stalker/collossi rapin my armies :(

Xios

My armies keep getting raped by a couple zealots, stalkers and 2-3 collossi. I can't counter them without broodlords or teched up infestors they costs a lot of gas and time.

The zealots mince my zerglings or slow them down, stalkers raped my armoured roaches and the collossi shred zerglings and hydras. And even if he had 1 sentry in there, that'd make for one hell of a nut to crack

Tyrant^

ultras ! and sandwich him !

Funky

Think corruptors are probably the best counter to colossi. If he manages to get 2/3 colossi before revealing them to you and makes a push it can be pretty hard to respond in time but 6 or 7 corruptors will clean them up pretty quickly if you can get them out before engaging in a fight with his main army. Stalkers will kill them relatively quick but between the range of a corruptor and the lings that'll be runnin around too distractin the stalkers you can focus the colossi down pretty easy.

BlitzKrieg

yeah corrupters are your best bet for 2 reasons

1 - they have the corruption ability which will cause the colossi to be not only a big target but a really easy one to kill. You need to remember collossi are so big that air to air units can target them

2 - they can be upgraded to broodlords even if its behind the colossi hitting the field if you can keep your macro going while microing your army against his.


like all zerg armies, corrupters on their own get murdered.

good news though is that the corruption power make them a comfortable partner and they can pair up with either mutalisks or hydra's. Muties are easier on the tech tree, but more expensive gas wise and have relatively short range. Hyrdra's alone get murdered by colossi but corrupters using corruption allow for a mob of hydra to kill them quick enough to minimize lossess (grab the extended range to help the hydras). Mutalisks kitting with your air force is more suited.


Oh and fight him on creep highway. I know you cant choose really, but if you are trying to tech up then you should be able to pull him to the creep over rushing out to face him and that will allow your hydras to kite aswell and your lings will be a high speed wall of confusion.

Overheal

At some point early in the game have your queen poo a creep node. Each creep node can build 1 additional creep node. Before you know it, half the map is filled with creep that you have vision of, and can move fast on.

Also, you can't allow a Protoss player to tech like that! Get in there early. 7 of 10 protoss players don't deal with a 6-pool properly. And when its followed up with a wave of 8 and a wave of 14 (Micro management is Key here) You've destroyed their economy. Trying to get into a tech-race with a Protoss player is asking to be raped.

Jonny7

Overheal wrote: »

At some point early in the game have your queen poo a creep node. Each creep node can build 1 additional creep node. Before you know it, half the map is filled with creep that you have vision of, and can move fast on.

Also, you can't allow a Protoss player to tech like that! Get in there early. 7 of 10 protoss players don't deal with a 6-pool properly. And when its followed up with a wave of 8 and a wave of 14 (Micro management is Key here) You've destroyed their economy. Trying to get into a tech-race with a Protoss player is asking to be raped.

I take your 6 pool and raise you the almighty 8 pool..

Why is it so almighty? because its not all-in or cheesey, you can go right into macro with it, complete with expansion and everything..

Heres my variation on it anyway..

Build two drones, so you have 8..
Wait until you have 165ish minerals, then move a drone to the furthest part of your creep (the last place he will scout - any little advantage) and
place spawning pool..
Build two more drones..
Build an Overlord..

This is the beautiful bit..
Watch as your minerals hit 150, the overlord pops, the pool pops and you just have 3 larvae.. perfect, then make 6 zerglings..
(set waypoint to just outside his main)
make another 2 or 3 sets of zerglings, adding them to the control group that the first 6 are in and also you have enough minerals to add a queen amongst that..

Attacking his base..
As the 6 zerglings JUST arrive outside his main you should have two or three sets zerglings on their way.. I usually go for 10 zerglings total..
Kill his first zealot with a nice surround..
Then constantly go for the pylon powering the gateway
If he draws his probes off the lines, run away, harass, draw the probes off, kill small groups of them, kill any pylons he tries to put up

All the while..
Hitting S+D and waiting for 300 minerals, drop expansion, spawn larvae with Queen, etc.. whichever way you want to do it.

It is a little intensive during the battle, but much more intensive for the protoss player.

I've used this for awhile, but saw Madfrog beat Whitera twice I think with very similar build during recent IEM games


Also, there is a great little zergling + roach one base build that hits them early too.. haven't really tried it yet though

zoom!

fast melee units such as chargelots/speedlings aswell as some roaches deal with this np

Stingerbar

Just build speed zerglings and roaches and watch him cliffwalk/blink and melt your entire army

DeVore

I've found that if you arent winning early with Zerg, you arent winning at all...

Later game, things like collosi, battlecrusiers, motherships etc.... the Zerg have only counters to... they dont have a big unit like that to aim for and pull out as a distraction on the board.

If you arent dominating by the time they have tier 3 on its way and a second base.... you will have to be very good to survive. And if you were that good, you wouldnt have let it get that far.

Zerg are great fun for swarming but lack anything hard hitting in the end game imho (not that I have played many end games with them hahaha)

DeV.

BlitzKrieg

I've found that if you arent winning early with Zerg, you arent winning at all...

define winning

Map control can count as winning. Even if you are loosing fights to his more powerful units, if you have map control then personnally I find broodlords are a good unit to have as a goal purely because they outrange most AA units and AA towers so a player who has been mostly kept from roaming the map much can be easily cornered and crushed with them.

but thats a form of winning I guess.

seraphimvc

corruptor is defo a huge help when comes to corruptor. if you have enough zerglings(which is good against stalker/colussus), you pull the lings to surround his army, lings work as a distraction(and can eat stalker quite quickly) when your roaches/hydra go in damage. if the stalkers blink away then at least his colusus are dead(focus fire them colusus!) :P my 2cent.

oh and try to avoid battle at the colusus advantage high ground(alot in Kulas Ravine) caused in that case you must use corruptor for them then.

DeVore wrote: »

Zerg are great fun for swarming but lack anything hard hitting in the end game imho (not that I have played many end games with them hahaha)

DeV.

not anymore dev :pac: zerg cannot efficiently swarm the enemy now without having at least 3 bases.

BlitzKrieg wrote: »

define winning

Map control can count as winning. Even if you are loosing fights to his more powerful units, if you have map control then personnally I find broodlords are a good unit to have as a goal purely because they outrange most AA units and AA towers so a player who has been mostly kept from roaming the map much can be easily cornered and crushed with them.

but thats a form of winning I guess.

if against terran then their 3/4 vikings can eat my 3/4 broodlord like no day of tomorrow:mad: and stalkers works so well on them too. they are great for nooby turtle or when i have free corruptor has nothing to do in a winning game, 2/3 broodlord can easily mental crush the opponent . i propose a buff for them seriously, make them can air to air or tougher to kill, i mean, wtf, Broodlord is the most useless Tier 3 unit compare to BC and carrier and it takes agessssssssss to produce one (and it is so fcking expensive)!! i have seen people use Carrier/BC table turn the game into win, but if i have tonnes of broodlord(that means i have low amount of ground units), i knew the game is gone if the opponent has the slighest sense to get some AA units.

Xios

I rarely get broodlords, but if i do, i match them with lotsa hydras, i mean 30-40 hydras for 3/4 broods. Rangalisks handle any air units and the broodlords make a melee wall for the hydras, they work well together if managed properly.

Stingerbar

No two ways about it, Zerg are weak early game now.. we're the paranoid ones.. hellions/reapers/bunker rushes/cannon rushes.. have to keep constantly scouting and sacking overlords.. then we get to mid-game, spread creep everywhere and get our third up and we're grand

Overheal

Helions/Reapers, Meet Speedling.

Cannon Rushes??? Say hello to your queen's ability to poo a (cloaked!) creep tumor, that can spawn other tumours, which can spawn other tumors, etc. etc.

With correct use of your First 1-3 Overlords you will see a Cannon Rush from 3 nautical miles.

As for that 8 pool suggested to me earlier: totally ****ed me up. Went back to 11-pool. 11th spawns, moves into place, 200 minerals accrue right then > spawning pool. 11-pool again. Overlord. From here my mood swings between 3 drones + Extractor, or 6 lings and a Queen. The former being more popular for getting faster speedlings, and Tier 2.

And last night I finally got some solid experience with Ultralisks. A dozen of those are just, unstoppable. Especially in 2s and 3s when you have backup. Rangealisks are an issue. You have to plug in your Evolution Chamber around your 3rd or 4th overlord and get teching, or you will get destroyed. Terran on the other hand generally will despise you for your dozen Ultralisks, especially the tard-holes that mass marines and marauders. And you usually have excess minerals doing this, because you will chew through all of your gas before that: Back up the Ultras with Speedlings, and Hydras. Let it not be said Zerg can't hold their own in the late game.

RoyalMarine

Overheal wrote: »

And last night I finally got some solid experience with Ultralisks. A dozen of those are just, unstoppable. Especially in 2s and 3s when you have backup. Rangealisks are an issue. You have to plug in your Evolution Chamber around your 3rd or 4th overlord and get teching, or you will get destroyed. Terran on the other hand generally will despise you for your dozen Ultralisks, especially the tard-holes that mass marines and marauders. And you usually have excess minerals doing this, because you will chew through all of your gas before that: Back up the Ultras with Speedlings, and Hydras. Let it not be said Zerg can't hold their own in the late game.

except when they counter with what, 4 or 5 banshee's?
reaper's are also quick against the ultra's, attack run, attack run seems pretty easy to do

Overheal

RoyalMarineComm wrote: »

except when they counter with what, 4 or 5 banshee's?
reaper's are also quick against the ultra's, attack run, attack run seems pretty easy to do

Speedlings on the reapers; Hydras on the Banshees.

I don't play a lot of 1v1 either way. My partner A-Typically goes air. If they go ground, I usually just Muta-Corruptor, with Broodlords later.

seraphimvc

i think people usually come out with max armor upgrade Ultralisk( 3 at evo chamber+ ultralisk den) and i usually have alot cracklings(lings with adrenal upgrade) go with ultralisk and some corruptors if possible - this is pretty unstoppable against protoss ground units, and again this can be beaten easily by that MMM ball! oh marauder marauder......i hope your day will come soon :pac:

i have never seen any reaper vs ultralisk battle tbh, never seen any reaper after early game anyway.

Overheal

Straight reapers vs. ultras would always favor reapers, with micro.

Very important to back them up with speedlings to close distance on ranged targets.