Pyjama Girls at IFI

uvox

I went to see this.

http://www.iftn.ie/distribution/DistributionNews/?act1=record&only=1&aid=73&rid=4283289&tpl=archnews&force=1

The buzz afterwards was that those kids were exploited.

Anyone else tired of middle class film makers using public money for this kinda of undergrad polemic?

gandalf

I saw this during the IFI's documentary festival a couple of months ago and I found it a quite disturbing documentary to watch partially because I felt that it was made by people who were looking down in a way at these "less fortunates" who were the subject of the film.

Nervous Wreck

I dislike the fact that these morons are trying to make some sort of, what, 'hard-hitting' documentary on the 'harsh realities' of the 'underprivileged, lower class' Irish? I really don't give a shít about girls wearing their PJs outside of their home cos they're obviously spas to do that in the first place.

DrumSteve

The project looks to capture the ups and downs of working class teenage life behind the enigmatic and subversive statement of wearing pyjamas in public.

Not been bothered about getting dressed and staying in their pyjamas so it makes it easier for ridin' does not a subversive statment make.

candy-gal1

its either going to encourage more pyjama girls :rolleyes: or going to make said people see themselves as they are and change (for the better).
I vote for the latter! no more kids having kids eh?!

Miguel_Sanchez

uvox wrote: »

The buzz afterwards was that those kids were exploited.

The buzz?

Do you think they were exploited yourself?

calex71

Time they were called out for what they are ... begins with K and ends in R

Having seen the Documentary they do themselves no favors , and totally agree with the middle class film maker comments, nail on the head there.
It's a case of who is worse for me, in this case the film makers. The word 'muppet' comes to mind.

teddy12

Where can I see this documentary? Is it only in Dublin?
Ive heard so much about it

greenbicycle

I saw this film on friday, the opening night in the IFI, some of the girls from the film were there and were asked to get up and say hello, I was so disappointed that they were not able to put themselves across well at all,they obviously had no direction from the film makers which i thought was a pity, it made me think that the experience had not benefitted them at all. they didn't say anything infront of the audience and feigned shyness however when they were sitting in their seats they had no problem shouting out stupid things and making fools of themselves.

it was a great film though, i really enjoyed it, i thought it was interesting and funny and emotional and sad. i found it particularly sad when the girls were laughing at things that were making the audience pity them, like one girl being told by a man that he could be her father down the back of a bus and a the fact that their mother was so much of a druggie that she could not look after her daughter.

it was sad to see that they thought being suspended from school,fighting in the streets and teenage pregnancy were also something to be very proud of.

I think that the film just uncovered the divide between social classes to those that were not aware of it before.

this is a documentary i would recommend seeing and i hope it does wlell both in ireland and internationally.

sorry for the long post! the film made me think lots!

greenbicycle

teddy12 wrote: »

Where can I see this documentary? Is it only in Dublin?
Ive heard so much about it

right now its only on in the IFI until thursday i think, not sure if it will be shown anywhere else.

SerialComplaint

greenbicycle wrote: »

I saw this film on friday, the opening night in the IFI, some of the girls from the film were there and were asked to get up and say hello, I was so disappointed that they were not able to put themselves across well at all,they obviously had no direction from the film makers which i thought was a pity, it made me think that the experience had not benefitted them at all. they didn't say anything infront of the audience and feigned shyness however when they were sitting in their seats they had no problem shouting out stupid things and making fools of themselves.

Haven't seen the film, but I did spot two of the girls and the director (female, English, middle/upper class) on TV3's morning show a few weeks back. The girls came across as very solid and decent Dubs - no feigned shyness on that occasion.

greenbicycle

SerialComplaint wrote: »

Haven't seen the film, but I did spot two of the girls and the director (female, English, middle/upper class) on TV3's morning show a few weeks back. The girls came across as very solid and decent Dubs - no feigned shyness on that occasion.

Yes, i saw the interview on tv3 too, it was on a good while ago. it was like they were different girls on that show, they came across much better there, i agree. i suppose thats why i was as surprised on the night i saw them.

diocane

candy-gal1 wrote: »

its either going to encourage more pyjama girls :rolleyes: or going to make said people see themselves as they are and change (for the better).
I vote for the latter! no more kids having kids eh?!

Why don't have condoms in every pocket? This days condoms must be like mobile-phones : always close to you

Richard Dower

Why glorify these no class scumbag girls...you see them everywhere in Limerick, like an infestation that continues to grow, god they make my blood boil.

Bing_IRL

greenbicycle wrote: »

right now its only on in the IFI until thursday i think, not sure if it will be shown anywhere else.

On in EYE Cinema Galway all this week!

Miguel_Sanchez

Richard Dower wrote: »

Why glorify these no class scumbag girls...you see them everywhere in Limerick, like an infestation that continues to grow, god they make my blood boil.

I don't think there's any glorification involved. Have you seen the documentary?

Sir Gallagher

greenbicycle wrote: »

I saw this film on friday, the opening night in the IFI, some of the girls from the film were there and were asked to get up and say hello, I was so disappointed that they were not able to put themselves across well at all,they obviously had no direction from the film makers which i thought was a pity, it made me think that the experience had not benefitted them at all. they didn't say anything infront of the audience and feigned shyness however when they were sitting in their seats they had no problem shouting out stupid things and making fools of themselves.

it was a great film though, i really enjoyed it, i thought it was interesting and funny and emotional and sad. i found it particularly sad when the girls were laughing at things that were making the audience pity them, like one girl being told by a man that he could be her father down the back of a bus and a the fact that their mother was so much of a druggie that she could not look after her daughter.

it was sad to see that they thought being suspended from school,fighting in the streets and teenage pregnancy were also something to be very proud of.

I think that the film just uncovered the divide between social classes to those that were not aware of it before.

this is a documentary i would recommend seeing and i hope it does wlell both in ireland and internationally.

sorry for the long post! the film made me think lots!

Maybe they were just uncomfortable and were acting up as some kind of defense mechanism, that's what young uneducated and insecure girls are like in fairness. The instances you mentioned in the film are extremely sensitive and hard hitting can you imagine the girls having to sit there while people were watching these scenes it must have been mortifying for them, i know if i was in their shoes at that screening given the subject matter i would have been extremely uncomfortable and embarrassed.

Btw i wasn't at the screening nor have i seen the film just hazarding a guess as to why the girls were acting in that manner.

Richard Dower

But wasn't it pointed out these girls reveled in the fact they were chavvy, getting into fights, preggers, all your usual inner city scumbag behaviour.....the poster even said once they sat back down they were all mouthing off and giving it large again.

Sir Gallagher

Richard Dower wrote: »

But wasn't it pointed out these girls reveled in the fact they were chavvy, getting into fights, preggers, all your usual inner city scumbag behaviour.....the poster even said once they sat back down they were all mouthing off and giving it large again.

Yes and there's a reason those girls are like that as alluded to in Greenbicycle's post i.e the father incident and the junkie mother. I just don't see why anybody would be surprised with how these girls behaved at the screening, it's an environment way out of their comfort zone.

Richard Dower

Why should these scumbags make life for others horrible?...anti social behavoiur, threats, intimidation, vandalism etc.,, fu*k 'em!....firing squad i say.

Sir Gallagher

Richard Dower wrote: »

Why should these scumbags make life for others horrible?...anti social behavoiur, threats, intimidation, vandalism etc.,, fu*k 'em!....firing squad i say.

Controversy fail.

Richard Dower

I have even more xtreme views than this, but i'd be banned and probably arrested.

Miguel_Sanchez

Richard you haven't actually seen the film and are just going on second hand reports.

Maybe you should see it and make up your own mind about things before suggesting that people are shot on the basis of what you've heard.

johnny_ultimate

Richard Dower wrote: »

Why should these scumbags make life for others horrible?...anti social behavoiur, threats, intimidation, vandalism etc.,, fu*k 'em!....firing squad i say.

Richard, this thread is to discuss the film not make offensive comments about people you don't even know.

Killinator

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

Richard, this thread is to discuss the film not make offensive comments about people you don't even know.

Although there extreme views, given hes in Limerick hes probaby had just as much first hand contact then anyone whos seen the documentary, I know I have:mad:

Miguel_Sanchez

Killinator wrote: »

Although there extreme views, given hes in Limerick hes probaby had just as much first hand contact then anyone whos seen the documentary, I know I have:mad:

The film is shot in Dublin.

greenbicycle

Just to clarify, I do not want to put down the girls in the film at all, I can see why they acted like they did on the night. they certainly did not have the best chance in life so far.

What disappointed me was that the film makers did not give the girls and tips on what the screening would be like and how people generally act at these things. It was a pity that they had not prepared the girls to get up and say hello and perhaps thank the people who had a good influence on their lives.they didnt try and "improve" the girls or give them any chance at further successes.

Perhaps this was done on purpose though, did they maybe want to expose these girls in a live environment. Prove that they actually are like they are portrayed in the film?

If people actually went to see the film they might have negative thoughts about the girls and people like them but i came away thinking that they needed more support and guidance from somewhere, their country is failing them is some way.

johnny_ultimate

Killinator wrote: »

Although there extreme views, given hes in Limerick hes probaby had just as much first hand contact then anyone whos seen the documentary, I know I have:mad:

True, but I don't really think this is the place to be airing such views, especially having not seen the film. Anti-"scumbag" threads have plagued after hours for years, just don't want to see the same sort of discussion here! For people who've seen the film and wish to air their opinions, all well and good though! I'm not a fan of this subculture either, but at least the docu appears to make some efforts at exploring it.

greenbicycle

Sir Gallagher wrote: »

Maybe they were just uncomfortable and were acting up as some kind of defense mechanism, that's what young uneducated and insecure girls are like in fairness..

I would tend to agree with this post BTW but as i said they should have been given some guidance to counteract this as i am sure other young actors are.

Miguel_Sanchez

greenbicycle wrote: »

I would tend to agree with this post BTW but as i said they should have been given some guidance to counteract this as i am sure other young actors are.

It's a documentary so they're not actors.

greenbicycle

Jeff_Lebowski wrote: »

It's a documentary so they're not actors.

you know what i was trying to say.....

replace "actors" with "people who feature in a film"

Miguel_Sanchez

greenbicycle wrote: »

you know what i was trying to say.....

replace "actors" with "people who feature in a film"

Sorry. I'm being pedantic today.

SerialComplaint

greenbicycle wrote: »

.they didnt try and "improve" the girls or give them any chance at further successes.

I'm not sure that it is the role of filmmakers to try to 'improve' their subjects. They are film-makers, not social workers, or teachers.

Sir Gallagher

greenbicycle wrote: »

Just to clarify, I do not want to put down the girls in the film at all, I can see why they acted like they did on the night. they certainly did not have the best chance in life so far.

What disappointed me was that the film makers did not give the girls and tips on what the screening would be like and how people generally act at these things. It was a pity that they had not prepared the girls to get up and say hello and perhaps thank the people who had a good influence on their lives.they didnt try and "improve" the girls or give them any chance at further successes.

Perhaps this was done on purpose though, did they maybe want to expose these girls in a live environment. Prove that they actually are like they are portrayed in the film?

If people actually went to see the film they might have negative thoughts about the girls and people like them but i came away thinking that they needed more support and guidance from somewhere, their country is failing them is some way.

I get what your saying about the filmmakers maybe trying to prepare the girls or have a word with them beforehand. The thing is though the way they behaved is in their nature, just like the pyjama wearing, it's a big "fcuk you" to society.

I actually find it funny that they acted like that at the screening and i hope it made people feel uncomfortable, rather than sitting there in their comfy seats scrutinising or trying to understand the behavior of the lower classes they got a first hand experience of it.

Sir Gallagher

SerialComplaint wrote: »

I'm not sure that it is the role of filmmakers to try to 'improve' their subjects. They are film-makers, not social workers, or teachers.

I agree but they also have a responsibility not to exploit them. Not saying the filmmakers did exploit them in fairness as i haven't seen it.

phasers

Experiencing these types of people on a daily basis (including the girls who feature in the film actually, so I can tell you they're not actors :eek:), they're just little shits. It's not any kind of statement, they're just rude, inconsiderate little brats. Excuses shouldn't be made for them.

johnny_ultimate

phasers wrote: »

Experiencing these types of people on a daily basis (including the girls who feature in the film actually, so I can tell you they're not actors :eek:), they're just little shits. It's not any kind of statement, they're just rude, inconsiderate little brats. Excuses shouldn't be made for them.

Trust me, there's been plenty of times I've been furious and irritated by the crowd blaring out crappy dance music at the back of a Dublin Bus. But isn't the goal of a documentary like this to try and figure out why they are acting that way? This is attempting to document a subcommunity: I haven't seen it yet so can't tell how effective it is in that regard. But the best documentaries tackle an issue head on. It's hard to excuse such behaviour, but I'd imagine the film goes to some lengths trying to explain the behaviour. We don't have to like it, but these kind of social examinations and commentary are necessary.

Miguel_Sanchez

phasers wrote: »

. It's not any kind of statement, they're just rude, inconsiderate little brats. Excuses shouldn't be made for them.

Sounds like the vast majority of teenagers I see from every socioeconomic background.

Shauna.Henn

TOm Dunne interviewed the director and one of the girls - interview starts about 17 minutes into Part 2 of the Friday 24th Sept show.

sarah+1

The documentary wasn't just about them wearing pyjamas. It was originally going to be a documentary about people from all parts of Dublin wearing pyjamas in public but when the directors met the two girls which the final film focuses on, they found something intriguing about their personalities and stuck with them.

Personally I don't think the film makers were looking down their noses at anyone, nor do I think they exploited the 'Pyjama Girls'. The girls were happy with the final film and how it portrayed them, and have since appeared on the Late Late show.

The film was entertaining and it captured an insight into a culture many people would never have experienced had it not been for the documentary.

It's on in Cineworld and a few other big cinemas now.

FJB

The filmmakers don't show a lot of love or consideration for their young subjects in this film. I wanted to protect the girls from these filmmakers! Especially the younger sister.