Question?

themonboys

When does the slow lane become the overtaking lane and vice versa???

Outkast_IRE

As far as i am aware there isnt actually a Slow lane , and right hand lane is always the overtaking lane , unless your coming to a junction , roundabout etc.
But in people use it as the "Fast Lane".
And yes i know The council has written slow lane on some roads , but thats not right a bad mistake really.
In a real sense though its up to yourself to use it appropriately.

themonboys

A Mod moved this so won't make much sense to people in here. The answer was on days Cork play in Dublin. For some strange reason almost all ( and I'm not exaggerating when I say that) the Cork fans traveling home today along the M8/7 got into the overtaking lane and just stayed there for the entire trip, regardless of whether the slow lane was empty or not.

I think myself it happens because a large chunk of GAA fans are from the countryside and they rarely drive on motorways so thus are unaware of the rules of the motorway, but that's just my opinion.

themonboys

Outkast_IRE wrote: »

As far as i am aware there isnt actually a Slow lane , and right hand lane is always the overtaking lane , unless your coming to a junction , roundabout etc.
But in people use it as the "Fast Lane".
And yes i know The council has written slow lane on some roads , but thats not right a bad mistake really.
In a real sense though its up to yourself to use it appropriately.

If it's not called the slow lane, what is it called?

Alanstrainor

themonboys wrote: »

If it's not called the slow lane, what is it called?

The driving lane.

The stay left rule applies, stay in the left most lane of the carriageway if you're not overtaking.

MascotDec85

You can overtake whilst driving in the "slow lane" if something is turning right in the "fast lane" or if there is queuing traffic in that lane also.

sham2

themonboys wrote: »

A Mod moved this so won't make much sense to people in here. The answer was on days Cork play in Dublin. For some strange reason almost all ( and I'm not exaggerating when I say that) the Cork fans traveling home today along the M8/7 got into the overtaking lane and just stayed there for the entire trip, regardless of whether the slow lane was empty or not.

I think myself it happens because a large chunk of GAA fans are from the countryside and they rarely drive on motorways so thus are unaware of the rules of the motorway, but that's just my opinion.

Ironically for a lot a of it the 'slow' lane was actually faster than the 'fast' lane for long stretches because everybody was in the right hand lane. There was hardly anybody in the left lane. It made for some dangerous driving as people pulled in from the right lane to the left to get ahead. Also a lot of idiots were pulling in way too close to me from the right lane to left. It's an Irish affliction called left-lane-itis. We're allergic to it. If the speed limit was 200kmh it would still be too slow for some. Rant over. Still made it home in 2hr 30m which ain't bad.

themonboys

sham2 wrote: »

Ironically for a lot a of it the 'slow' lane was actually faster than the 'fast' lane for long stretches because everybody was in the right hand lane. There was hardly anybody in the left lane. It made for some dangerous driving as people pulled in from the right lane to the left to get ahead. Also a lot of idiots were pulling in way too close to me from the right lane to left. It's an Irish affliction called left-lane-itis. We're allergic to it. If the speed limit was 200kmh it would still be too slow for some. Rant over. Still made it home in 2hr 30m which ain't bad.

Spot on. I stuck to the rules of the road, doing the speed limit I stayed in the driving lane until I came up behind a slower mover car, then I would pull into the overtaking lane to pass. Once passed I slipped back into the driving lane to let faster cars pass me.

There were times when I was doing 120kph in the driving lane and the overtaking lane was doing something like 90-100 kph. Legally I'm not sure where I stand as it was technically undertaking

daveharnett

themonboys wrote: »

There were times when I was doing 120kph in the driving lane and the overtaking lane was doing something like 90-100 kph. Legally I'm not sure where I stand as it was technically undertaking

Don't be under any illusions, overtaking on the left in those circumstances is against the law. The motors forum goes around in circles ad nauseum about the rights and wrongs of it, but the road traffic act is quite clear about it.

themonboys

daveharnett wrote: »

Don't be under any illusions, overtaking on the left in those circumstances is against the law. The motors forum goes around in circles ad nauseum about the rights and wrongs of it, but the road traffic act is quite clear about it.

Thanks Dave. What happens in the situation where I'm doing 120kph in the left lane and the overtaking lane is doing, say 125kph, and something happens in the overtaking lane that makes them slow their speed, do I have to also slow to the overtaking lane speed too to avoid undertaking?

MascotDec85

themonboys wrote: »

Thanks Dave. What happens in the situation where I'm doing 120kph in the left lane and the overtaking lane is doing, say 125kph, and something happens in the overtaking lane that makes them slow their speed, do I have to also slow to the overtaking lane speed too to avoid undertaking?

No, in that instance carry on but be prepared to brake in case something in the overtaking lane moves into your lane to avoid a hazard

Alanstrainor

themonboys wrote: »

Thanks Dave. What happens in the situation where I'm doing 120kph in the left lane and the overtaking lane is doing, say 125kph, and something happens in the overtaking lane that makes them slow their speed, do I have to also slow to the overtaking lane speed too to avoid undertaking?

The people driving in the overtaking lane for no real reason would be in the wrong in that case. You altering your speed would only serve to put yourself and those behind you at risk, as said, continue on be wary of those on your right.

loobylou

MascotDec85 wrote: »

No, in that instance carry on but be prepared to brake in case something in the overtaking lane moves into your lane to avoid a hazard

Can't agree with this advice.
You should not be overtaking on the left at 120kph, especially given the example here where there is a problem/hazard in the overtaking lane.
You are simply asking for trouble.

Reloc8

Alanstrainor wrote: »

The people driving in the overtaking lane for no real reason would be in the wrong in that case. You altering your speed would only serve to put yourself and those behind you at risk, as said, continue on be wary of those on your right.

Hi Alan,

I wouldn't agree - he should reduce speed so as not to be in the position of undertaking the right hand side traffic. I say that from a legal point of view (an awful lot of careless driving summons' are brought for overtaking on the left - AGS and the courts take a pretty dim view of it) and a practical point of view: -

- 'something happening' in the right hand lane causing a reduction of speed, at these speeds especially, should be treated as a potential hazard by someone in a lane adjoining meriting a reduction in speed in itself, and

- driver in the right hand lane may move to left hand lane to avoid the 'something happening'. Yes they should check blind-spot however a car in the left lane moving at over-taking speed distinctly increases the possibility of an accident. The car in the left lane is simply 'not supposed' to be doing this and at motorway speeds the car in the right lane may be forced to change position more abruptly to avoid the hazard in its lane.

I accept the proposition in respect of the latter point that traffic already in a lane has right of way however I can say with certainty that a court resolving civil liability will not rest on this point if it is proven (i.e. accepted by the court) that the car in the left lane was moving at an over-taking speed. Equally, in a criminal case, many judges will accept that over-taking on the left is in and of itself careless driving (sometimes dangerous depending on circumstances).

I'd also say from the point of view of driving defensively, you want not to hover in people's blind spots at those speeds especially where you are 'not expected/supposed' to be there. Over-taking on the left on a motorway will usually leave you in the blind spot for far too long.

I also accept that the traffic in the right hand line should not be there unless it is over-taking, and that this poor driving is where the problem often starts.

To the OP an overtaking maneuver done in the left hand line is acceptable according to the rules of the road if traffic in your line is signalling to turn right and you change lanes to proceed (note you do not have right of way and must change lanes safely - mirrors & blindspot etc.), or if you are in the left hand lane and traffic in the right hand lane is moving slowly/queuing etc.,

The Rules of the Road state you can also do so when signalling to turn left - that's only going to be relevant most likely however when the second situation (slow moving traffic in right hand lane) applies.

MascotDec85

loobylou wrote: »

Can't agree with this advice.
You should not be overtaking on the left at 120kph, especially given the example here where there is a problem/hazard in the overtaking lane.
You are simply asking for trouble.

Sorry, what you you propose should be done?

If there is a problem which is affecting the outside lane only and traffic stops should the inside lane stop too? No is the answer to that question. You would simply carry on, probably adjusting your speed slightly and being prepared for someone possibly pulling into your lane. You want to keep traffic flowing as much as possible

Remember, in the instance discussed here the car in the inside or "slow" lane has right of way and the onus is on the other cars to move over when it is safe to do so.

loobylou

What I propose should be done is the traffic on the inside lane eases off speed so that it is moving slower than the overtaking lane.
What you propose is illegal.

MascotDec85

loobylou wrote: »

What I propose should be done is the traffic on the inside lane eases off speed so that it is moving slower than the overtaking lane.
What you propose is illegal.

We'll have to disagree.

daveharnett

themonboys wrote: »

Thanks Dave. What happens in the situation where I'm doing 120kph in the left lane and the overtaking lane is doing, say 125kph, and something happens in the overtaking lane that makes them slow their speed, do I have to also slow to the overtaking lane speed too to avoid undertaking?

In my opinion, yes. The purpose of the law requiring us to overtake on the right (and keep the motorway hard shoulders clear) is that in an emergency we can dive to the left in (relative) safety.

I can understand undertaking somebody who is slowing down traffic through ignorance or bloody-mindedness. If on the other hand you can't see the cause of the delay, I say stay put.

Alanstrainor

Reloc8 wrote: »

Hi Alan,

I wouldn't agree - he should reduce speed so as not to be in the position of undertaking the right hand side traffic. I say that from a legal point of view (an awful lot of careless driving summons' are brought for overtaking on the left - AGS and the courts take a pretty dim view of it) and a practical point of view: -

- 'something happening' in the right hand lane causing a reduction of speed, at these speeds especially, should be treated as a potential hazard by someone in a lane adjoining meriting a reduction in speed in itself, and

- driver in the right hand lane may move to left hand lane to avoid the 'something happening'. Yes they should check blind-spot however a car in the left lane moving at over-taking speed distinctly increases the possibility of an accident. The car in the left lane is simply 'not supposed' to be doing this and at motorway speeds the car in the right lane may be forced to change position more abruptly to avoid the hazard in its lane.

I accept the proposition in respect of the latter point that traffic already in a lane has right of way however I can say with certainty that a court resolving civil liability will not rest on this point if it is proven (i.e. accepted by the court) that the car in the left lane was moving at an over-taking speed. Equally, in a criminal case, many judges will accept that over-taking on the left is in and of itself careless driving (sometimes dangerous depending on circumstances).

I'd also say from the point of view of driving defensively, you want not to hover in people's blind spots at those speeds especially where you are 'not expected/supposed' to be there. Over-taking on the left on a motorway will usually leave you in the blind spot for far too long.

I also accept that the traffic in the right hand line should not be there unless it is over-taking, and that this poor driving is where the problem often starts.

To the OP an overtaking maneuver done in the left hand line is acceptable according to the rules of the road if traffic in your line is signalling to turn right and you change lanes to proceed (note you do not have right of way and must change lanes safely - mirrors & blindspot etc.), or if you are in the left hand lane and traffic in the right hand lane is moving slowly/queuing etc.,

The Rules of the Road state you can also do so when signalling to turn left - that's only going to be relevant most likely however when the second situation (slow moving traffic in right hand lane) applies.

The initial post i responded too made no mention of the cause for reduction in speed in the overtaking lane. So the course of action one should take would depend entirely on this. However, if the reason was unknown and there was a sudden dramatic drop in speed by the cars in the overtaking lane, personally, provided there was no danger in my lane, would not brake for the sake of not undertaking. To do so would be downright dangerous imo.

Now as for the speed one should be travelling at in the driving lane, there is absolutely nothing stopping anyone from driving the 120km/h speed limit in the left most lane, provided it is safe to do so. As has already been said, there is no such thing as a slow and fast lane, just driving and overtaking lanes. Provided there is no slower traffic ahead in the driving lane 120km/h is perfectly acceptable.

I never suggested that anyone should stay in the blind spot of a car in any lane for any amount of time. As you said, doing so is just dangerous.