City Council to waste rate payers money

Builderfromhell

It has come to light that the City Council plan to build a security fence around the Vizes Court field for no apparent reason.

This field is currently a green area with mature trees. The grass is cut and the local kids play there. It has been open (withou fence) for some time now and no fly tipping, vandalism or anti-social behaviour has occured.

The Council plan to build social hosing on the site and the locals have voiced there objections by having a community picnic there. http://bocktherobber.com/2010/09/heil-housing-director
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=esg1kgq8mgU&feature=player_embedded

It could be that the Council are trying to squash any democratic dissent and ensure no more community events occur on this green area.
The security fence will cost a small fortune and if the development goes ahead will be taken down and scrapped. So the rate payers will pay for erection of uneccesary fence and then later pay (via the contractors tender) for the removal and disposal of fence.

More waste form the Council at a time when the City is suffering finacially.

padma

Builderfromhell wrote: »

It has come to light that the City Council plan to build a security fence around the Vizes Court field for no apparent reason.

This field is currently a green area with mature trees. The grass is cut and the local kids play there. It has been open (withou fence) for some time now and no fly tipping, vandalism or anti-social behaviour has occured.

The Council plan to build social hosing on the site and the locals have voiced there objections by having a community picnic there. http://bocktherobber.com/2010/09/heil-housing-director
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=esg1kgq8mgU&feature=player_embedded

It could be that the Council are trying to squash any democratic dissent and ensure no more community events occur on this green area.
The security fence will cost a small fortune and if the development goes ahead will be taken down and scrapped. So the rate payers will pay for erection of uneccesary fence and then later pay (via the contractors tender) for the removal and disposal of fence.

More waste form the Council at a time when the City is suffering finacially.

Children do not play there and never have. The residents from neighbouring streets want to build a vegetable plot there and put a park bench or two there. This in the view of the people who actually live in Vizes court would be a disaster as it will attract an anti social element to an otherwise peaceful part of the city.

As for social housing. The plan is to build a small apartment block for the elderly, similar in design to the one that was built there last year. The only problem with this is the fact that the apartment block will be at one part 4 stories. This is not welcomed by the residents of Vizes court. A better design needs to be implemented otherwise the best bet for the actual residents will be to leave it as it is, not put in park benches that will attract wino's or a vegetable plot and the mini farm that your one from Bowman street is currently campaigning for.

Val wants to get the council to build the social housing unit for the elderly in Hyde road.Why not build the vegetable plot and mini city farm on Hyde Road and Edward Street instead where the sounds of pigs grunting wont disturb the neighbours.

When you read carefully enough you will notice that less than half of the people signed the petition from the area. This is because of her plans to build a vegetable plot and a mini city farm there. Note also that Val is doing a horticultural course in College and part of that course is asking her to build a vegetable plot.

A close relative of mine lives in Vizes court and I assure everyone here that none of the residents want a city farm on their doorstep and park benches for winos to congregate at. Also an uncle lives on Joseph Street overlooking Vizes court. It is a number of people on neighbouring streets who want this to happen. What the residents would like is the place to be kept as is. It is too small an area for a mini city farm. As for her design for a few plots there. They are flawed simply because there are only 1 or 2 plots there.

steveon

There was nothing wrong with the bungalows that were already there apart from a common attic space that ran the entire lenght. There was also only fitted with new heating systems 2 or 3 yrs prior to them being knocked. The new building phase 1 was badly implemented, is completely out of character with the rest of the area. and piped only for chorus tv.and many of the current tenants do now want to pay for chorus, so are now without a tv service as they are not allowed errect an aerial anywhere on the building.

There is also limited parking spaces for any visiting relatives.

Phase 2 should be a one storey building and incorporate gardens as well as parkingt spaces. There is going to be another area of social houses in Lord Edward street where there is 3hectares of land on the old Telecom Eireann/Limerick clothing plant..

zimmermania

Builderfromhell wrote: »

It has come to light that the City Council plan to build a security fence around the Vizes Court field for no apparent reason.

This field is currently a green area with mature trees. The grass is cut and the local kids play there. It has been open (withou fence) for some time now and no fly tipping, vandalism or anti-social behaviour has occured.

The Council plan to build social hosing on the site and the locals have voiced there objections by having a community picnic there. http://bocktherobber.com/2010/09/heil-housing-director
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=esg1kgq8mgU&feature=player_embedded

It could be that the Council are trying to squash any democratic dissent and ensure no more community events occur on this green area.
The security fence will cost a small fortune and if the development goes ahead will be taken down and scrapped. So the rate payers will pay for erection of uneccesary fence and then later pay (via the contractors tender) for the removal and disposal of fence.

More waste form the Council at a time when the City is suffering finacially.

Could you tell us how it has come to light,because i rang the corpo today and they know nothing about it.I think its time the bowman st group left the people in vizes court alone to get on with their lives.

Amazotheamazing

I'm generally against building on green spaces in city centres but I'd be doubtful of anything Bock the Robber advocates.

It seems this was council land that had been housing, houses were knocked and a green space provided temporarily while the plans for the new buildings were approved, some locals liked the green space and are now objecting to it being returned to it's original purpose, whereas some residents want it built on?

It's a tough one, I admire the fact that the people in favour of the green space have attempted to build community spirit etc but on the otherhand, turning the green space into allotments or a city-farm, while interesting, limits it's use to everybody else.

I can see how this would be a tough decision for the council to make. The social housing for elderly people must be provided, no one wants to remove green space either though.

thefarmer

It's interesting just how much press this Vizes field issue is getting, it's been in the papers almost every day for the past two weeks and it's good to see more and more local cllrs in support of it. That short film showed only one view to do a city farm, I doubt that will ever happen as nobody is in a position to make claim on the land in that way. Just because somebody puts a clip up on youtube doesn't mean that it's suddenly set in stone buts it's amazing that people will believe anything and run around in a state of panic believing anything they see.
Children don't play there much as there is no playground and because residents of Vizes tell them to go away. What kind of people don't want children around?
Mostly residents are concerned for the welfare of the older folk in Vizes Court who have no outside space and can't even have a fag without setting off the fire alarms every day. Many of them can't even get outside of their compound to meet neighbours. While the people of Bowman St (who are the exactly?), Joseph's Street, Wolfe Tone Street are told to leave the people of Vizes alone, isn't it ok that someone cares about their welfare and doesn't want to see yet more uncared for old folk crammed into yet more unsuitable accommodation. It takes tremendous effort to attempt to have a community voice heard. I don't know where the rumour about a fence came from either but it has people worried that they will be punished just for speaking up, like they are invited to do.
I would love to see coherent arguments that clearly show how building a huge building on a tiny green is better than leaving a green space with trees. Ireland is the only European country with such backward views about looking after it's future and is breaking so many environmental laws by doing this

thefarmer

Limerick Post newspaper today page 19 "Maria Byrne said that she is working towards the provision of allotments in the city http://edition.pagesuite-professional.co.uk/digitaleditions.aspx?tab=0&pid=16d2df0b-b84b-4602-a4f3-05634de2cff3#
"We are discussing s pilot project for 2011 that would involve 40/50 allotments in the city environs etc"
"They (allotments) are a great outlet for people who may be out of work, it gives them a purpose. It would also make Limerick a more vibrant place and where people would want to live".
Looks like yer wan is not so crazy after all, if it's good enough for the Mayor and Cllr we voted for

Amazotheamazing

thefarmer wrote: »

Limerick Post newspaper today page 19 "Maria Byrne said that she is working towards the provision of allotments in the city http://edition.pagesuite-professional.co.uk/digitaleditions.aspx?tab=0&pid=16d2df0b-b84b-4602-a4f3-05634de2cff3#
"We are discussing s pilot project for 2011 that would involve 40/50 allotments in the city environs etc"
"They (allotments) are a great outlet for people who may be out of work, it gives them a purpose. It would also make Limerick a more vibrant place and where people would want to live".
Looks like yer wan is not so crazy after all, if it's good enough for the Mayor and Cllr we voted for

Depends on how the land is used, you can't say on one hand it's to provide a place for kids to play and then say it should be allotments. Are kids going to be playing soccer in a cabbage patch?

How many allotments are going to be made out of the green area, how much will be left for kids to play in etc?

thefarmer

As far as I know nobody is in a position to call what the land will be designated for as there is no way of knowing at this time whether City Hall will proceed with building this new block of flats. Many cllrs now see the faults in the new buildings design and it's unsuitability in terms of fire safety, emergency vehicle access and lack of green space amenity (contravening all EU guidelines) if this goes ahead.
Maybe a huge building and traffic congestion, risk of life due to ambulances not being able to reach people and more "anti-social" behaviour as attracted by an increase in parked cars at night is preferable. As far as I know the residents have a committee and everyone in the area was invited to a meeting weeks ago where all concerns can be aired

Amazotheamazing

thefarmer wrote: »

As far as I know nobody is in a position to call what the land will be designated for as there is no way of knowing at this time whether City Hall will proceed with building this new block of flats. Many cllrs now see the faults in the new buildings design and it's unsuitability in terms of fire safety, emergency vehicle access and lack of green space amenity (contravening all EU guidelines) if this goes ahead.
Maybe a huge building and traffic congestion, risk of life due to ambulances not being able to reach people and more "anti-social" behaviour as attracted by an increase in parked cars at night is preferable. As far as I know the residents have a committee and everyone in the area was invited to a meeting weeks ago where all concerns can be aired

An increase in parked cars attracts anti-social behaviour?

I haven't seen the plans, what's your basis for calling them unsuitable?

thefarmer

"I haven't seen the plans" the full file is available to see for all interested parties in City Hall planning dept.
Had you been following the story in the press you would be familiar with all arguments, both technical and environmental
Anybody with a genuine interest in this has the required knowledge to make an informed opinion, otherwise it's an emotive opinion and holds no wieght
End

Amazotheamazing

thefarmer wrote: »

"I haven't seen the plans" the full file is available to see for all interested parties in City Hall planning dept.
Had you been following the story in the press you would be familiar with all arguments, both technical and environmental
Anybody with a genuine interest in this has the required knowledge to make an informed opinion, otherwise it's an emotive opinion and holds no wieght
End

Woah, steady on, as i said in my first post I'm usually against any building on green space.

I've read a bit about the story and it seems to be pretty evenly split between people who want green space and people who want the housing built. All I asking for is you to back up your claims that parked cars attract anti-social behaviour and that the plans are unsuitable.

Losing the rag with people who want to hear the full story isn't going to win many converts to your cause.

thefarmer

Dear amazing, that's hardly losing the rag in fairness

All arguments have been backed up over and over by residents, many thanks for your interest

padma

thefarmer wrote: »

Children don't play there much as there is no playground and because residents of Vizes tell them to go away. What kind of people don't want children around?

Last year it was knocked down and up until mid summer it was mud. It has had 4 grass cuts so far. Children do not come in to Vizes court. Residents have NEVER told them to go away. One young lad about ten years old plays on the ROAD part of Vizes court where the artists house is, playing soccer and kicking the ball against the wall. This does not effect anyone in Vizes court and they have never uttered a word to him. Trying to make out the 6 residents in Vizes court are cranky old people is quite frankly very disrespectful for an outsider.

There are a lot of elderly people living in the Vizes court/Josephs street area. Having more social houses for elderly there will enhance the local community spirit. Town is a hop skip and a jump away. The People's Park is around the corner with plenty of green spaces and a fantastic playground for kids to play in. If another playground is to be built it should be in a different part of Limerick where there is a greater need.

The plan was there to build new social housing for the elderly that's why they demolished Vizes court. What people can agree on is the structure of the apt area needs to be remodelled as One section there is a lift which goes 4 stories. If and when it does start it would be nice for a few people to get a job to help them through the next years or so.

What some people seem to forget is that this space is recent and temporarily covered in grass waiting for the council to secure the funds so elderly people can have a better quality of life.

Putting park benches etc there will attract wino's which everyone here probably would agree it's better to have social housing for the elderly to live there instead.

thefarmer

Seems you are all speaking fair truths, what would I know only being an outsider. Well, best of luck with it, I have to milk the cows

Amazotheamazing

thefarmer wrote: »

Dear amazing, that's hardly losing the rag in fairness

All arguments have been backed up over and over by residents, many thanks for your interest

Fair enough, can you provide any links to the arguments the residents in favour of the greenspace are putting forward? Particularly the one about parked cars attracting anti-social behaviour.

zimmermania

thefarmer wrote: »

It's interesting just how much press this Vizes field issue is getting, it's been in the papers almost every day for the past two weeks and it's good to see more and more local cllrs in support of it. That short film showed only one view to do a city farm, I doubt that will ever happen as nobody is in a position to make claim on the land in that way. Just because somebody puts a clip up on youtube doesn't mean that it's suddenly set in stone buts it's amazing that people will believe anything and run around in a state of panic believing anything they see.
Children don't play there much as there is no playground and because residents of Vizes tell them to go away. What kind of people don't want children around?
Mostly residents are concerned for the welfare of the older folk in Vizes Court who have no outside space and can't even have a fag without setting off the fire alarms every day. Many of them can't even get outside of their compound to meet neighbours. While the people of Bowman St (who are the exactly?), Joseph's Street, Wolfe Tone Street are told to leave the people of Vizes alone, isn't it ok that someone cares about their welfare and doesn't want to see yet more uncared for old folk crammed into yet more unsuitable accommodation. It takes tremendous effort to attempt to have a community voice heard. I don't know where the rumour about a fence came from either but it has people worried that they will be punished just for speaking up, like they are invited to do.
I would love to see coherent arguments that clearly show how building a huge building on a tiny green is better than leaving a green space with trees. Ireland is the only European country with such backward views about looking after it's future and is breaking so many environmental laws by doing this

You say "more and more local councillors are coming out in favour of keeping it as a field".Not true the only cllr so far to oppose the building of apts lives miles away and while the mayor is in favour of allotments she is giving her full support to the building of the new apts.It seems to me that people not living in vizes field want it for themselves and their pet projects and care little for the people who were promised they would be housed back in vizes field from whence they came.

zimmermania

thefarmer wrote: »

It's interesting just how much press this Vizes field issue is getting, it's been in the papers almost every day for the past two weeks and it's good to see more and more local cllrs in support of it. That short film showed only one view to do a city farm, I doubt that will ever happen as nobody is in a position to make claim on the land in that way. Just because somebody puts a clip up on youtube doesn't mean that it's suddenly set in stone buts it's amazing that people will believe anything and run around in a state of panic believing anything they see.
Children don't play there much as there is no playground and because residents of Vizes tell them to go away. What kind of people don't want children around?
Mostly residents are concerned for the welfare of the older folk in Vizes Court who have no outside space and can't even have a fag without setting off the fire alarms every day. Many of them can't even get outside of their compound to meet neighbours. While the people of Bowman St (who are the exactly?), Joseph's Street, Wolfe Tone Street are told to leave the people of Vizes alone, isn't it ok that someone cares about their welfare and doesn't want to see yet more uncared for old folk crammed into yet more unsuitable accommodation. It takes tremendous effort to attempt to have a community voice heard. I don't know where the rumour about a fence came from either but it has people worried that they will be punished just for speaking up, like they are invited to do.
I would love to see coherent arguments that clearly show how building a huge building on a tiny green is better than leaving a green space with trees. Ireland is the only European country with such backward views about looking after it's future and is breaking so many environmental laws by doing this

One of the reasons it gets so much press may be because the person (val) driving the opposition writes a column for the limerick leader,which she uses to promote her ideas and has come out in favour of "guerilla gardening" which basically means planting on land that does not belong to you and showing little regard for those who may own the property and the group condone and promote trespass.