Painter/Decorater

brian076

My elderly mother has recently been ripped off by an unscrupulous P/D and I'm not sure if there's any legal way of recouping her money.

This guy has done work for her before and while we warned her that she was being over charged she went ahead and got him again.

He painted the outside of her small semi d, the back garden wall, he took 5 days to do it and charged her €5,000, which she gave him in cash.

the groutch

brian076 wrote: »

My elderly mother has recently been ripped off by an unscrupulous P/D and I'm not sure if there's any legal way of recouping her money.

This guy has done work for her before and while we warned her that she was being over charged she went ahead and got him again.

He painted the outside of her small semi d, the back garden wall, he took 5 days to do it and charged her €5,000, which she gave him in cash.

was it just one guy by himself doing the work, or a few of them?

fionnsda

the groutch wrote: »

was it just one guy by himself doing the work, or a few of them?

if it was a few of them what where they doing for 5 days?

Ghandee

brian076 wrote: »

My elderly mother has recently been ripped off by an unscrupulous P/D and I'm not sure if there's any legal way of recouping her money.

This guy has done work for her before and while we warned her that she was being over charged she went ahead and got him again.

He painted the outside of her small semi d, the back garden wall, he took 5 days to do it and charged her €5,000, which she gave him in cash.

I'm in the wrong fcuking business so!
5 grand to do a bit if painting????

I'd certainly be looking into a way to get some of that cash back!!

rubadub

brian076 wrote: »

I'm not sure if there's any legal way of recouping her money.

Do you think he did anything actually illegal?

I am not sure how the law works, can people do a job and then price whatever they want after the fact? If he said €5,000 from the start and did the job properly I doubt there is anything you can do now -as there was no actual scam going on, just a high price which unfortunately was accepted. If a shop sold a can of coke for €5000 and you accepted it then it would be the same thing.

There is a construction pricing forum here who might be of help http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/forumdisplay.php?f=1245

wyndham

brian076 wrote: »

My elderly mother has recently been ripped off by an unscrupulous P/D and I'm not sure if there's any legal way of recouping her money.

This guy has done work for her before and while we warned her that she was being over charged she went ahead and got him again.

He painted the outside of her small semi d, the back garden wall, he took 5 days to do it and charged her €5,000, which she gave him in cash.

It's the lowest of the low when "tradesmen" prey on elderly people like that.
Did she get any receipt or anything in writing at all? Given it was paid in cash, I'd imagine they are not tax compliant and could be some leverage to get some of the money back?

brian076

the groutch wrote: »

was it just one guy by himself doing the work, or a few of them?

He was by himself, in the past he's had his sons with him but this time he was on his own. I'm not too concerned that he took 5 days to do the job, it's the price he charged. €1000 per day is nice money if you can get it.

rubadub wrote: »

Do you think he did anything actually illegal?

I am not sure how the law works, can people do a job and then price whatever they want after the fact? If he said €5,000 from the start and did the job properly I doubt there is anything you can do now -as there was no actual scam going on, just a high price which unfortunately was accepted. If a shop sold a can of coke for €5000 and you accepted it then it would be the same thing.

There is a construction pricing forum here who might be of help http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/forumdisplay.php?f=1245

He didnt tell her how much it would cost before he did the job, just when he was finished. Thanks for the link.

wyndham wrote: »

It's the lowest of the low when "tradesmen" prey on elderly people like that.
Did she get any receipt or anything in writing at all? Given it was paid in cash, I'd imagine they are not tax compliant and could be some leverage to get some of the money back?

That's exactly what I was thinking. He gave no receipt and insisted on cash. I don't know whether we can report him to Revenue, or what the procedure would be, but I'd imagine he's not paying tax or vat on his income.

g32

brian076 wrote: »

My elderly mother has recently been ripped off by an unscrupulous P/D and I'm not sure if there's any legal way of recouping her money.

This guy has done work for her before and while we warned her that she was being over charged she went ahead and got him again.

He painted the outside of her small semi d, the back garden wall, he took 5 days to do it and charged her €5,000, which she gave him in cash.

The highest price I have ever seen. Did she not ask how much it would cost in advance? If she paid in cash, there will NOT be any record of this, in the event of a lawsuit. In any case, she may want to use a bank statement with the record of this withdrawal. Perhaps a witness to the cash hand-over might suffice?

tommy21

brian076 wrote: »

He was by himself, in the past he's had his sons with him but this time he was on his own. I'm not too concerned that he took 5 days to do the job, it's the price he charged. €1000 per day is nice money if you can get it.



He didnt tell her how much it would cost before he did the job, just when he was finished. Thanks for the link.



That's exactly what I was thinking. He gave no receipt and insisted on cash. I don't know whether we can report him to Revenue, or what the procedure would be, but I'd imagine he's not paying tax or vat on his income.

http://www.revenue.ie/en/contact/investigations-prosecutions-division.html

Perhaps some of the contacts there might be a useful starting point. Terrible to take advantage of someone elderly. That should have cost (depending on size of semi) maybe what - 1500-2000 at a push for the entire job? Disgraceful. While one could hypothetically lean on him by threatening to report him, you don't want to put your relatives in any danger depending on type of character he is. If you feel up to it, and bearing that in mind, I would ring and take that approach. But then again I have a few solicitors in my family!

If it makes you feel any better, my parents before foolishly paid upfront for a job that was about 30% complete - about 10,000 (!) - the guy made it look decent, but turned out to be a complete chancer that cut corners all over the place. We eventually tracked him down, got about 7000 grand back. The 3000 loss was nothing compared to the stress of it though. Another contact might be http://www.ageaction.ie/campaigning-and-policy.htm who would presumably have come across this scenario before and might be able to offer advice or suggestions.

Penrose

There is very little you can do even with written guarantees,the law doesn't work very well when it comes to freelance rip off tradesmen, good honest references are the best way to keep safe.

Never trust the guys calling to your door, had a friends elderly parents who got some guttering painting done and they guy charged 2000 for about 4 hours work. These jerks target older people because they know the get afraid or mismanage their money easily.

Boards.ie is actually good for finding good tradespeople who are out of work and would be glad to accept a job.

wyndham

Does he know you to see?

You or one of your friends/relations could get him to price a similar job. Presumably it would be a more realistic price and you could then put him on the spot and ask why he charged €1000 per day for your mothers house.

Penrose

since I know tradesmen who also know tradesmen I can tell you that alot of them are in for a quick buck, its a problem in this country that these guys have a mentality of short term gain at the expense of others, if they were honest and hard working they would actually get more work.

Enter Username

brian076 wrote: »

My elderly mother has recently been ripped off by an unscrupulous P/D and I'm not sure if there's any legal way of recouping her money.

This guy has done work for her before and while we warned her that she was being over charged she went ahead and got him again.

He painted the outside of her small semi d, the back garden wall, he took 5 days to do it and charged her €5,000, which she gave him in cash.

Hi Brian,

I recently had a similar experience to this although the price was not quite as extreme.

i confronted the chap after the money was paid (in cash) but he was not interested so i asked him to provide a reciept. He refused so I said I will be in touch the revenue. This got him thinking as I think he is not putting too many jobs through the books, he said he could not refund any of the money but did agree to do more work - it was landscaping the garden.

I think it is disgusting behaviour, with the current state of the jobs market for tradesman especially he is not doing himself any favours for any future work. Spread the word to everyone you know that he is a conman and he may be forced to listen to you

I'd be interested in knowing how this pans out.. good luck with it!

Penrose

Enter Username wrote: »

Hi Brian,

I recently had a similar experience to this although the price was not quite as extreme.

i confronted the chap after the money was paid (in cash) but he was not interested so i asked him to provide a reciept. He refused so I said I will be in touch the revenue. This got him thinking as I think he is not putting too many jobs through the books, he said he could not refund any of the money but did agree to do more work - it was landscaping the garden.

I think it is disgusting behaviour, with the current state of the jobs market for tradesman especially he is not doing himself any favours for any future work. Spread the word to everyone you know that he is a conman and he may be forced to listen to you

I'd be interested in knowing how this pans out.. good luck with it!

You see that is the problem in Ireland, short term gain. We need to think long term otherwise we get recession after recession, emigration after emigration. It is the national mentality that we need to change.

brian076

Enter Username wrote: »

Hi Brian,

I recently had a similar experience to this although the price was not quite as extreme.

i confronted the chap after the money was paid (in cash) but he was not interested so i asked him to provide a reciept. He refused so I said I will be in touch the revenue. This got him thinking as I think he is not putting too many jobs through the books, he said he could not refund any of the money but did agree to do more work - it was landscaping the garden.

I think it is disgusting behaviour, with the current state of the jobs market for tradesman especially he is not doing himself any favours for any future work. Spread the word to everyone you know that he is a conman and he may be forced to listen to you



I'd be interested in knowing how this pans out.. good luck with it!

Thanks for that. She confronted him yesterday about a previous job he's done where the paint is peeling off a wall. He agreed to come back and do it after his holidays, he's away for 2 weeks (hardly surprising). He even had the cheek to tell her that he'd have to charge her for this work, but thankfully she's got sense at last and told him where to go. She's 88, but very independent if a little gullible about money matters.

Anyway I plan to be present when and if he returns, and I had already intended to go the route of asking for a receipt detailing the work previously done, failing which I'll threaten him with the taxman. Might even give them a call to see what's the best way to approach it, I'm sure they might be interested.

Wertz

I'd have the cops waiting for that **** when he came back.
That's about a tenfold mark up on any reasonable labour costs.

I've read cases in the local paper about scumbags trying it on with elderly people for roof "repairs" and such, then being picked up for fraud when they tried to get paid; similar amounts to the OP. I don't know if this works after cash has changed hands. Did she withdraw money from a bank/PO? Would be proof that the money was in her posession...I don't know, not a legal expert but there's NO WAY I'd let someone away with that.

adgjmptw4

i would have painted the inside and the outside and supply the paint for half that

rusty999

brian076 wrote: »

My elderly mother has recently been ripped off by an unscrupulous P/D and I'm not sure if there's any legal way of recouping her money.

This guy has done work for her before and while we warned her that she was being over charged she went ahead and got him again.

He painted the outside of her small semi d, the back garden wall, he took 5 days to do it and charged her €5,000, which she gave him in cash.

Thats pretty bad and I feel bad for your mother
But heres a case thats equally as bad or even worse in my opinion:

During a brief visit to Killarney recently I picked up The Kerryman newspaper and noticed the headline: "State pays mortgage of man seeking legal aid"
It turns out that a 29 year old traveler who is charged with deception of 80,000 Euro by trying to force innocent victims to issue cheques for work he claimed to have carried out on their properties but in reality was a scam.
It turned out that not only was he seeking legal aid but the state was paying 1000 Euros a month to help him pay his 300,000 Euros mortgage.
He was in fact receiving 600 a week in benefits and social welfare payments from the state !! He had also bought a new van recently most probably for cash.
Is it any wonder the people of Ireland feel the way they do when watching cases like this and this is only ONE of many that has come to the surface concerning leeches like this who are worthless to society as a whole and are scroungers on the already struggling coffers, of whats left of this so called country of ours?
Wake up Ireland--before its too late!!!

oisinbutler

brian076 wrote: »

Thanks for that. She confronted him yesterday about a previous job he's done where the paint is peeling off a wall. He agreed to come back and do it after his holidays, he's away for 2 weeks (hardly surprising). He even had the cheek to tell her that he'd have to charge her for this work, but thankfully she's got sense at last and told him where to go. She's 88, but very independent if a little gullible about money matters.

Anyway I plan to be present when and if he returns, and I had already intended to go the route of asking for a receipt detailing the work previously done, failing which I'll threaten him with the taxman. Might even give them a call to see what's the best way to approach it, I'm sure they might be interested.

Hi, I'm a painter & decorator and I'm disgusted to hear whats happened to your mother. Guys like this give the rest of us a bad name. To be honest I wouldn't refer to this person as a tradesman, he sounds like more of a conman. A bonafide tradesman will be Vat registered and insured, unlike this person. The majority of tradesmen/craftsmen that I know are proud people that want to provide a good service for a good price.
You mentioned that his paint work is peeling away and needs to be repaired? If you like I will come out and fix this for no charge and I'll supply the paint too if theres none left over. PM me your details and we'll see if we can get it fixed up for her before xmas.

JDxtra

I'd say she might be sorted now, this thread is from over 3 years ago...

oisinbutler

JDxtra wrote: »

I'd say she might be sorted now, this thread is from over 3 years ago...

Right. In my fury I overlooked the age of the post. My bad.