Failed PhD, no idea what to do now

LegacyUser

I started a PhD 3 years ago in the UK, Everyone was insanely proud of me, I was the first in my immediate family to go to university never mind post-grad, first to go to a UK university of all my cousins and such, giant big deal was made of me etc etc. The company I'm with I've been with since I was 20 (29 now) and they were also really happy I wanted to do further research in a particular part of our work and offered me a better role when I return, currently coming back and forth to work there 1 week in 8.

However, I have had The Talk with my supervisor who says my work is no where near good enough for submission in the next 18 months like scheduled, and he's advised me to drop out of the program. I've been struggling hugely anyway, so it's partly a relief, but what the hell can I say to my family, employer and friends? "Sorry, I'm not smart enough?" I feel like I've left everyone down, I've tried so much and never hit the mark, this is a totally different ballgame to my degree and I can't do it. I couldn't even go to work today I was so upset, which is a huge thing for me, only missed work once when hospitalised. I fear anyone who talks to me will see the look on my face when they discuss my PhD and will know I'm a failure.

CiaranMT

doctor failure wrote: »

I started a PhD 3 years ago in the UK, Everyone was insanely proud of me, I was the first in my immediate family to go to university never mind post-grad, first to go to a UK university of all my cousins and such, giant big deal was made of me etc etc. The company I'm with I've been with since I was 20 (29 now) and they were also really happy I wanted to do further research in a particular part of our work and offered me a better role when I return, currently coming back and forth to work there 1 week in 8.

However, I have had The Talk with my supervisor who says my work is no where near good enough for submission in the next 18 months like scheduled, and he's advised me to drop out of the program. I've been struggling hugely anyway, so it's partly a relief, but what the hell can I say to my family, employer and friends? "Sorry, I'm not smart enough?" I feel like I've left everyone down, I've tried so much and never hit the mark, this is a totally different ballgame to my degree and I can't do it. I couldn't even go to work today I was so upset, which is a huge thing for me, only missed work once when hospitalised. I fear anyone who talks to me will see the look on my face when they discuss my PhD and will know I'm a failure.

You're the first in your family to go to university, and you worry they're gonna look down on you because your work for a Ph.D. isn't up to scratch? I'd highly doubt it.

I'd say it'd be a lot better to tell them and use them as a support, rather than hiding it away and keeping it to yourself.

As an undergrad myself, I don't think there's any shame at all in your situation! Like your supervisor said, the work isn't up to scratch NOW. Would you be able to go back to it in future and give it another go?

LegacyUser

I can relate so much to what you say OP, in the same boat myself a few years back. I did a PHD in a very narrow subject area. Halfway through it I suffered from depression and my work was seriously affected. I couldn't motivate myself to concentrate or anything and each submission was significantly worse than the last. Eventually my supervisor, whom I have a lot of respect for, told me straight up that I should really re-evaluate my options. After some time I came to agree with him. Know what I did? I got up, got a qualification to teach english abroad, and spent the next two years teaching and travelling in Indonesia, Papua New Guinea and Peru. I even started writing (admittedly terrible) poetry!

Best decision of my life.

As for dealing with friends and relatives, I'd say the best course would be to tell them straight up that this was a massive relief and that academia wasn't for you. I'm sure your company will understand too, but you may want to 'invent' some personal issues/family trauma in order to make it look well... less 'sloppy'. Either way you are not a 'failure', this kind of thing just isn't for everyone and life is simply too short.

sambuka41

As the previous poster said its only NOW that the work isnt up to it. It sounds like you have a lot of expectations (unintentionally) placed on you by well intentioned family and friends, also that you have put pressure on yourself. A PHD is a HUGE undertaking and trying it at 29 is admirable,I know people who have not felt up to it until they are near 40. You didnt mention what field you were in but maybe more work experience could better prepare you for it??

There is NO SHAME in saying that you are not in the place to do this now. I also agree with the other poster your family could be a very good support through this decision.

LegacyUser

Hi there,
I am really sorry to hear of your situation.
First off that was not on for your supervisor to say that. I mean who knows what you will get done in 18 months. It is a long time!! It was like he was quitting not you.....I mean if this really isn't what you want to do then that is fine, but just be sure because obviously his comments will have knocked your self believe and confidence. I assume you are being funded and your funding runs out in 18months. But I personally know of ALOT of people who continue on with their phd after funding is up. I mean there is no secret recipe for research it takes time, its unpredictable. I know that I could spend months in the lab trying to do something and it not working out but after all those months it can just happen and then it all seems worthwhile. I know of two people doing phd's with out funding, its not the end of the world. Your only half way through it god knows what will happen in the next year and a half.

I really feel for your situation. I am finished my degree, but in my 3rd year the stress got all too much for me I wanted to drop out so badly it made me so unhappy I was depressed, I had literally zero self belief I just felt everyone in the class was so much smarter had everything sussed. The only reason I didn't drop out was because I thought everyone would be so disappointed. The summer of third year I got myself together built up my confidence through a work placement were I was really encouraged. I went back into fourth realised its not a life or death situation relaxed enjoyed and ended up graduating top of my class.

So what you need to realise is your capable person and don't let bossy supervisors dictate your self belief and your life........so sorry for the rambling.......

LegacyUser

doctor failure wrote: »

I started a PhD 3 years ago in the UK, Everyone was insanely proud of me, I was the first in my immediate family to go to university never mind post-grad, first to go to a UK university of all my cousins and such, giant big deal was made of me etc etc. The company I'm with I've been with since I was 20 (29 now) and they were also really happy I wanted to do further research in a particular part of our work and offered me a better role when I return, currently coming back and forth to work there 1 week in 8.

However, I have had The Talk with my supervisor who says my work is no where near good enough for submission in the next 18 months like scheduled, and he's advised me to drop out of the program. I've been struggling hugely anyway, so it's partly a relief, but what the hell can I say to my family, employer and friends? "Sorry, I'm not smart enough?" I feel like I've left everyone down, I've tried so much and never hit the mark, this is a totally different ballgame to my degree and I can't do it. I couldn't even go to work today I was so upset, which is a huge thing for me, only missed work once when hospitalised. I fear anyone who talks to me will see the look on my face when they discuss my PhD and will know I'm a failure.

Hi OP,

Sorry to hear about your trouble. I was in the same position as you some years ago (doing a Ph.D in the UK) while working. My supervisor told me the exact same thing with roughly 14 months left to submit my thesis. I felt the same as you do now,I didn't feel like I was smart enough but in my opinion that is what every Ph.D student feels towards the closing stages of there submission. Some of my friends felt the same way too when they were doing their Ph.D (around the same time) and two out of three of them had supervisors that nearly always gave negative feedback (mine did too 80% of the time).

I graduated with my Ph.D and so did my friends. I am still friends with the two of them and we laugh at the memories of it because in truth we all agreed that it only comes together in the last 8 months (which are the hardest in terms of self motivation and preparation). Right now you are in the " I can't do it" mode and it all seems impossible. If you have been working on the Ph.D while working then I would recommend that you take some time away from it all if you can to "detox" from your schedule. My Ph.D was in computing so when I took this time off I stayed well away from technology because I was beginning to feel burntout from it all.

Seriously, take a break from it all, go away on your own, with mates or your other half... whatever it takes to find that centre of calm that will help you either finish your Ph.D or fully realise that it is just not for you. Most people don't fully appreciate the intensity or workload that doing a Ph.D while working entails and this can all build up to a point where you feel you may need to walk away but by removing yourself for a short time then you will give yourself the opportunity to see things more clearly when you come back to it.... well that was mine and my friends take on it while we were doing ours.

I hope everything works out OP.

Overheal

doctor failure wrote: »

I started a PhD 3 years ago in the UK, Everyone was insanely proud of me, I was the first in my immediate family to go to university never mind post-grad, first to go to a UK university of all my cousins and such, giant big deal was made of me etc etc. The company I'm with I've been with since I was 20 (29 now) and they were also really happy I wanted to do further research in a particular part of our work and offered me a better role when I return, currently coming back and forth to work there 1 week in 8.

However, I have had The Talk with my supervisor who says my work is no where near good enough for submission in the next 18 months like scheduled, and he's advised me to drop out of the program. I've been struggling hugely anyway, so it's partly a relief, but what the hell can I say to my family, employer and friends? "Sorry, I'm not smart enough?" I feel like I've left everyone down, I've tried so much and never hit the mark, this is a totally different ballgame to my degree and I can't do it. I couldn't even go to work today I was so upset, which is a huge thing for me, only missed work once when hospitalised. I fear anyone who talks to me will see the look on my face when they discuss my PhD and will know I'm a failure.

You're overthinking this. A PhD is a huge undertaking, one designed to expand the wealth of human knowledge. If you're not ready at this time to complete the PhD then you're not ready. Thats fine. Or maybe you would be better off shooting for a different PhD in a neighboring field of study. Also fine. But the fact that you're even attempting a PhD just goes to show what kind of massive brains are sitting on your neck. Why the hell would you feel like you aren't smart enough? Don't.

http://gizmodo.com/5613794/what-is-exactly-a-doctorate

dellas1979

2 things:

- Does the subject area/area of research still interest you enough to continue?

-If you asked your supervisor "I 100% want to continue. What do I need to do to fix it"? and he told you, would you continue?

I only finished my MA there and nearly bottled it at the end. I cant imagine the pressure of a PhD, but I know that what youve stated above is not enough to give up, yet anyways. Take time out for a few days and have a serious think.

Kevster

Im doing a PhD now in the UK too, but only 8 months in. However, I can relate to what you've asid. I started a computer science degree in 2000 and dropped-out in the final year due to depression. It was a terribly difficult period of life.

I also believe you ought to be 100% honest to your family about what is happening. Keeping all of this to yourself will surely make your plight worse. Your parents will have good advice for you i'm sure.

In addition, I have heard of people who only got their adequate PhD results in the final few months of their funded-period. You're only half-way through the 3 years, right? Your supervisor's comments must be explored and explained a little more

Kevin

LegacyUser

Is there a possibility to write-up for a masters instead? I know a few people who have been in the same position and have done that. After 3 years you might already have enough for a masters, or if not 18 months should be plenty of time.

In my university we’re also encouraged to do a yearly report, which is read by someone other than your supervisor. Then you have a ‘mini-viva’ with them to discuss the work and how it’s progressing. You might want to consider doing something similar to get a 2nd opinion? (You would obviously need to have your supervisor on board though, not to go behind his/her back!).

JonathanAnon

I dropped out of my BSc course a few years ago... told everyone, was a small bit embarrassing tbh, but I left to take up a job I liked so I wasnt too bad. (eventually went back and got it a few years later)

I think at this moment you should not see this as a fait accompli. Step back And re evaluate how important the PhD is, is it really that important for you to have it.. will it really inhibit you from doing something in the future? Talk to your supervisor again, and ask them what would you need to do to bridge the gap. Try to keep all the doors open and not make a panic decision.

Even if you leave the PhD program, hold your head up high, you have nothing to be ashamed of at all. You are still young, and it will certainly be possible for you to further your education in the future. Try to see it as a work in progress, that has just hit a small bump in the road.. Good luck OP.

fits

All good advice in the thread. It is so so common OP, a huge number of people drop out. I found it extremely difficult to finish mine and wouldnt have finished it without huge support from family and friends as well as my supervisor.

One thing which hasnt been mentioned here is. Can you write up a masters? That way you salvage a qualification and have something to show for your work.

Also as others said, think about what *you* really want. And perhaps get advice from another academic.

best of luck! And really, dont worry about being seen as a failure. You are your own worst critic. Your family and friends just want to see you happy.

Moomoo1

Wow. I don't know what area your PhD is in, but your supervisor does not impress me at all. The fact that you struggled is partly his failing: yes, he cannot do the work for you, but you''d be amazed how much the guidance of a good supervisor helps to pull you up compared to one who doesn't care, or isn't careful enough to come down from the clouds to your level. And to suggest that it's over with only 3 years gone (most funding packages for PhD's are 3.5 years) is downright bizarre.

Can you ask your dept. for another supervisor?

Kevster

I should have mentioned to the OP that in addition to having left my first degree in the final year, I actually also left my first PhD after a few months. My supervisor was never around and there seemed to be little research to do. The others in my group claimed to have become depressed by the situation. So, the postdoc left, and that's when I started looking elsewhere. Luckily, I found my current position, which I have been in since January.

I believe that the Masters by Research (M.Res) idea is a good one, and/or changing your supervisor.

Kevin

Kevo

Can you write up for a masters?

Edit: I see that has already been suggested.

LegacyUser

Hey OP,

Try to to get too down about this. I have always viewed a phd as a training period in your career where you learn the skills necessary to progress in addition to performing research. One of the most important skills you need to obtain during a PhD is the ability to accept criticism without taking it personally. Your supervisor commented on your work, not your abilities Sit down again and draw up a plan of what he feels you need to accomplish and areas he feels you are falling down in. Set goals and timelines and agree to rewiew the situation again in 3 months. Have somone from your thesis comittee sit in too if you feel it would help. Everyone goes through a period of self doubt during the phd process, but I think pererverence is important here - dont quit on the back of a bad review - your mind is clouded now. Give it 3 months, try to elevate the standard of your work with help from your supervisor (or a postdoc ) and reevaluate then.