Small bit of advice please - car purchase.

Bonito

If I were to buy a used car from a dealer, as a consumer/customer, and it then turned out a week later when I was getting a small bit of work done at a garage I trust that this work turned in to a massive bill of just over half of what I paid for the car. As the mechanics went deeper they just found more problems and in the end couldn't release the car back to me as it was a death trap and not safe for the road.

Would I be right in saying that the garage who sold me the car is liable?

When I rang the dealer to explain he became aggressive, abusive and threatening towards me over the phone and quite liked reciting the words "Sold as seen" and "It was a trade sale, you can fúck off, you're getting nothing off me."

He also lied about the condition of other parts of the car. He told me this and that was done and it was given new this and they replaced that and it turned that, in fact, none of the work that he told me was carried out on the car, was actually carried out.

Am I in the right to pursue legal action here?

FreudianSlippers

Why would he say it was a "trade sale"?

There are multiple factors that come into play in these types of situations, but IMO you should contact a solicitor and explain the details in full.

Bonito

OisinT wrote: »

Why would he say it was a "trade sale"?

There are multiple factors that come into play in these types of situations, but IMO you should contact a solicitor and explain the details in full.

From what I understand a "trade sale" is between dealer to dealer as they can completely inspect cars and then repair whatever needs to be repaird for stock prices and it costs them sod all extra.

AFAIK you can't do a "trade sale" to a public consumer?

FreudianSlippers

Bonito wrote: »

From what I understand a "trade sale" is between dealer to dealer as they can completely inspect cars and then repair whatever needs to be repaird for stock prices and it costs them sod all extra.

AFAIK you can't do a "trade sale" to a public consumer?

Well, yeah... he's trying to imply that you were not acting as a consumer under the Sale of Goods and Supply of Services Act.
I just was wondering why he would think this.

I would consult a solicitor though.

Bonito

OisinT wrote: »

Well, yeah... he's trying to imply that you were not acting as a consumer under the Sale of Goods and Supply of Services Act.
I just was wondering why he would think this.

I would consult a solicitor though.

Rang a solicitor there and he says I'm completely right and the dealer is trying to imply that I was purchasing the car as if I were a dealer, which I'm not, I'm a consumer.

From 1st glance the solicitor says that the dealer has given me a good that was not of merchantable quality and not fit for it's intended use and his defense of "You bought a trade car" is nonsense as I bought it as a consumer and it went through the books of the dealership.

FreudianSlippers

Sounds like your solicitor can take it from here, but here's 2 parts of the 1980 Act which may be of interest to you:

3.—(1) In the Act of 1893 and this Act, a party to a contract is said to deal as consumer in relation to another party if—

( a ) he neither makes the contract in the course of a business nor holds himself out as doing so, and
( b ) the other party does make the contract in the course of a business, and
( c ) the goods or services supplied under or in pursuance of the contract are of a type ordinarily supplied for private use or consumption.

(2) On—

( a ) a sale by competitive tender, or
( b ) a sale by auction—

(i) of goods of a type, or
(ii) by or on behalf of a person of a class
defined by the Minister by order,
the buyer is not in any circumstances to be regarded as dealing as consumer.

(3) Subject to this, it is for those claiming that a party does not deal as consumer to show that he does not.

Implied condition on sale of motor vehicles.
13.—(1) In this section "motor vehicle" means a vehicle intended or adapted for propulsion by mechanical means, including—

( a ) a bicycle or tricycle with an attachment for propelling it by mechanical power, and
( b ) a vehicle the means of propulsion of which is electrical or partly electrical and partly mechanical.

(2) Without prejudice to any other condition or warranty, in every contract for the sale of a motor vehicle (except a contract in which the buyer is a person whose business it is to deal in motor vehicles) there is an implied condition that at the time of delivery of the vehicle under the contract it is free from any defect which would render it a danger to the public, including persons travelling in the vehicle.
(3) Subsection (2) of this section shall not apply where—

( a ) it is agreed between the seller and the buyer that the vehicle is not intended for use in the condition in which it is to be delivered to the buyer under the contract, and
( b ) a document consisting of a statement to that effect is signed by or on behalf of the seller and the buyer and given to the buyer prior to or at the time of such delivery, and
( c ) it is shown that the agreement referred to in paragraph (a) is fair and reasonable.

(4) Save in a case in which the implied condition as to freedom from defects referred to in subsection (2) is either not incorporated in the contract or has been effectively excluded from the contract pursuant to that subsection, in the case of every sale of a motor vehicle by a person whose business it is to deal in motor vehicles a certificate in writing in such form as the Minister may by regulations prescribe shall be given to the buyer by or on behalf of the seller to the effect that the vehicle is, at the time of delivery, free from any defect which would render it a danger to the public, including persons travelling in the vehicle.
(5) Where an action is brought for breach of the implied condition referred to in subsection (2) by reason of a specific defect in a motor vehicle and a certificate complying with the requirements of this section is not proved to have been given, it shall be presumed unless the contrary is proved that the proven defect existed at the time of delivery.
(6) Regulations under subsection (4) may apply to motor vehicles generally or to motor vehicles of a particular class or description (defined in such manner and by reference to such things as the Minister thinks proper) and different forms of certificate may be prescribed for different classes or descriptions of vehicles.
(7) A person using a motor vehicle with the consent of the buyer of the vehicle who suffers loss as the result of a breach of the condition implied by subsection (2) in the contract of sale may maintain an action for damages against the seller in respect of the breach as if he were the buyer.
(8) The Statute of Limitations, 1957 , is hereby amended—

(I) by the insertion in section 11 (2) of the following paragraph—

"(d) An action for damages under section 13 (7) of the Sale of Goods and Supply of Services Act, 1980 , shall not be brought after the expiration of two years from the date on which the cause of action accrued.";

(II) by the insertion in section 49 of the following subsection—

"(5) In the case of an action claiming damages under section 13 (7) of the Sale of Goods and Supply of Services Act, 1980 , subsection (1) of this section shall have effect as if for the words 'six years' there were substituted the words 'two years'.".
(9) Notwithstanding section 55 (1) of the Act of 1893 (inserted by section 22 of this Act) any term of a contract exempting from all or any of the provisions of this section shall be void.

Bonito

That's brilliant! Thanks for that!

maidhc

Winning second hand car cases is really hard, espcially if the car is old, although you do sound to be at the right side of things.

You will need a good report from a motor assessor, which will cost €300-€500 if you want to make it fly in court.

Bonito

maidhc wrote: »

Winning second hand car cases is really hard, espcially if the car is old, although you do sound to be at the right side of things.

You will need a good report from a motor assessor, which will cost €300-€500 if you want to make it fly in court.

I'm fairly confident I have it. The garage that did the work kept all the parts for me to give to the assessor. (How I go about getting an independent report done I'll have to find out.)

He also lied about the cars condition. I asked was it crashed, he says no, then it turns out it was. I asked what work was done in the main dealers. He says full service, bushings and rear pads and discs. Only thing that was done was rear pads and they were spurious heaps of dirt that were put on. He wont even tell me the main of what main dealer he sent it to or show me receipts.

Scum bag chancing his arm to be honest.