Right turn - Churchtown

thesuburbs

Been reading this forum for weeks and finding it really helpful! I've my test coming up soon in Churchtown but a bit confused by a particular right turn and was just wondering if anyone's familiar with the correct approach?

It's the one at the top of Nutgrove avenue with Harvey Norman etc on your right and the turn for Nutgrove on your left. There's no separate green right filter so when the lights go green if you're the first car in line you pull into the yellow box and wait like usual but frequently there's loads of oncoming (straight on) traffic. The green for the turning right position seems to go red before the green for straight on and you often end up stranded in the box on red. Usually in those situations if I did get stuck i'd quickly complete the turn in the seconds after it turns red - I don't like doing it but sometimes you have to. In this situation that's especially dodgy because of the slight gap between both lights going red so you really have to scramble to complete it. It's fine if there's loads of cars looking to turn right from the opposite side because you can complete the turn safely but that's not usually the case.

Would you wait behind the line and not enter the box until the way ahead is clear and nobody is oncoming, meaning you might be stuck there a while? Or would you do what i've been attempting? If anyone's familiar with this turn any advice would be really appreciated, thanks

Mint Sauce

Usualy if no seperate filter for turning the right, you can enter the box junction and wait for a gap in the oncoming traffic to complete your turn. if there is a filter, wait behind the stop line until you get the green light.

If you are having lessons, may be best to get a definate answer from your instructer, any traffic controlled junctions in my area i asked my instructer when i was allowed to enter a particular box more for my own peice of mind than anyhing else.

MascotDec85

thesuburbs wrote: »

Been reading this forum for weeks and finding it really helpful! I've my test coming up soon in Churchtown but a bit confused by a particular right turn and was just wondering if anyone's familiar with the correct approach?

It's the one at the top of Nutgrove avenue with Harvey Norman etc on your right and the turn for Nutgrove on your left. There's no separate green right filter so when the lights go green if you're the first car in line you pull into the yellow box and wait like usual but frequently there's loads of oncoming (straight on) traffic. The green for the turning right position seems to go red before the green for straight on and you often end up stranded in the box on red. Usually in those situations if I did get stuck i'd quickly complete the turn in the seconds after it turns red - I don't like doing it but sometimes you have to. In this situation that's especially dodgy because of the slight gap between both lights going red so you really have to scramble to complete it. It's fine if there's loads of cars looking to turn right from the opposite side because you can complete the turn safely but that's not usually the case.

Would you wait behind the line and not enter the box until the way ahead is clear and nobody is oncoming, meaning you might be stuck there a while? Or would you do what i've been attempting? If anyone's familiar with this turn any advice would be really appreciated, thanks

I don't know the particular junction you are talking about but looked it up on Google Maps.

Basically it sounds as though the timings of the lights are chronic. That said I think if you are doing as you described you are doing the right thing.

You have to balance what is safe and what is over cautious which will end up being a lack of progress. Most certainly if you are at the head of the queue and a filter is not present enter the box and await a safe gap to turn. If that doesn't present itself until the lights have gone red so be it, make your turn after it's gone red. If you don't you are then an obstruction and the tester won't like that either!!

If you think that if you enter the junction eg. as the 3rd or 4th car and you won't get across then wait behind the stop light. If that means you have to wait until the next sequence of lights then that's what you should do.

You do seem to have it sussed though and were looking for confirmation.

coffee_cake

MascotDec85 wrote: »

If you think that if you enter the junction eg. as the 3rd or 4th car and you won't get across then wait behind the stop light.

I was instructed never to enter the junction unless I'm first in line. Only one car at a time, otherwise wait behind lights.

MascotDec85

bluewolf wrote: »

I was instructed never to enter the junction unless I'm first in line. Only one car at a time, otherwise wait behind lights.

I'd disagree with that.

The Rules of The Road state:

You must not enter the yellow box junction unless you can clear it without stopping.
An exception is when you want to turn right. In this case, you may enter the YBJ while waiting for a gap in the traffic coming from the opposite direction. However, don't enter the box if to do so would block other traffic that has the right of way.

Now to use your example, if the junction was huge and the lead car was sat in position in the middle of the junction waiting to turn right, would it make sense for a large gap of 10 - 15m behind that car to the 2nd car sitting behind the white line? No, it wouldn't.

The key is to keep as many cars progressing as possible but you have to be able to judge whether or not you will get through the lights. If you don't think you will make the turn you don't enter but there is no rule about only 1 car in the box.

**Timbuk2**

bluewolf wrote: »

I was instructed never to enter the junction unless I'm first in line. Only one car at a time, otherwise wait behind lights.

My instructor told me that as well for small junctions. But as MascotDec85 said, it doesn't always make sense.

However I have seen it that too many cars have moved up into a large junction, and when the lights change they were blocking traffic from the perpendicular direction, who had to wait until they had turned right before moving off. So you have to be able to judge will you make it.

OP, if the lights turn red after you have entered the junction, you are not breaking a red light and you are correct to turn. Once you have actually gone past the stop line, you are said to have taken ahold of the junction. Once the lights go red you will have a few seconds to turn without oncoming traffic before the other lights toggle green. Be wary of amber gamblers though.

thesuburbs

MascotDec85 wrote: »

You have to balance what is safe and what is over cautious which will end up being a lack of progress. Most certainly if you are at the head of the queue and a filter is not present enter the box and await a safe gap to turn. If that doesn't present itself until the lights have gone red so be it, make your turn after it's gone red. If you don't you are then an obstruction and the tester won't like that either!!

**Timbuk2** wrote: »

OP, if the lights turn red after you have entered the junction, you are not breaking a red light and you are correct to turn. Once you have actually gone past the stop line, you are said to have taken ahold of the junction. Once the lights go red you will have a few seconds to turn without oncoming traffic before the other lights toggle green. Be wary of amber gamblers though.

Thanks everyone! That's what I was hoping was the case but wanted to make sure I wasn't off base 'cause it is quite a difficult junction/area anyway to deal with (lots of yellow boxes, traffic, pedestrian lights, bus lane etc.) and don't want to make a stupid mistake there if I can avoid it in the test. I've only done it twice but I'll go back soon and see what exactly the story is with the red lights and practice! Cheers

Midnight_EG

I happen to know that particular turn.


If you're in the yellow box as the light goes red you can complete the turn.

thesuburbs

Midnight_EG wrote: »

If you're in the yellow box as the light goes red you can complete the turn.

Great! Thanks for the confirmation.