2x03- "Grilled Cheesus" [** SPOILERS WITHIN **] [US-05/10/10, IRL-06/10/10]

JP Liz V1

Finn has an existential crisis when he believes he sees the face of Jesus in his grilled cheese sandwich. Meanwhile, the rest of the kids rally around Kurt after he has a crisis of his own that leads to a larger discussion among the group about their own theology.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JUfr9HYynn0

Richard Dower

Cheers Liz, gonna leave it upto you each week for the episode threads :-)
Liz..it's "2x03"

JP Liz V1

I'm glad Burt Hummel is back on screen

Anyways Richy Dower work away if you want with threads I think sometimes only you and me posts the most here anyways

Basq

Thread renamed.

rebel girl 15

Anybody who doesn't want to know anything about the episode before the watch it on TV3, don't watch TV3 till the episode - basically everything that JP wrote above was shown,

including what Kurt's crisis is and two of the songs that will be sung. Looks like it will be a good episode though, I hope!

.

x Purple Pawprints x

I'm really looking forward to this week's episode, looks like it could be a tear-jerker too...

Richard Dower

Cheesus...that was cheesy!, worst ep. ever?...definately worse ep. this season. Few zingers from Brittany, but overall....meh.

I reserve the right to future postings and scolding!

JP Liz V1

Chris Colfer is a great actor and his version of I Want to Hold you Hand was beautiful. I love his friendship with Mercedes and his relationship with his dad.

Richard Dower

I hated every song!...and as for Colfer, the guy couldn't even squeeze out a tear, he looked like he was tryna take a dump and had constipation!

I'm not being funny, well i am, but i really disliked that ep. They were a few zingers in the mix, but not that many....like Puck "he's coming out", and Brittany "is jesus and evil dawrf".

But if felt they were trying real hard to make us blub, never worked on me and i'm a big softie, meh...nay...blah!!

LadyMayBelle

Meh. Was looking forward to this one, I mean the amount of cheesey Jesus jokes out there, but no..

Saying that..

I did shed a tear for Kurt when he sang "I want to hold your hand"

The rest of it was boring, and the songs even worse.

Couple of funny Puck moments; Jews for jesus and all that.

Overall, 3/10.

loike

omg this is a big let down compared to last week
but omfg lea singing in the park was ah-maze-ing
and amber has such an amazing voiceeee

Richard Dower

^ we all know Lea can sing, but another showtune??...Yentyl

beanyb

Yeah, I didn't like that at all. I always hate when Glee tries to be deep and meaningful. It always fails miserably as far as I'm concerned. Far too preachy for me. I liked 'One of Us,' but the rest of the songs were pretty meh. I love Bridge Over Troubled Water, but didn't like this version at all.

I was annoyed at how little respect they all had for Kurt throughout the whole episode. His non belief in God is just as valid as their beliefs. Not only did he not ask them to pray, he expressly said he didn't want them to pray. If they wanted to do so in privacy, that was up to them. But going to Burt's bedside? Uncool. This is all especially true for Mercedes, who continued to shove her beliefs down Kurt's throat all the way through the episode.

LadyMayBelle

It reminded me a bit of the episode last season wit the football player who was paralyzed, and Rachel's annoying singer.

I cringed hearing her singing that song from Yentyl.

SL10

Im just finished watching now and I really really liked it! Cried the entire way through.

I thought Sue and her sis was very touching too. All in all i laughed a good bit, cried a good bit so its a winner for me

Richard Dower

^ wuss!

Richard Dower

look what happened!...BIG ratings drop:

http://tvbythenumbers.com/2010/10/06/tv-ratings-tuesday-glee-no-ordinary-family-detroit-187-others-drop-the-good-wife-steady/66905

Handsome Bob

Lol at this episode, there's Kurt allowed to make a convincing argument about atheism and all the religious can come up with in response is "we shouldn't be talking about this!" Talk about a back hand.

Lol, and it happens again, Sue serves the ginger teacher on the same issue.

phasers

This episode is BS so far, why is nobody respecting Kurt's beliefs?

His fcuking dad is in the hospital, why can't they just be there for him rather than try and shove their beliefs down his throat?

Basq

I've been at funeral's that are more entertaining than this..! :rolleyes:






















... it was the funeral of an actual circus clown, but that's besides the point!

beanyb

phasers wrote: »

His fcuking dad is in the hospital, why can't they just be there for him rather than try and shove their beliefs down his throat?

Because they're as*holes.

Handsome Bob

phasers wrote: »

This episode is BS so far, why is nobody respecting Kurt's beliefs?

His fcuking dad is in the hospital, why can't they just be there for him rather than try and shove their beliefs down his throat?

I think that's the point though, it's a very anti religious episode IMO.

phasers

LZ5by5 wrote: »

I think that's the point though, it's a very anti religious episode IMO.

But the show is meant to be entertaining as well, I shouldn't want to punch almost every character!


Woah, that where did they find all these miniature Kurt lookalikes?

panda100

As an atheist this episode is making me mad. I would have punched all my 'friends' in the face If they acted that way If my father was on his death bed. Their just stuffing their beliefs down his throat and he's being made out to be a detached, emotionless person.
Ugh!

Edit: No Mercedes life is actually easier to face when you don't believe in a magic guy in The Sky. You start actually living your life, as you know its the only one you have, rather than living by some impossible,horrible guidelines from a made up book.

Basq

panda100,

This is for discussion of the episode. I'd appreciate if we could leave the criticism and specific discussion of religion beliefs to a minimum.

I know it's difficult given the context of the episode, but do try.

Thanks.

didntgotoplan

Liked:
The mini Kurt, seriously that guy looked like a younger brother.
Sue and her sister, and Sue's reason for not believing in God.
Kurt's dad was back.
Puck, Mercedes, Quinn and Tina all had bigger parts.
Last song was good.

Average:
All the songs. Didn't enjoy any of them, even though Kurt's I want to hold your hand was lovely and the beginning of Rachel's Papa can you hear me was a nice scene.


Disliked:
Can't think of anything in general. Just bored watching it.

I don't know but Glee's is after losing it's spark for me. It was great during the first season but it's just not as exciting anymore. Hope the next 2 episodes are better, or I'll think about watching it.

Cathmandooo

Mini Kurt was a ridiculously great lookalike!

I was also glad the ones who took a back seat during the Britney episode got solos this week, and Rachel didn't have the last song :D yay!

I didn't like Mercedes version of Bridge over Troubled Water, it just sounded like any old song that she sings, I absolutely love the song but not jazzed up like that.

Rachel's papa can you hear me just kept reminding me of Austin Powers Goldmember

JP Liz V1

Spot on casting

paddyismaddy

why didnt finn pray for kurt's old man if he cares so much about him

finn wasnt thinking of his postman this time around when he was touching rachel up

sue and brittany were the best parts of the episode

mini kurt was identical to the real fella

neveah

I liked this episode. It made me laugh and cry (ok I didn't cry but I was a little teary - 'I want to hold your hand' was very well done)

I really liked:
the one liners from Sue - 'they can go to Holy Mary Mother of God school on Jesus Christ Street' (ok not an exact quote:p)
Brittney - giving Kurt her report on heart attacks so he could give it to the doctors
Kurt - his 'Jesus chic' fashion comment :pac:
Rachel talking about when she's 25 and she's won loads of Tonys that she'll be ready to have sex with Finn and have babies

The only song I didn't like was the one Puck sang at the start, other than that I enjoyed the other songs, my favourite being Kurt's solo.

One thing I loved about this episode is how they portrayed Kurt's relationship with his dad. So often tv shows focus on the struggle between gay sons and their fathers, I thought it was refreshing that Glee have went for a different angle, you just knew how important they were to each other no matter what. I really liked that.

I'm not a particularly religious person but I didn't mind the religious theme, I thought they had it well balanced - people who believed, people who didn't believe, people who changed their minds. They tried to cover all angles which I thought was fine. I don't know why people are giving out about Mercedes, I thought she was a wonderful friend to Kurt and she tried to support him. I didn't feel like she was shoving her beliefs down his throat at all.

JP Liz V1

paddyismaddy wrote: »

why didnt finn pray for kurt's old man if he cares so much about him

Yes that didnt make any sense and seemed out of character for Finn as he was angry and upset of being told late about Burt who was like a father to him yet he never prayed to the grilled cheesus for his recovery

Chinafoot

What a disgusting episode. I'm actually angry.

The message from Mercedes was just...disgusting. This episode wasn't anti-religious in any sense. It was very pro-religious from my point of view. Mercedes telling Kurt he's closing himself off from all these wonderful experiences...and I'm sorry but her "you've got to believe in something.." speech?? Yeah, goodness forbid we believe in science, logic and reason.

Even the character of Sue, the villian of the piece is the only one making the argument against religion in schools, and yet when it comes down to it, the only reason she doesn't believe is because of the cruelty her sister endured. And then at the end, when they're singing One of Us, its as though she has somewhat changed her mind.

I have taken to skipping Rachel's solos. Sue has become too soft. Bieste is the only decent character in it at the moment. Can't help but feel the writers/producers are just pandering now. Stop trying to send a message, stop trying to make a point. Just make entertaining and watchable tv.

All in all a big meh.

tinkerbell

Richard Dower wrote: »

I hated every song!

Is it bad that I fast-forwarded through every song?



Particularly any of the big warblers that Rachel sings by herself - I hate the stupid facial expressions she makes when she sings.

I am sick of Will. Love Emma and Sue and the new football coach!

But other than that, the episode was pathetic, really did not like it.

Dilynnio

Outstanding episode with amazing performances.

What a talented group of misfits.

By far my favorite episode yet.

Kurt is a great actor and singer.

All of them are in fact amazing.

Real thought provoking message.........

Dilynnio

neveah wrote: »

I liked this episode. It made me laugh and cry (ok I didn't cry but I was a little teary - 'I want to hold your hand' was very well done)

I really liked:
the one liners from Sue - 'they can go to Holy Mary Mother of God school on Jesus Christ Street' (ok not an exact quote:p)
Brittney - giving Kurt her report on heart attacks so he could give it to the doctors
Kurt - his 'Jesus chic' fashion comment :pac:
Rachel talking about when she's 25 and she's won loads of Tonys that she'll be ready to have sex with Finn and have babies

The only song I didn't like was the one Puck sang at the start, other than that I enjoyed the other songs, my favourite being Kurt's solo.

One thing I loved about this episode is how they portrayed Kurt's relationship with his dad. So often tv shows focus on the struggle between gay sons and their fathers, I thought it was refreshing that Glee have went for a different angle, you just knew how important they were to each other no matter what. I really liked that.

I'm not a particularly religious person but I didn't mind the religious theme, I thought they had it well balanced - people who believed, people who didn't believe, people who changed their minds. They tried to cover all angles which I thought was fine. I don't know why people are giving out about Mercedes, I thought she was a wonderful friend to Kurt and she tried to support him. I didn't feel like she was shoving her beliefs down his throat at all.

I agree with every word you said!

Glad you enjoyed it.

Chuchoter

Well that was an offensive ****ing episode.
I'm a cold hearted narrow minded fool because I'm an atheist? Well thanks Glee.
I also can't believe they went and PRAYED for Kurt's dad when he specifically told them not to. I would slap someone if they did that to me. Have an episode about religion, fine, don't make it a forum for bashing atheists with sugar coated nonsense like 'You have to believe in something Kurt!"

Syferus

I'm very ambivilent when it comes to religion and indeed athethism - which if we're looking at the whole picture, can at times mimic the rigidness of thought the same people rail against in any given religion - and I feel it's difficult to be too harsh on the creative team when it ocmes to this episode. Whatever you believe or don't believe it's part of who you are and the same is true of the characters in the show- the easier thing to do would be to have ambigious blob of space in the characters' identities where their beliefs on this subject should be, and not risk offending anyone.

'Big-issue' shows thread such a thin tight-rope that it's evitable someone is going to be deeply offended on some level. But in a world where US network television is full of taboos Glee did tackle one of the big dividers.

To be clear, this episode had no 'victor' and no message beyond tolerance. Kurt's lack of faith and reasoning if anything is put across more strongly than anyone else's - he's not a Bible basher by the end of the episode, but he has learnt that people praying for his father is more symbolic of trying to find a way to help in a helpless situation; Kurt does this too in his own way by arranging acupuncture sessions for his father. They all want to do something.

The others likewise realise that dealing with their emotions as they did, going to Kurt's father's bedside and sing/praying, was perhaps not the most respectful way of behaving, but their hearts were in the right place. The show isn't subservient to any ideal - the title of the episode comes from a main character prating to a grilled imprint of a face, for God's sake.

Another facet is when Kurt grasps that the prayers are for 'my father' and not him - it's very important thematically to the episode that we don't know Burt's faith or indeed what he would want in this situation, so all parties are as helpless as each other.

I think on a technical episode the show had a few problems, mostly the songs (most of which did play quite well in their scenes) but even then I do appreciate that you can't have an episode like this and start pumping out dance numbers. The songs are hostages to the storyline at times and the reverse can be true in other episodes - the immediately preceeding episode being a perfect example of that. Over the course of a 22 episode season the only way to make it work is to do both or else the fun in the types of songs most like will become rote.

I don't envy them making this episode, it's neither an original topic or one that will prove popular with big swathes of viewers, but it does tell us something about a facet of the characters that was unseen until now. The most affecting scene of the show for me was Sue talking about her sister, and it fit perfectly in with her behaviour up to that point. I think that scene encapsulated why this episode had to be made.

Richard Dower

^ with all due respect, i watch Glee to be ENTERTAINED...not preached to, be it pro or against. This ep. was by far the least entertaining ep. ever.

Syferus

Richard Dower wrote: »

^ with all due respect, i watch Glee to be ENTERTAINED...not preached to, be it pro or against. This ep. was by far the least entertaining ep. ever.

Again, it wasn't preaching anything - it just addressed a few characters' differing faiths in the context of Kurt's father bieng seriously ill.

'Entertaining' is a strange word at the best of times, belying the idea that to be good something needs to be enjoyable in a light-hearted way. Those words don't feel particularly appropriate when taking about a show whose main storyline is the potential death of someone. It was compelling at times and funny at others. It wasn't the best epsiode by any means, but it's been unfairly charactertized here.

It's mostly subjective, however. Just because you didn't like it doesn't make it factually horrible; just because I liked it more doesn't mean it's factually great.

Beyond that, there's not much else for me to say on it.

Agent Smith

Anyone else wanted to see more of the Grilled Cheesus?

Richard Dower

If they had focused on that aspect of the show, Finn and the grilled chessus it would have been funny!

Handsome Bob

Chinafoot wrote: »

What a disgusting episode. I'm actually angry.

The message from Mercedes was just...disgusting. This episode wasn't anti-religious in any sense. It was very pro-religious from my point of view. Mercedes telling Kurt he's closing himself off from all these wonderful experiences...and I'm sorry but her "you've got to believe in something.." speech?? Yeah, goodness forbid we believe in science, logic and reason.

Even the character of Sue, the villian of the piece is the only one making the argument against religion in schools, and yet when it comes down to it, the only reason she doesn't believe is because of the cruelty her sister endured. And then at the end, when they're singing One of Us, its as though she has somewhat changed her mind.

I have taken to skipping Rachel's solos. Sue has become too soft. Bieste is the only decent character in it at the moment. Can't help but feel the writers/producers are just pandering now. Stop trying to send a message, stop trying to make a point. Just make entertaining and watchable tv.

All in all a big meh.

Personally I thought it portrayed religious people as either deluded, ignorant or stupid. I mean you have

• Finn and his delusions about his grilled sandwich.
• Mercedes not being very respectful of Kurt's beliefs.
• Kurt and Sue making somewhat sound arguments while the religious have no decent response to them.
• Quin and her weak response of "we shouldn't be talking about this" to Kurt's view on religion, as well as Marcedes' lame argument of "you can't prove anything either!"
• Sue serving your one who has a thing for Will, and all she can say in response is (meekly) "well just keep it to yourself."

To back this up, the show has come under criticism from the religious before due to Quin's pregnancy storyline apparently portraying religious people as hypocrites. So I wouldn't be surprised at all if this episode was a further dig at the religious.

Chinafoot

Syferus wrote: »

To be clear, this episode had no 'victor' and no message beyond tolerance. Kurt's lack of faith and reasoning if anything is put across more strongly than anyone else's - he's not a Bible basher by the end of the episode, but he has learnt that people praying for his father is more symbolic of trying to find a way to help in a helpless situation; Kurt does this too in his own way by arranging acupuncture sessions for his father. They all want to do something.

Completely and utterly disagree. Religion, and specifically God, was most definitely the "victor" here. The episode ended with them all defying the no religion in public schools argument, clad in white and singing a song about how "God is good and God is great."

Next week needs to seriously pick up otherwise I'll be switching off.

Chinafoot

LZ5by5 wrote: »

Personally I thought it portrayed religious people as either deluded, ignorant or stupid. I mean you have

• Finn and his delusions about his grilled sandwich.
• Mercedes not being very respectful of Kurt's beliefs.
• Kurt and Sue making somewhat sound arguments while the religious have no decent response to them.
• Quin and her weak response of "we shouldn't be talking about this" to Kurt's view on religion, as well as Marcedes' lame argument of "you can't prove anything either!"
• Sue serving your one who has a thing for Will, and all she can say in response is (meekly) "well just keep it to yourself."

To back this up, the show has come under criticism from the religious before due to Quin's pregnancy storyline apparently portraying religious people as hypocrites. So I wouldn't be surprised at all if this episode was a further dig at the religious.

I don't think so. If it was a criticism of the religious then it is a resigned, this is how it is, criticism. Ultimately religion won out, but thats just how I saw it.

candy-gal1

So didnt want kurts dad to die. i liked that eps tbh, it was more real than usual but still had its usual charm.

Burning Eclipse

Very disappointed. If the next episode isn't a proper improvement, I'll stop watching. I was so pleasantly surprised by the first few episodes of this show. It was funny, sharp, had some great musical performances and Sue! Then the pandering started in the second half of the first season. It became about the message it could communicate. The producers realised the huge audience they had and got preachy.

Last night was the final straw, it's just getting worse by the week.

unreggd

Such a biased episode, Mercede's takin the cake with her "You gotta believe in something" speech

As was mentioned, what's so wrong with believing in science, logic and independent thinking?

and yes, they all wanted to do something for his Dad, but doin the religious songs after Kurt said he didnt want it was a bit oversteppin

Also didnt understand Sue's change of mind. I thought she prayed because people were mean to her sister (could happen for a number of reasons), not because he allegedly made a mistake by making her have DS

Im still sick of all this Kurt / Burt drama

The initial tension was there, and that was resolved, but it keeps comin back time after time

I'd rather they expand a bit more on the lives of the supporting roles

Now I want a grilled sangich :P

FreudianSlippers

Thought this episode was very well done. It was a total Nip/Tuck-esque episode too which I found very good as Nip/Tuck was one of my favourite shows.