sense)

There might be a slight rounding error in conversion from L/100km to mpg but nothing significant

I could almost see the fuel gauge needle drop as I was driving

bogman

Check and see if your air filter is dirty, if so replace it, my 2.8 jtd is not too bad but could do with a new filter, have cruise control (Magic speed) and it helps fuel consumption no doubt

Whats the story with mapping all, is it worth while and how much would it cost?

paddyp

bogman wrote: »

Check and see if your air filter is dirty, if so replace it, my 2.8 jtd is not too bad but could do with a new filter, have cruise control (Magic speed) and it helps fuel consumption no doubt

Whats the story with mapping all, is it worth while and how much would it cost?

Simplest thing you can do with the 2.8jtd is use the 2.3 rail pressure sensor on the 2.8 rail this increases the max pressure to 1800 bar from 1500 bar and gives improved power at the cost of a little puff of smoke at times. Personally having changed my jtd pump and injectors I'd be loath to put them under any more pressure.

90% of the guys offering mapping are clueless and are selling secondhand smoke I'd be very wary of parting company with my money. I would at least want a dyno test and exhaust analysis with any remap.

SARZY

Macspower wrote: »

Sounds heavy alright.. just check your calculations before you go spending money.. what formula did you use?

Anybody know the formula. From a 2.3 ducato I average 9.7 kms per litre. Similar driving as mentioned .

paddyp

SARZY wrote: »

Anybody know the formula. From a 2.3 ducato I average 9.7 kms per litre. Similar driving as mentioned .

Multiply km/l by 2.825

So you're getting 27.4mpg ( nice driving )


1 mile = 1.609344 km
1 imperial gallon = 4.54609188 l

4.54609188 / 1.609344 = 2.8248105314960629921259842519685

Aidan_M_M

Good man Paddy , useful figures to have.


I drove a new 2.2 6 berth from the Camping show at the NEC to Holyhead , and from there 100miles from Dublin to home. Flat out as we were caught for time (sat at 120km/h apart from traffic and city driving) , and got around 22 mpg... And that figure would improve drastically with a few thousand km under the engine's belt , and by dropping the speed 20-30 km/h.

Macspower

Aidan_M_M wrote: »

Good man Paddy , useful figures to have.


I drove a new 2.2 6 berth from the Camping show at the NEC to Holyhead , and from there 100miles from Dublin to home. Flat out as we were caught for time (sat at 120km/h apart from traffic and city driving) , and got around 22 mpg... And that figure would improve drastically with a few thousand km under the engine's belt , and by dropping the speed 20-30 km/h.

This is so true. the difference between driving at 120 km and 100 km is huge on fuel consumption... prob due to the fact they have the aerodynamics of a brick

bogman

paddyp wrote: »

Simplest thing you can do with the 2.8jtd is use the 2.3 rail pressure sensor on the 2.8 rail this increases the max pressure to 1800 bar from 1500 bar and gives improved power at the cost of a little puff of smoke at times. Personally having changed my jtd pump and injectors I'd be loath to put them under any more pressure.

Thanks for the tip Paddyp, a bit above my head but ill look into it, got an air filter today and it does not fit, they gave me the one for the model up to 1994 and its slightly larger in length and diameter, ill get it changed tomorrow

paddyp

Tyre pressure and tyre pattern can make a significant difference.

Very important is not to expect your motorhome to come out of the blocks at the same rate as your car, as mass increases the power to get it moving does also.

Studies have said that every 100kg adds 0.5 to 0.7 l/100km to standard combustion engined vehicles probably closer to lower end for a large diesel. So bringing a full tank of water, and that awning in the top box on a day trip can cost you.

SARZY

paddyp wrote: »

Multiply km/l by 2.825

So you're getting 27.4mpg ( nice driving )


1 mile = 1.609344 km
1 imperial gallon = 4.54609188 l

4.54609188 / 1.609344 = 2.8248105314960629921259842519685

Thanks for that, the info and the comment. I suppose anything over 25 mpg is ok in these aerodynamical dinosaurs. Must tell you its a low profile and that has to make a significant contribution. It would be interesting to compare the different body types where mpg is concerned,

Malta1

Many thanks for all the replys folks

I guess that what I have taken from the post is that I am getting below "average" mpg on the van. Now its time to getthe mechanic to take a look and first port of call will be to find the source of the "hiss"

jinghong

SARZY wrote: »

Thanks for that, the info and the comment. I suppose anything over 25 mpg is ok in these aerodynamical dinosaurs. Must tell you its a low profile and that has to make a significant contribution. It would be interesting to compare the different body types where mpg is concerned,

I have a transit 01 6 berth alcove (nose over cab) and similar, about 650k per fill which is usually 70L (tank is 80L). So thats 9.28 km/l or around 26mpg. I usually drive around 80-90 kmph.

I'd speculate that the newer engines are what makes the difference as much as design to be getting above 30mpg

Aidan_M_M

It's probably something "simple" , like a loose hose . AS I said , diagnostic computers won't tell you everything... AS an example , I had a Peugeot Boxer in lately (bought elsewhere I must add) that was hard to start... Everyone blamed the diesel supply , changed filters , pumps , pipes etc.... Hours spent on it. Within 10 mins I discovered 3 burnt out Glow Plugs.....

paddyp

Malta1 wrote: »

Many thanks for all the replys folks

I guess that what I have taken from the post is that I am getting below "average" mpg on the van. Now its time to getthe mechanic to take a look and first port of call will be to find the source of the "hiss"

Hey sorry we forgot about you, yes that would seem low. Like aidan says check the turbo hoses and intercooler for damage. sometimes the leak can be under the webbing on the bends and hard to find. Cracks can close up when the boost pressure is off and open right up under boost.

shaysue

I drive a Burstner Aviano on a 3 ltr Fiat Ducato base and get a steady 25mph. I use the cruise control whenever possible. By the way, the hissing sound is, I have been informed, the van telling you to change gear or that your foot is too hard on the pedal and you are not driving in an economical fashion. Also, as mentioned watch the load you are carrying.

paddyp

Malta1 wrote: »

Just one thing that might be of note, If the van is running, and you are standing outside, you can hear a "hissing" noise from the engine bay.

In common rail only a tiny fraction of the fuel circulation is actually going through the injectors the rest is constantly recirculating through the pipework and filter. This can make a hissing noise like the water in a central heating system. In the 2.8jtd van the loudest hissing noise seems to come from a little plastic connection block (where the return hose is connected) on the front of the engine. There is a similar block on the 2.3jtd might be worth listening to.

http://eper.fiatforum.com/eper/navi?MOD_COD=245&COUNTRY=012&GRP_COD=102&CAT_COD=2E&SBMK=T&DRIVE=D&MAKE=F&COMM_MODEL=DUC&ALL_FIG=0&LANGUAGE=3&PREVIOUS_KEY=PARTDRAWDATA&NEW_HTTP=TRUE&ALL_LIST_PART=0&SB_CODE=-1&KEY=PARTDRAWDATA&PRINT_MODE=0&EPER_CAT=SP&GUI_LANG=3&WINDOW_ID=1&SGRP_COD=26&SGS_COD=10&DRW_NUM=4