Crows, Greys,Magpies and Jackdaws etc

Tackleberrywho

This Mornings Indo

Sparks

From the Indo website:

New laws give farmers green light to blast birds from sky
By Paul Melia
Friday September 24 2010

IT'S WAR: birds including crows, magpies and rooks had better watch out after laws were passed to allow hunters to blast them from the sky.

Environment Minister John Gormely has approved new rules allowing farmers and airport authorities to trap or shoot more than a dozen bird species that are causing damage to crops and interfering with aviation.

And among the common species earmarked for sharp-shooters are the crow, magpie, wood pigeon and feral pigeon which are responsible for causing damage to crops.

Other species including the black-headed gull, rook, jackdaw and lapwing will also be targeted because of the danger they pose to aircraft when they flock near airports.

Director of the National Parks and Wildlife Service (NPWS), Ciaran O'Keeffe, said that while all bird species were protected under EU law, farmers and airport authorities were allowed to cull birds which posed a threat.

"There's a derogation allowing for control of certain purposes," he said. "Some of them, like the grey crow, would be perceived as a vermin problem in farming areas where they can attack lambs or lambing sheep. Magpies go after certain birds and eggs. The rook can do substantial damage to crops like barley or wheat. The pigeon will also target crops.

"Where you've airports you don't want big flocks of birds. There's a lot of work done in airports to make them less favourable and it some cases they let the grass grow longer so it's not attractive to sit on, and make sure not to have food stores nearby."

Mr O'Keeffe said that shooting the vermin was allowed all year round, but that the Department of the Environment was obliged to publish public notices setting out what species could be culled.

He added that only shooting or trapping was allowed, as use of any poison is illegal.

"We publish this three times a year. It's all year round. They can be shot as long as they're posing a threat. You can't just go and shoot pigeons because you feel like it. They have to pose a threat. They are regarded as a pest. All of these species are very common and there's no need to apply particular protection."

The department also allows muntjac deer, fox and mink to be culled.

Must be a slow news day...

bunny shooter

I thought poison could still be used but not on meat

Wait for the backlash from the loonies

Tackleberrywho

Sparks wrote: »

From the Indo website:

Must be a slow news day...

You bet me to it Sparks!
Internet acting up on me the past 24 hours

In regards to news, i reckon it's an old story.
that has been the case for a long time now, however it is always good when Joe Public can read it.

So when Joe Public sees me out shooting crows that are eating from the feed troughs I am not considered to be breaking any laws

kildare.17hmr

am i missing something? Has this not always been the case?

EDIT: read tacs post, wasnt missing anything!

johngalway

bunny shooter wrote: »

I thought poison could still be used but not on meat

Wait for the backlash from the loonies

Same as that, cereal based OK, meat based a no-no. Wonder when or if that changed?

Feargal as Luimneach

All those birds are not common: Lapwings are now very rare as a breeding bird (red listed) and Black headed gull are amber listed.

Tackleberrywho

Feargal as Luimneach wrote: »

All those birds are not common: Lapwings are now very rare as a breeding bird (red listed) and Black headed gull are amber listed.

If you lived where i lived you would have a pain in your neck with greys, maggers and crows.

The Gulls and Lapwings are for near airports only seemingly, not many Gulls in the Midlands.
With Forresty Pidgies are increasing as they love to nest in conifers and then dive bomb onto grain yards and the like.

So Some of those birds are common, and others are only to be controlled around airports!
It's a derogation for farmers and Airports,, not a carte blanche

Birdnuts

Headlines like "New laws give farmers green light to blast birds from sky" are highly irresponsible and frankly dangerous since many people merely glance at these headlines:mad:.

I've no problem with farmers shooting or trapping species on the vermin list but it should be made clearer that species such as Lapwing and BH gull whose populations are already in steep decline can only be controlled under licence at airports.

Birdnuts

johngalway wrote: »

Same as that, cereal based OK, meat based a no-no. Wonder when or if that changed?

All uncovered poison baits should be banned - cereal based baits are just as likely to kill gamebirds as they are rooks:(

kildare.17hmr

Birdnuts wrote: »

Headlines like "New laws give farmers green light to blast birds from sky" are highly irresponsible and frankly dangerous since many people merely glance at these headlines:mad:.

I've no problem with farmers shooting or trapping species on the vermin list but it should be made clearer that species such as Lapwing and BH gull whose populations are already in steep decline can only be controlled under licence at airports.

its the irresponsible and dangerous headlines that sell the papers though:mad: reckon the only way to change it is to pool together and buy the newspaper! make it a pro paper:D

Tackleberrywho

Birdnuts wrote: »

Headlines like "New laws give farmers green light to blast birds from sky" are highly irresponsible and frankly dangerous since many people merely glance at these headlines:mad:.

I've no problem with farmers shooting or trapping species on the vermin list but it should be made clearer that species such as Lapwing and BH gull whose populations are already in steep decline can only be controlled under licence at airports.

Well send a letter to the Editor, as Hunters know the score.
It's the Indo that has it wrong, as usual. Several stories that I am very close to have been reported grossly wrong recently and not even new.

Them derogations are out Months.
No hunters shoot Gulls yet the paper makes it look like they do!

However, there is a serious magpie issue where I live, and trapping and shooting is not working as there are so few at it.
I'm the only one in a very large area around me that does any serious volume of vermin control.

The Gunclub guys only seem to be interested in Phezzies on teh 1st and around Christmas.
I could not even count the amount of rabbits i have culled and the farm land has improved as a result, and still healthy populations of bunnies,

the print media love shocking words. why could they have just published the derogation and state facts only??
because that would be too boring!

Birdnuts

kildare.17hmr wrote: »

its the irresponsible and dangerous headlines that sell the papers though:mad: reckon the only way to change it is to pool together and buy the newspaper! make it a pro paper:D

If I fully shared my views on O'Reilly's rag-sheet here, I would probably be banned for using "unparliamentary" language;)

Birdnuts

Tackleberrywho wrote: »

Well send a letter to the Editor, as Hunters know the score.
It's the Indo that has it wrong, as usual. Several stories that I am very close to have been reported grossly wrong recently and not even new.

Them derogations are out Months.
No hunters shoot Gulls yet the paper makes it look like they do!

However, there is a serious magpie issue where I live, and trapping and shooting is not working as there are so few at it.
I'm the only one in a very large area around me that does any serious volume of vermin control.

The Gunclub guys only seem to be interested in Phezzies on teh 1st and around Christmas.
I could not even count the amount of rabbits i have culled and the farm land has improved as a result, and still healthy populations of bunnies,

the print media love shocking words. why could they have just published the derogation and state facts only??
because that would be too boring!

I totally agree - the standard of journalism in this country is atrocious when it comes to a whole hoist of issues. Indeed I blame the media as much as the politicians, bankers, regulators etc. for leading this country to the brink of the abyss through years of mis-information and half-truths:(

Tackleberrywho

Birdnuts wrote: »

I totally agree - the standard of journalism in this country is atrocious when it comes to a whole hoist of issues. Indeed I blame the media as much as the politicians, bankers, regulators etc. for leading this country to the brink of the abyss through years of mis-information and half-truths:(

If the Media say the place is fcuked then the world believes them, the media are very dangerous here. they don't seem to realize by spreading misinformation they can cause ripple effects beyond belief.

can you imagine if some young lad read that article and thought it was his duty to shoot Gulls on mass, even though he was nowhere near an airport.

The Media want to cop themselves on. Negative media benefits nobody.

bunny shooter

Tackleberrywho wrote: »

.........Negative media benefits nobody.

A very naive comment :eek:

terminator2

Birdnuts wrote: »

If I fully shared my views on O'Reilly's rag-sheet here, I would probably be banned for using "unparliamentary" language;)

i got a slap on the back of the hand recently for using unsavory language about animal rights actavists......seems they can do what they like while we sit here and do nothing

Sparks

You got a slap on the back of the hand for breaking the forum charter terminator (and it was a wee bit more than merely unsavoury). That charter applies to all; we've infracted, edited, deleted posts and banned posters who were anti-hunting more times than I can count, not because they were anti-hunting, but because they broke the forum charter, usually the first rule. Anti-, pro-, custard-, doesn't matter. The charter's as universal as we can make it.

Feargal as Luimneach

terminator2 wrote: »

i got a slap on the back of the hand recently for using unsavory language about animal rights actavists......seems they can do what they like while we sit here and do nothing

What did you say?

<mod note> Stop stirring Fergal, good man. There is a PM system available for gossip. </mod note>

Sparks

Feargal as Luimneach wrote: »

What did you say?

FaL, if it was deleted the first time, why would it be okay to post it the second time?

johngalway

Birdnuts wrote: »

All uncovered poison baits should be banned - cereal based baits are just as likely to kill gamebirds as they are rooks:(

The use or not of poisoned bait wasn't the point of my post. My thoughts on that subject are well covered in previous posts, of some length.

My point was questioning whether the law had been changed or not, not the ethical views on it, as I had not heard anything on it. To the best of my knowledge cereal bait OK, meat bait not, from a legal perspective purely.

I'd rather believe something official than something in a newspaper report.

Birdnuts

johngalway wrote: »

I'd rather believe something official than something in a newspaper report.

Totally agree - AFAIK legislation is being drafted on the subject and will be introduced shortly outlawing all uncovered baits to bring Irish law into line with other EU countries:)

Feargal as Luimneach

Birdnuts wrote: »

Totally agree - AFAIK legislation is being drafted on the subject and will be introduced shortly outlawing all uncovered baits to bring Irish law into line with other EU countries:)

Excellent news:) Hopefully the goverment will last long enough in order to bring it in.

Birdnuts

Feargal as Luimneach wrote: »

Excellent news:) Hopefully the goverment will last long enough in order to bring it in.

Should have been done in the first year if the GP was the real deal:(

Feargal as Luimneach

Birdnuts wrote: »

Should have been done in the first year if the GP was the real deal:(

No excuse for not bringing it in:mad:

Birdnuts

Feargal as Luimneach wrote: »

No excuse for not bringing it in:mad:

They were too busy banning a stag hunt:rolleyes:

Tackleberrywho

Birdnuts wrote: »

They were too busy banning a stag hunt:rolleyes:

ICABS are presenting him with the Lifetime achievement award soon.
Good to know where his allegiances lies

Birdnuts

Tackleberrywho wrote: »

ICABS are presenting him with the Lifetime achievement award soon.
Good to know where his allegiances lies

That would suggest the Teletubbies have shaped Gormley's view of nature ie. pet rabbits and plastic flowers etc.:rolleyes:

weldersmask

i am at a complete loss here to know what teletubbies have to do with things, if ICABS are giving mr gormley a lifetime achievement award and he chooses to accept it then it does indicate where his loyalties lie i would have thought

Tackleberrywho

weldersmask wrote: »

i am at a complete loss here to know what teletubbies have to do with things, if ICABS are giving mr gormley a lifetime achievement award and he chooses to accept it then it does indicate where his loyalties lie i would have thought

Well if he refuses to accept it that would also send a statement out

Birdnuts

weldersmask wrote: »

i am at a complete loss here to know what teletubbies have to do with things,

I was attempting to illustrate both his and ICABS simplistic/childish view of nature ie. fluffy animals, vegetarian planet where no animal dies, no concept of food chains/basic ecology etc.

No6

weldersmask wrote: »

i am at a complete loss here to know what teletubbies have to do with things, if ICABS are giving mr gormley a lifetime achievement award and he chooses to accept it then it does indicate where his loyalties lie i would have thought

Did they not grow leave home go to college and become the green party??:D

anmaorbeag

The last few lines of the article is where the new news is at. If you look at the current notices in the paper the part about laying poison for grey crows and mags has been removed entirely (meat and non meat based baits) since the last notice was published. perhaps somebody more computer literate could post a link to the current Declarations? There is something on poisons in the new Birds and Habitats Regs that are currently being drafted

Also 'he added that only shooting or trapping was allowed as use of ANY poison is illegal'. This is a Dept of Ag rule stating that there are NO poisons currently on the Register for use against corvids or foxes. Maybe somebody here could ask the relevant section of Ag if thats the case to verify?

There is also a reminder in the last few lines that you can't go out shooting pigeons when you feel like it that it has to be for crop protection (relevant from now til Nov1st?) and to finish off, to show that the Minister is a very reasonable chap and not out to destroy the countryside, its spelt out that you can shoot foxes and muntjac to your hearts content.

So apart from the usual Indo crap to max a headline there is something of relevance to hunters in this Press Release than at first seems?

Birdnuts

anmaorbeag wrote: »

The last few lines of the article is where the new news is at. If you look at the current notices in the paper the part about laying poison for grey crows and mags has been removed entirely (meat and non meat based baits) since the last notice was published. perhaps somebody more computer literate could post a link to the current Declarations? There is something on poisons in the new Birds and Habitats Regs that are currently being drafted

Also 'he added that only shooting or trapping was allowed as use of ANY poison is illegal'. This is a Dept of Ag rule stating that there are NO poisons currently on the Register for use against corvids or foxes. Maybe somebody here could ask the relevant section of Ag if thats the case to verify?

There is also a reminder in the last few lines that you can't go out shooting pigeons when you feel like it that it has to be for crop protection (relevant from now til Nov1st?) and to finish off, to show that the Minister is a very reasonable chap and not out to destroy the countryside, its spelt out that you can shoot foxes and muntjac to your hearts content.

So apart from the usual Indo crap to max a headline there is something of relevance to hunters in this Press Release than at first seems?

AFAIK all meat based poisons for birds have already been banned - all other types of uncovered poison bait have eitheir been banned or will be shortly(to protect non-target species like game birds, finches etc.). A most welcome and long overdue development:)