Over 18s Anime/Manga Event

Butterscotch

Hey,

I was reading through people's feedback in the Nomcon thread and I noticed a good few people were saying that they would have preferred it if the majority of attendees were older and would like the con without the screaming kids. I was thinking for ages to perhaps grab some people and run a one day over 18's anime/manga event. A two day con would be cool but I am not sure if we would get many attendees so I am thinking a one day event would do.

I have lots of con expereince so I am really serious about this. I mean you have seen the successes of Nomcon and that was done by a group of devoted and ambitious fans so it can be done. I was thinking of having the event perhaps in the D4 Hotel as it is cheap or somewhere else. I would ideally love to go an anime/manga event to meet people my own age, meet like minded people and have no hyper kids around. We could do many interesting panels, such as erotic cosplay, hentai, anime fetishes, yaoi, yuri ect.. It doesn't have to be about sex, there could be panels on highly intelligent subjects such as the older anime fan would find appealing eg retro anime, the deep psychological effects of Neon Genesis Evangelion or even older artists or people in the anime/manga community could do panels. I was thinking we could maybe get guests but would need a deep discussion about this, maybe have traders.

Anyway I would like to hear thoughts and opinions on this. Good idea/bad idea? At the moment I am very busy working with Eirtakon but if anyone is interested in running this event do get in touch with me and we can have little discussions, then after Eirtakon we can get cracking on the event.;) No worries if many of you think it is a bad idea, it is just a suggestion on the side.

Varik

wouldn't mind not having kids around, wouldn't need to have any thing special some more mature topics would be nice but no small children would be the main attraction for me.


This isn't anime/manga related but it is con(PAX) related:



1: PAX is a semi-annual gamer con.
2: Craigslist is a online communities with free online classified advertisements.

Butterscotch

Funny comic there.:P It is just I was at gamer cons and comic book cons and there was were always an older crowd which was nice. Don't get me wrong the kids and younger crowd pump colour and bring cons a great atmosphere but it is just we have a few all age anime cons and it would be nice just to have a little anime/manga event for the older crowd.

Varik

Butterscotch wrote: »

Funny comic there.:P It is just I was at gamer cons and comic book cons and there was were always an older crowd which was nice. Don't get me wrong the kids and younger crowd pump colour and bring cons a great atmosphere but it is just we have a few all age anime cons and it would be nice just to have a little anime/manga event for the older crowd.

Even when peopled say cartoon and games are for kids, that not for true games at all with the average age being in the late 30s but with anime even with many mature, intelligent and brilliant animes there is far more interest from kids with all the anime that is made for them being so mainstream most of of us can remember shizo and such back in the day on the den.

What were you thinking about for the age restrictions 16/18/21 or would it just be informal and only state it wasn't for kids.

Lemegeton

i didnt have a problem with the kids at nom-con, they added to the atmosphere but i just wished there was more people my age at it. So I for one would think this is a great idea. i would love an event with more people my age as none of my mates are that into anime and it would be great to meet and talk to fans my own age (29) btw. I think it would be tough getting the numbers in this country for an 18+ anime event because the truth is the anime fanbase in ireland is mostly made up of teenagers because its shows like naruto and pokemon, digimon etc.. that make it to mainstream tv over here.
but i would definitely be interested in helping out any way i could to get something like this off the ground.

Zeouterlimits

It's a nice idea, I'd certainly be interested in such an event, but there might be an attendance issue.
The below-18 market seems to be the biggest for anime & manga here, at the very least for con-attendance, if not the bigger selling titles (Bleach, Naruto, Death Note, Vampire Knight etc).
Is there a history of these kinds of cons in the EU & the Americas?

I'll be keeping my eye on this thread, I'm interested in idea.

cherryghost

I didnt really have a problem with the younger groups either, as I came across many like-minded and aged people at the con and tended to hang around with them instead.

But I think your idea is great butterscotch! I would most definitely be interested in something like that. Would be great to sit down with some new friends and actually able to hear yourself :P


EDIT: Also, case in point. I know it's only a demograph of about 10% of Nom Conners, but the poll gives some interesting results

http://www.nom-con.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=membershall&action=display&thread=242&page=1

Butterscotch

Varik wrote: »

What were you thinking about for the age restrictions 16/18/21 or would it just be informal and only state it wasn't for kids.

Well I was thinking 18's up, or maybe over 20, 21's, what do you all think? To be honest myself I think it is safe to go for over 18's as if we go up higher we would risk in getting little attendees. I do believe this is a risk we are taking as we are cutting out the majority of the Irish anime/manga population but I am willing to take the risk. That is why if we go ahead with this we would need to make it very cheap and only have the event one day like have it from 18-2am or earlier? I would love to have events at it like cosplay burlesque.

Lemmegeton that is cool you are willing to help out, I prefer people with con expereince to run this event, no time wasters but do drop me pm and give me your thoughts and insight you may fit the game.

That was very interesting Cherryghost, it seemed a good few who went were between 19-25 which was cool.

Zerouterlimits yes over 18's anime/manga events are quite popular in the USA and Japan, not sure about Europe.

thefinalstage

Hey Butterscotch, remember me?

I am in if this goes ahead .

Konata

I think it's a fantastic idea. Sure an Over 18s event is cutting out a lot of people but I think that the Over 18 anime/manga fans would really appreciate such an event and would be very likely to take part. Your time frame seems like a good idea Butterscotch, and I think Over 18 would be the perfect age restriction.

Xinkai

You have to take into consideration the number of under 18's & under 21's in the community though. If i was to guess correctly i'd say about 70-80% of the yearly Nom/Eirtakon attendee's would be under 18, & certainly under 21. Nice idea, but just a bit dodgy if you're expecting to hit 1000 attendee's.

cherryghost

meh, I think the under 18's to over 18's at nom con was about 50-50 to be honest. The younger louder ones stood out more, thats all

Art_Wolf

I think its a fantastic idea, no idea what the ratio is at other cons but when you notice you are older than the majority.. it definitely is depressing It is a lot more social if you can relate to everyone at the con *shrugs*

Xinkai wrote: »

Nice idea, but just a bit dodgy if you're expecting to hit 1000 attendee's.

I don't think they need to aim so high if it is expenses, something even as simple as Dama-con's first con which was two screening rooms and a hall with events on was great fun.

Funky

I think it's a great idea. Like others have said though attendance might be an issue.

Lemegeton

Art_Wolf wrote: »

I think its a fantastic idea, no idea what the ratio is at other cons but when you notice you are older than the majority.. it definitely is depressing It is a lot more social if you can relate to everyone at the con *shrugs*



I don't think they need to aim so high if it is expenses, something even as simple as Dama-con's first con which was two screening rooms and a hall with events on was great fun.

yeah that would be ideal. aim low for the first one and see how many turn up.

TheChrisD

I definitely think it is a good idea. The main thing about Nom and Eirta that I can see at the moment is that the vast majority of attendees appear to be of a young age, so for older fans it can be hard to find similarly-aged people to hang out with, or to even go with in the first place.

A small event for 18+ or even 21+ would be a good start to try and see just how many of us there really are out there

Azure_sky

I think it is a great idea. I personally have no interest in Naruto, Bleach etc. Now, Akira, Evangelion, Elfen Lied, Ghost in the shell and Patlabor are different matters entirely.:)

Butterscotch

thelastangryman wrote: »

Hey Butterscotch, remember me?

AMS? I regonise your name.:P

Thanks for all for your feedback and input. I was chatting to a good friend of mine who has lots of expereince running events and cons and I told him my idea. He gave me great input in what we would have to be aware of. This is what he said;

1. Are we making something that is all ready niche more niche? A risk of very little attendees coming but like many of you had said, if we make this con only one day, small and cheap then we should be ok.

2. Where are we going to get the money to host this event? Apparently the D4 hotel where Nomcon was costs something like 3,000 a day. We could find somewhere not that expensive but it is unlikely. Perhaps do a charity event or something..

3. Making it a fetish, porn and erotic event is somewhat a bad idea as no other anime or non-anime con would let us advertise the event at their con. This is very understandable as the majority are kids who go to these cons and parents go too, if they see a flyer saying over 18's anime/manga erotic con they will think anime/manga is all about porn thus giving other anime cons a very bad image. Risk in getting a bad name.

4. There are many laws against pornography including hentai and lollicon therefore very few venues would allow us to hold such an event which would be a major problem. There is also the risk in attracting bad media attention and protesters.

Solution to these;

1. I have decided to result to marketing research. I would like someone who is very willing to help run this event and knows what they are doing to conduct surveys during the weekend of Eirtakon as the majority of Irish anime fans will be there. My friend and I are going to design these surveys. In the surveys it will be questions like, would you go to an over 18's anime con? What stuff would you like to see there? ect The result of these surveys will indicate would over 18's be willing to go and when we set up a committee we would now what the target market are looking for and what not to have in the con. I would someone who is not part of any con to do these surveys.

2. This will be discussed when we have a committee finalised and when we get the go ahead.

Pt 3. and 4. In America there is an over 18's anime con which focuses on the artistic and academic side of anime so I think this is the image we should go for instead of going for a fetish erotic image. I mean we can still have erotic, hentai panels but will not mention them on the flyers. Keep the image clean.

I am going to discuss this with some people I know who have con experience and ask them are they willing to help run this event and see where we go from there.

Art_Wolf

Check out places like FilmBase in Temple Bar - a screening room and two training rooms for games and what not etc. Or rent out a screen in Cineworld and arrange to do something in the Outback or such between showings.

If you're going to survey the EirtaKon attendees, make sure you have a question of 'would you come to a one day event in Dublin'. Considering some of them come from a long way off, they may skew your results

*cough*Eirtakumeet at Conors*cough*

Butterscotch

Thanks very much Art_Wolf for your feedback. I will keep everything you said in mind.:)

Thomas-G

I'd like a con where it's about meeting people rather than a fashion show of cosplay, I was all for going to nomcon until I saw the video of the picnic, where EVERYONE was in costume. I've nothing against cosplay, in fact I'd love to try it out, but I'd rather the folk I meet judge my by my theories of Elfin Lied's dealing with isolation and human emotion rather than how wicked my tentacle monster outfit is Couldn't we do something less extravagant like a barcamp, where we all meet up for a few pints, perhaps think up some activities etc.?

thefinalstage

Butterscotch wrote: »

AMS? I regonise your name.:P

Yep AMS, have not been in ages. Must wander on over and say hello. What time is it usually on at?

TheChrisD

thelastangryman wrote: »

What time is it usually on at?

About 7pm Thursday nights. Wander around the Henry Grattan. Think the usual spot these days is CG02.

reunion

why not test the waters with an 18+ section at a con?

Lemegeton

reunion wrote: »

why not test the waters with an 18+ section at a con?

such as?????
Eirtakon is only a month away so its too late to do something there. and thats pretty much it as far as cons go till the same time next year

Steppes

Sounds interesting. If you're looking to explore the academic/literary side of anime/manga, it would be a good idea to get in touch with someone from a university literature or film studies department and ask them to do a talk, perhaps someone who's written a paper on a related subject.
Unfortunately Ireland is a largely sex-negative society, so I agree with others who say you're going to have to tone down any erotic events you might want to have. You're also going to have to politely turn away any underage people, which requires some diplomatic skills.

TheChrisD

Lemegeton wrote: »

Eirtakon is only a month away so its too late to do something there.

You say that as if there aren't going to be any 18+ specific events already taking place during the weekend.

Lemegeton

TheChrisD wrote: »

You say that as if there aren't going to be any 18+ specific events already taking place during the weekend.

i didnt see any on the schedule. if there are then i apologize.

reunion

Lemegeton wrote: »

such as?????
Eirtakon is only a month away so its too late to do something there. and thats pretty much it as far as cons go till the same time next year

I was just saying that a section at a con for 18+ would allow people to know the interest in such an event. Also i personally wouldn't know what to expect from an 18+ section currently so that would also be a good way to give people a sample of what to exect at an 18+ convention....

It doesn't have to be a whole seperate convention run at the same time as another con, it could be like a show showing some things to expect at an 18+ con, to get feedback/interest.

Eirtakon would be the best place to showcase this (as it is the only con in Ireland until june of next year) and a month and a half should be plenty of time to organise something small to show to people

i think the pub quiz is 18+

Azure_sky

Steppes wrote: »

You're also going to have to politely turn away any underage people, which requires some diplomatic skills.

TheChrisD

Lemegeton wrote: »

i didnt see any on the schedule. if there are then i apologize.

There's none to see on the schedule yet as they are mostly in the Panels and Workshops, details of which have not yet been announced. There is also an 18+ section as part of the special event, which will hopefully be revealed soon.

Steppes

Azure_sky wrote: »

gearoidof

Just gonna pop in my 2 cents and say that you should make sure that any hentai event is explicitly stated as involving pornographic material.

I say this because mature content also includes excessive violence and bad language.And adult content could still be confused by the innocent attendee.

Tar.Aldarion

'tentacles included'

Zeouterlimits

Tar.Aldarion wrote: »

'tentacles included'

Why does that make me.. more interested?

tread_softly

Hey Amy,
Only read this now. I think it's a pretty good idea, though, as has been already stated before, I don't know if there would be a huge amount of people at it.

However, there doesn't particularly need to be a giant crowd if the costs of running it aren't three high.

You'd have to really work to spread word of it around, but I think it would attract a big enough crowd to be a success.

ztoical

To save money and see if the event has the legs to be worth investing time/money/effort in doing something bigger why not start by holding it as a late afternoon to late evening event in a pub function room? There are quite a few pubs in the city center of Dublin that have large function rooms that you can hire for free. The advantage of this is straight away it makes the event over 18's as it's being held on a licensed premises and that removes any issue of having to turn under 18's away from the event and makes life easier for those running it. It's easy enough to hire a screen or projector [or source one for free, we managed to do just that for last years 24 hour comics day with little effort] or alot of pubs have them already for sporting events.

The issue you have with holding an over 18's event is the motive behind it it's either [a] to focus on adult material like hentai and yaoi or cus people want to get away from screaming kids/teens or [c] a mix of a and b. Focusing on adult material makes it hard to advertise and also makes it very focused on one thing, if thats what is wanted then go for it but it sounds more like people want a meet and greet/get to know people style event that doesn't include cosplay or screaming kids. The issue with that is it can come across as elitist to some and off putting to people who might be part of a group of friends that fall on both sides of 18 bracket and for some people the over enthusiastic youngs ones are what make those events for them.

Holding it in a pub rather then a hotel function room automatically makes it 18's without having to do anything. Going for a short afternoon and evening style of event [perhaps discussion talks/panels in the afternoon and screenings in the evening] means you can see what the numbers are like, what the over all interest is like and either that set up will work or there will be enough interest to go larger. For dealers and artists an 18's event is off putting [unless they focus on adult material] as your cutting out a big chunk of their market and being able to say look we had this event recently and X numbers showed up so it's worth your while attending.

The Dublin Comic Jam that takes place monthly wasn't started as an 18's event but due to being held in a pub it is just that and you get the relaxed easy to get to talk to people atmosphere at it that it sounds like people are looking for.

cherryghost

Would it really be THAT hard to throw it in somewhere during Eirtakon? Either extend the schedule of one of the days by an hour or something. Then based off feedback on that, something of a slightly larger scale could be organised

Butterscotch

ztoical wrote: »

To save money and see if the event has the legs to be worth investing time/money/effort in doing something bigger why not start by holding it as a late afternoon to late evening event in a pub function room? There are quite a few pubs in the city center of Dublin that have large function rooms that you can hire for free. The advantage of this is straight away it makes the event over 18's as it's being held on a licensed premises and that removes any issue of having to turn under 18's away from the event and makes life easier for those running it. It's easy enough to hire a screen or projector [or source one for free, we managed to do just that for last years 24 hour comics day with little effort] or alot of pubs have them already for sporting events.

The issue you have with holding an over 18's event is the motive behind it it's either [a] to focus on adult material like hentai and yaoi or cus people want to get away from screaming kids/teens or [c] a mix of a and b. Focusing on adult material makes it hard to advertise and also makes it very focused on one thing, if thats what is wanted then go for it but it sounds more like people want a meet and greet/get to know people style event that doesn't include cosplay or screaming kids. The issue with that is it can come across as elitist to some and off putting to people who might be part of a group of friends that fall on both sides of 18 bracket and for some people the over enthusiastic youngs ones are what make those events for them.

Holding it in a pub rather then a hotel function room automatically makes it 18's without having to do anything. Going for a short afternoon and evening style of event [perhaps discussion talks/panels in the afternoon and screenings in the evening] means you can see what the numbers are like, what the over all interest is like and either that set up will work or there will be enough interest to go larger. For dealers and artists an 18's event is off putting [unless they focus on adult material] as your cutting out a big chunk of their market and being able to say look we had this event recently and X numbers showed up so it's worth your while attending.

The Dublin Comic Jam that takes place monthly wasn't started as an 18's event but due to being held in a pub it is just that and you get the relaxed easy to get to talk to people atmosphere at it that it sounds like people are looking for.

Very useful feed back thanks.:) Well I think it is best to wait until we see the results of the surveys at least then we know is there any point in trying the test run but if the survey results reveal that the majority of people want this to happen and give us feedback on what they want to see at it, we would know what type of events to have at it and to not have cosplay at it or not. As much as I love cosplay but unfortunately in this country the majority of cosplayers are young in their teens so a lot of people see it as a "kiddie" hobbie. I am sure there is a lot of adult cosplayers out there but just we don't know who they are. I will defiantly ask in the survey about cosplay.

Yes we would have adult events at it but will not be advertising them, we would ideally go for an artistic and academic appraoch. Best to wait until the survey results. You do have a very point about it being "etlist" which could ruin the image completely and possibly have kids and younger people protesting against it, ok I might be taking this abit far :P but it is a possibility. Elitism will be taken into account in the survey.

If the survey results are positive and when I get a committee together we will be best running the event in a pub function room as you said ztoical as it is cheap and best to see how we get on with numbers, if it is a success and the demand is there we would go for a bigger venue but if it was failure at least we didn't invest massive amounts of money and not much is lost.

@Cherryghost: we are having an over 18's event at Eirtakon but that's a surprise. ;-) I was thinking it would be a good idea to give out the surveys at this event.

MarkMI6

Butterscotch wrote: »

@Cherryghost: we are having an over 18's event at Eirtakon but that's a surprise. ;-) I was thinking it would be a good idea to give out the surveys at this event.

There's also the pub quiz, which is by its nature an over 18s event.

Demonique

TheChrisD wrote: »

About 7pm Thursday nights. Wander around the Henry Grattan. Think the usual spot these days is CG02.

What's AMS?

thefinalstage

Demonique wrote: »

What's AMS?

Anime & Manga Society. They are a really good group, if you get the chance you should pay them a visit.

Butterscotch

Demonique wrote: »

What's AMS?

AMS is the Dublin City University Anime Manga Society who run Eirtakon. They have showings every Thursday at 7 in the college. I think it is 4E to join for the year.

Anyway update about this. I never got around doing those surveys, as I was so busy planning for the con. I think the best thing to do is see how Kitty and I get on with the Dublin Anime Society which we aim for mature anime fans to join. We are going to see how we get on with this and take things from there. Alot of research and planning has to go into this event, so it will take time.

thefinalstage

Butterscotch wrote: »

AMS is the Dublin City University Anime Manga Society who run Eirtakon. They have showings every Thursday at 7 in the college. I think it is 4E to join for the year.

Anyway update about this. I never got around doing those surveys, as I was so busy planning for the con. I think the best thing to do is see how Kitty and I get on with the Dublin Anime Society which we aim for mature anime fans to join. We are going to see how we get on with this and take things from there. Alot of research and planning has to go into this event, so it will take time.

If you or Kitty need any help with the research or anything let me know. I really want this to get off the ground.

thefinalstage

*Bumpety bump*

Just remembered this. Any news?

Butterscotch

thelastangryman wrote: »

*Bumpety bump*

Just remembered this. Any news?

Unfortunately not really as I have been busy on other things. Originally I was hoping to get the mature anime club of the ground with Kitty and see how we go from there but this doesn't look like to be happening anytime soon as Kitty is very busy herself. So I am still looking for the right people to ask to help me out with this so things are slow I am afraid but I won't let it slip I will get this anime con sorted for you guys and girls.;)

thefinalstage

Butterscotch wrote: »

Unfortunately not really as I have been busy on other things. Originally I was hoping to get the mature anime club of the ground with Kitty and see how we go from there but this doesn't look like to be happening anytime soon as Kitty is very busy herself. So I am still looking for the right people to ask to help me out with this so things are slow I am afraid but I won't let it slip I will get this anime con sorted for you guys.;)

My offer still stands. I have no experience organising cons but I am sure I could help in some way. Plus I am interested so I wont bail .