Community Consensus needed on Two Assignments

keps

At present there are 2 Assignments/Challenges running side by side


Do you out there- and everyone has a voice- think this is the right way to go?

Does having 2 challenges just help the same people win time after time?

Would you just prefer one?

What way can the assignment/s be made more friendly for newbies?

This is a Community - and whatever the community says - will win.

keps

Just asking people if 2 assignments is the way to go?

warder6161

1 at a time 4 me

keps

warder6161 wrote: »

1 at a time 4 me

So you would like the 2 assignments - but just have them separated in some way?

Martron

they are separated by topic and rules.

as you said in the one/one topic keps the one vote system makes it hard to vote as you have to really think about the picture you are voting on. to be honest there is some new names there which i think i will be voting on.

i think the other assignment is more open to popularity voting.

But you know my views on this so i wont go on about it.

keps

Martron wrote: »

But you know my views on this so i wont go on about it.

Yes I know your views and totally respect them- but what I really look at is the long term health of the Assignment concept for the Community.

And I am just not sure - that having 2 is healthy.

Martron

keps wrote: »

What way can the assignment/s be made more friendly for newbies?

the one vote i think protects a good picture from a "newbie" from the popularity contest of the multivote. Providing people use their 1 vote for a good picture. (but as most art forms are open to opinion/interpretation it will be hard to prove.)

if the one/one challenge is causing disruption and alienating "newbies" it defeats the purpose of the community spirit here and should be disbanded. but judging by the views and entries its comparable to the other assignment.

the one/one was mainly created as an experiment to see how voting trends would go when given just one vote. i think it was quite sucessful so far as IMO the best photo won the 2 challenges. and by a long shot. demonstrating that people are possibly voting on photography rather than sympathy/popularity.

I for one did not get any votes in either one/one challenege. and this to me shows that my photos were not good ( or that i am highly unpopular around here.) i know i have produced another stinker for the rule of thirds challenege but i would prefer knowing my photos are bad rather than continuing poor photos.. I think it is unrealistic for a novice photographer (myself included) to come up against seasoned veterans and expect to win.

however any novice is always welcomed into either assignment/challenge and i think and novice would feel welcome into any assignment/challenge as we are all here to take photos at the end of the day. and advice is always kindly supplied when asked for.

keps

As well as everything else - the setting up and running of an assignment is no feckin' joke.



My proposal is that the winner of the One/One Challenge next Saturday and the winner of Assignment 43 on Sunday have a chat and agree a joint theme for assignment 44.

And that that agreed Assignment will embrace us all:)

Martron

ah its not that bad!!!

and you know we will never come to a agreement in this place!

keps

What is important is that we get everyone working together as a Community.

Once there is even the suspicion of a 'split' or a 'division'' things start to unravel and friends start to look at you in a different way.


With consensus - we can agree maybe a change of theme on some of the Assignments to make them more amenable to all.

homer simpson

Well here's what i think (for what its worth).....


On the main Question keps asked, Do i think the 2 assignments are the way to go , both yes and no.....


Yes because it adds a bit of diversity to the challange section, and it opens up more options for visitors here.

No because, although it may give a visitor more options it doesn't tend to appeal to the people who are used to , and like the currently running assignment. I also think that it was set up for the wrong reasons, from what i can make out it was set up to try be more technical but moreso if matron is being honest to try and get away from popularity voting (he's mentioned it a good few times now). I feel although sometimes it can be about popularity very seldom does a bad photo win the challange, its usually a good intrepation of the title or a photo that represents the title that wins. One of my first actions on boards was to enter a challange (ironiclly i think a rule of thirds challange) with a photo taken with my camera phone and i won it and that most certinly wasnt down to popularity.

Heres what i suggest there is room for them, but the section is called the Challange forum, so i beleive it would be worth moving the current classic assignment format to the main photography section because its isn't strictly a challange and because i feel it would get more traffic that was too, and leave the challange to run by itself in the challange forum, that way people wouldn't get confused upon seeing 2 running at the one time in the one place and not know which to enter too.

Just my opinions though the spelling is prob terrible but TBH i dont really care, i can't spell so im not going to start changing now, no matter how much people pm me complaining about it!

Ettna

I think the two challenges are good, the one/one challenge makes you think about what you post as you can only enter once, but would it be better not to have thanks on the one/one challenge because it becomes apparent which one is considered the best/most popular and that might influence opinion.

Also should we be unable to see the results of voting until after we have voted (though maybe that is the way it is already).

If there were no thanks allowed on the one/one the voting would start at level pegging, though that might not be possible to implement.

kevvhayes

was wondering about this too. are the thanks counted as the votes?? should voting not start until the challenge has ended? i could use my thanks/vote on a picture and then see one i prefer later and have no way to vote for it! especially in the one/one challenge.
im under no illusions that my pics are good enough to win a challenge but id like the opportunity to vote for one that i think will.
kev

Martron

kev. the poll only opens at the end of the challenge closing date.

i think thanks should be removed and also it be a closed vote. so the result is only revealed at the end over voting. I think it would make it very exciting.

if the results are only revealed at the end anonymous voting not really too important.

also i think maybe the photo should have a name. and the name of the photo should be in the poll rather than the name of the photograpgher.

Also homers idea is good about making a clear division between the 2. possibly a sub forum in the challenges thread?

kevvhayes

thanks matron. as you can probably tell im kinda new to this! how long does voting stay open after the closing date of the challenge?

leche solara

I think one comp at a time is clearer to all. I also prefer the idea of the poll where you can only vote once. Thank away with the thumbs up by all means, but a one vote poll at the end is fairer. Then the dilemma of how long to leave the poll open for arises. What about entries submitted for about 11 days and voting open for 3 days, or 12/2.

Necronomicon

I was kind of against it when it started, but only because there didn't seem to be any distinction between the two. But now that the new assignment has gotten its own name and set of rules, it really stands on its own. It makes for great reading from a relative noob's point of view (i.e. myself) because the themes are purely technique-based, it's a good way of learning new photography terms.

But above all else, this forum would be redundant if there was only one assignment - isn't that why there's a whole forum, rather than a just a sticky in the photography forum?

Trev M

Im voting for two , it means if ya dont like one ya have another option...Minimalism Meh :rolleyes:

Martron

kevvhayes wrote: »

thanks matron. as you can probably tell im kinda new to this! how long does voting stay open after the closing date of the challenge?

well kev,
what happens is for example you are allowed submit your photos from sunday to sunday. then the next week a poll is opened on the monday and no more photos can be submitted and voting starts. at the end of the set time the voting closes and the photo with the most votes is declared the winner

WAPAIC

I'm new and a relative newbie to photography (as opposed to snapshots) and I like both challenges, if only because if you can't do one, you can probably have a crack at the other. The multiple thanks challenge is a bit of fun and the one/one one is far better than experimenting your way through a photography book. I'm looking forward to the challenges that I have to google before I start.

For the one/one - closed vote and no thanking would be good if it was possible and easy to manage.

Keep 'em both for a month or two and see what happens?

phog

I havent been a huge partcipant in the competitions but I would view the threads on a daily basis. I think the idea of two is great, first of all if I get off my backside to take a few pics for one then I may as well try for the other too, thus in theory increasing my photography experience.

Voting should continue as is, one selected by the thanks vote and one by poll.

keps

I think the general view is to allow both the Assignment and the ONE/ONE Challenge run for another while - and see how things develop/unfold:)

Great to get such a contribution to the question.

Thanks to all who took the time.

Mountainsandh

I like both challenges the way they are too, and don't think they're too confusing.

I like that one is more technical than the other.
I like that we can still thank the posts, even though the final vote is by poll, this means that I can see, as a learner, what more experienced photographers, and others in general, consider to be a "technically proper for this challenge" photograph. Say for rule of thirds, I might have thought that something didn't fit the bill, but the thanks might tell me otherwise, regardless of whether that pic is going to win or not.

The only thing I didn't like about it was the stigma attached to it since I read the earlier discussions about elitism etc... but to someone looking at the challenges for the first time hopefully that won't be apparent.

Both are fun, they give more choice and more excuses to take pics with a purpose, and to progress, so they tick all the boxes for me.

Plus, as I don't get to take pics at the moment, they keep me entertained and still learning in the meantime. I sooo wish I could go out and take photos myself

PicturePerfect

Must say I haven't read through all the responses, but my little "Newbie" look on this from reading briefly through some responses:

If popularity voting is an issue, why not have all pictures go to a moderator/volunteer. Have the moderator/volunteer post them all in 1 post on the closing date of entry.
Number them. Not post them by name of whomever entered the picture. This way that skips the whole popularity voting. (so no water marks on the pics either I suppose)

The one vote concept is in my opinion a clear way to vote.
Although the other way of voting (which i'm still not able to do as I havent reached 25 posts yet! ) can show other entrants as well that their entry was liked...


Think 1 challenge at the time would get my vote, based on the following:
- You can still cover a lot of different assignments
- If you miss 1 challenge (or don't like it), you only have to wait a week to enter the next
- It keeps it clear what to enter that week, not have 2 topics hanging around, crossing each other in closing dates etc.

Hope the above makes sense

pullandbang

PicturePerfect wrote: »

If popularity voting is an issue, why not have all pictures go to a moderator/volunteer. Have the moderator/volunteer post them all in 1 post on the closing date of entry.
Number them. Not post them by name of whomever entered the picture. This way that skips the whole popularity voting. (so no water marks on the pics either I suppose)

The one vote concept is in my opinion a clear way to vote.

We used to do this prior to the assignments. One person had the pics emailed and he would then publish them either as one post or up on flickr (I think). You then had a chance to view them for a few days and vote on the best one.

PI do a monthly comp where you submit your themed image by email and then at date closing all the images are displayed and I think only those who enter can vote. Not 100% sure on that. However you have to mark each image out of 7 based on four criteria - Meets the theme - Technical - Originality - Aesthetics. Probably a bit tricky for here but works well over there.

On the issue of 1 or 2 challenges, I'd be all for keeping the 2 going at the same time but with little or no discussion within the challenge thread. It makes looking at the shots a chore and TBH has turned me off the last few.

charybdis

I don't partake in these but I occasionally have a look at some of the challenges and I'm amazed at some of the bickering that happens because of them.

I'm really not a fan of "competitive photography" in the sense of photographs competing against each other to be judged by popularity or judges because I think it places too much importance on conforming to a preconceived idea of what a photograph of the topic should look like which tends to homogenise the entries. Although, I understand and appreciate the idea behind a "photo challenge" in the sense that it gets people to pick up their cameras and think about the topic even if they don't win, even if they don't enter.

The "one/one" style of challenge is far more similar to a competition than a challenge; it demands the people participating make direct comparisons between the photographs as opposed to just saying what they like. It prioritises making an image that people will prefer to others rather than making a good image.

Having a "winner" is a token gesture that really serves as a mechanic to get someone to decide on the theme of the next assignment, there's no need to have a second system that's more competitive as I think it'll ultimately be counterproductive.

Don't take this as my vote on anything, I haven't participated here and I'm unlikely to start; but I think it's a point that bears mentioning.

Ettna

We should start a one/one discussion/comments thread at the same time as the one/one photo thread and post all comments etc. to the discussion thread. As everyone has only one entry its easy to see what is being referred to if the op's name is mentioned.

keps

pullandbang wrote: »

On the issue of 1 or 2 challenges, I'd be all for keeping the 2 going at the same time but with little or no discussion within the challenge thread. It makes looking at the shots a chore and TBH has turned me off the last few.

I accept a full share of blame for 'the discussion' problems.

I guarantee I won't be a culprit again.

Martron

i am a discussion culprit too. sorry. the discussion thread has been running . we dont tneed a seperate one i dont think. just contiinue in one thread. it will be easy to understand what is being discussed as there will only be one active challenge open per discussion thread.

gone2themoon

Two assignments, two assignment discussion threads, a new assignment suggestion thread, poll threads.... This is getting messy. Assignment stats are down.

pete4130

10cc of photo challenge input......stat!!!!!!

Mountainsandh

Well just talking for myself here, but the lack of time, reduced daylight hours, and the bad weather are the reasons I'm not participating in the challenges so much atm, not the increased number of threads about them.