More and More Grant Documents and Proof

GSOIRL

Why do they even offer grants when they try their very best to make it impossible to get one.

I'm applying as an independent mature student and I feel like they're doing everything they can to stop me getting a grant.

After I first applied with tonnes of documents I was asked to send in more documents to prove
1. I have been living in Ireland for 3 of the last 5 years
2. That I live independently since October 2009

1. P21’s weren’t acceptable. I had to give them P60’s. Luckily I managed to find enough to keep them happy.
2. They wanted bills (phone, electric, gas, bank statements etc) with my name on them. Like lots of people of my age I have a prepay mobile phone, the bills where I live are in other people’s names and as I’ve had to move around Ireland for work I’ve left my bank statements going to my mother’s house for ease.

Now the newest thing they want is proof that I can support myself for 4 years. How the feck????? Because I’m independent and will be renting I need to prove to them I can afford €36,000. I can prove that I’ve worked summer jobs and part time jobs for the past few years and intend to do this for the next 4 years but this isn’t proof according to them. They need written independent proof. As I’m moving city to go to college I’ve to give up my jobs in Dublin. As I haven’t moved to Cork yet I don’t have a job. Also I will be working next summer and the summer after but I doubt my employer will give me written confirmation on this and how much I will be paid.
AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
HHHHHHHHHHH:mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad:


The whole thing is ridiculous. I know this country is messed up in loads of ways so I suppose I should of expected this crap. Viva le revolution.

Annasopra

GSOIRL wrote: »

Now the newest thing they want is proof that I can support myself for 4 years. How the feck????? Because I’m independent and will be renting I need to prove to them I can afford €36,000. I can prove that I’ve worked summer jobs and part time jobs for the past few years and intend to do this for the next 4 years but this isn’t proof according to them. They need written independent proof. As I’m moving city to go to college I’ve to give up my jobs in Dublin. As I haven’t moved to Cork yet I don’t have a job. Also I will be working next summer and the summer after but I doubt my employer will give me written confirmation on this and how much I will be paid.

On what basis have they asked you for this information? Ask them do they have some sort of rule booklet on considering grant applications and is this sort of thing in there? Challenge them a bit?

GSOIRL

I was on the phone to the grant lady from the council for nearly 40mins. She said that I have to prove that I can afford to go to college for 4 years or else they won't issue a grant.

Annasopra

GSOIRL wrote: »

I was on the phone to the grant lady from the council for nearly 40mins. She said that I have to prove that I can afford to go to college for 4 years or else they won't issue a grant.

That doesn't seem right - Did she say why they need this information? what proof are they looking for?

Contact the following:

Your local TDs (go into their clinics)
The Students Union Education Officer of the college you are going to
USI Education officer

GSOIRL

Cheers for help

She said it was to prove I could afford college and that I wouldn't have to drop out. It wasn't good enough to prove I can afford year on year. I have to prove I can afford all 4 years.

I've been in touch with my local TD's before about a similar issue and to say they were useless would be being nice.

I think contacting the college would be a good idea.

I just find the whole process very frustrating.

Annasopra

On what basis is she saying this?

The department of education rules don't mention anything like that in terms of eligibility

http://www.education.ie/servlet/blobservlet/he_heg_scheme.pdf?language=EN

CLAUSE 4: ELIGIBILITY OF CANDIDATES

To be eligible to apply for a grant under this scheme, a candidate shall fulfil the following conditions as to residence, age, academic attainment, means and nationality. A candidate’s status in relation to these conditions, as determined at the point of entry to an approved course, will continue to apply for the duration of their studies with the exception of the residency provisions of Clause 4.1 and the change in circumstances provision of Clause 8.1. A candidate’s means will be subject to review on a yearly basis.

4.1 Residence

4.1.1 The candidate shall have been ordinarily resident in the State for at least three out of the last five years immediately preceding the date on which a year of study on an approved course in an approved institution commences. If not so resident, the candidate shall have been temporarily resident outside of the State by reason of pursuing a course of study or postgraduate research at an approved institution outside of the State but within an EU Member State, and was resident in the State for at least 3 out of the 5 years immediately preceding the date on which they commenced such course of study or postgraduate research.

4.1.2 Candidates who are EU, EEA or Swiss nationals and who do not satisfy the residency requirement are eligible to apply for a means-tested fees only grant in respect of approved courses in the State, provided they have been ordinarily resident, for a purpose other than wholly or mainly to receive full-time education, in an EU Member State, the EEA or Switzerland for at least 3 of the 5 years immediately preceding the date on which a year of study on an approved course in an approved institution commences. Such candidates shall apply to the local authority in which the college they propose to attend is situated.

4.1.3 A candidate shall not be eligible to apply for, or be in receipt of, a scholarship/grant in the administrative area of more than one Vocational Education Committee or local authority.

4.2 Age
A candidate shall be at least l7 years of age on 1 January 2011.

4.3 Academic Attainment

4.3.1 Any candidate who, having sat the Leaving Certificate examination, secures a place on an approved course shall be deemed to have fulfilled the Leaving Certificate examination attainment condition for the purposes of this scheme.

4.3.2 Candidates who, having sat such school terminal examinations held and ordinarily sat in another EU Member State, secure a place on an approved course shall be deemed to have fulfilled the school terminal examination attainment condition for the purposes of this scheme.

4.3.3 A mature candidate, who secures a place on an approved course, shall be deemed to fulfil the school terminal examination attainment condition for the purposes of this scheme.

4.4 Means

4.4.1 For the award of a grant in respect of the 2010/11 academic year, a candidate's reckonable income shall conform to the income limits set out in Appendix II(A). The reckonable income shall be determined by the local authority on the basis of information supplied in the Application Form, in accordance with the requirement of the accompanying Guidance Notes. The 2010/11 Application Form and Guidance Notes form part of this scheme.

4.4.2 For the award of a special rate of maintenance grant in respect of the 2010/11 academic year, a candidate’s reckonable income shall conform to the income limits set out in Appendix III. The reckonable income shall be determined by the local authority on the basis of information supplied in the Application Form.

4.4.3 In the case of a candidate other than an independent mature candidate, the candidate's reckonable income shall be that of the candidate and of the candidate's parents or legal guardian, except where the candidate's parents are divorced, legally separated or it is established to the satisfaction of the local authority that they are separated, in which case, the candidate's reckonable income shall be that of the candidate and of the parent with whom the candidate resides. [Note: See Section D of the accompanying Guidance Notes for criteria applied by the local authority in establishing separation.]

4.4.4 In the case of an independent mature candidate, the candidate’s reckonable income shall be that of the candidate and his/her spouse, if applicable.

4.4.5 A candidate's reckonable income shall be the income for the period 1 January, 2009 to 31 December, 2009 (the tax year, 2009).

4.4.6 For the award of a special rate of maintenance grant a candidate’s reckonable income must, as at 31 December 2009, include one of the payments listed in Appendix III.

4.5 Nationality

4.5.1 Candidates must be a national of –
(i) an EU Member State,
(ii) a state which is a contracting state to the EEA Agreement,
(iii) the Swiss Confederation, or
- a refugee or other person entitled for the time being to the rights and privileges specified in section 3 of the Refugee Act 1996; or
- be a person, pursuant to the European Communities (Eligibility for Protection) Regulations 2006 (S.I. No. 518 of 2006) –
(i) who the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform has determined is eligible for the time being for subsidiary protection pursuant to Regulation 4 of those Regulations, or
(ii) to whom the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform has granted permission for the time being in writing to enter and reside in the State pursuant to Regulation 16 of those Regulations; or
- have permission to remain in the State as a family member of a Union citizen under the provisions of the European Communities (Free Movement of Persons) Regulations 2006 and 2008 and Directive 2004/38/EC of the European Parliament and of the Council; or
- have permission to remain in the State by virtue of marriage to an Irish national residing in the State, or be the dependent child of such person, not having EU nationality; or
- have been granted Humanitarian Leave to Remain in the State (prior to the Immigration Act 1999); or
- be a person in respect of whom the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform has granted permission to remain following a determination not to make a deportation order under section 3 of the Immigration Act 1999

Annasopra

GSOIRL wrote: »

Cheers for help

She said it was to prove I could afford college and that I wouldn't have to drop out. It wasn't good enough to prove I can afford year on year. I have to prove I can afford all 4 years.

I've been in touch with my local TD's before about a similar issue and to say they were useless would be being nice.

I think contacting the college would be a good idea.

I just find the whole process as very frustrating.

Ring her back - tell her that you would like to see a copy of the rules where it states that the eligibility of a grant applicant will depend on whether they can afford college - insist that you want to see a copy of the rule she is applying - if she refuses ask to speak to her manager about it

GSOIRL

Cheers again

Yeah it seems like she's making stuff up. Still want to keep he on side until I've all the other stuff sorted but once all that's left to prove is my ability to afford 4 years of college I'll start to question were it says she needs this info.

Annasopra

USI has grant information seminars this saturday in Tallaght, Ballbriggan and Aungier st - might help you to go to one of them and ask them

GSOIRL

I'd love to go but have to work. Need to make €36,000 by the 31st August so need all the work I can get

Annasopra

GSOIRL wrote: »

I'd love to go but have to work. Need to make €36,000 by the 31st August so need all the work I can get

well there is one on Tuesday evening in Bray too

GSOIRL

I've rang and left a message with the college. I'm going to call into one of my TD's clinics tomorrow and then the other TD's have clinics on Monday. I'm down in Cork on Tuesday trying to sort out a job.

I'll tell you how I get on with the TD's.

Cheers for all the info. I'm sort of suspecting they'd be happy if I didn't go to college. Probably be easier to defer for a year and go on the dole and get BETA for 4 years. That's how this genius country is trying to push me.

Tragedy

I just got the same request from(provide evidence of other income as your declared income is considered as being an insufficient income to support you through college, in line with the recommended national guidelines.) Dun Laoghaire Rathdown Higher Education Grants Section, so it isn't just one busybody doing this.

Annasopra

Seriously? Have they nothing better to do? I always understood that a grant was assessed on past income not future income!

Tragedy

http://www.education.ie/servlet/blobservlet/he_heg_scheme.pdf?language=EN
No mention of what the HEG office are saying.

I'm applying for and should hopefully get BTEA(so the grant will only be for registration fee), however I'm tempted to call them up and get seriously bolshy on the phone with them.
You can't just implement "new national guidelines" without publishing them anywhere or informing people.

Taking the piss.

GSOIRL

Tragedy wrote: »

I just got the same request from(provide evidence of other income as your declared income is considered as being an insufficient income to support you through college, in line with the recommended national guidelines.) Dun Laoghaire Rathdown Higher Education Grants Section, so it isn't just one busybody doing this.

Hi Tragedy

Well it could be just one busybody as I'm in the same area. I'm emailing all our TD's this morning in regards to this. If you kick up a bit of a fuss as well it may get more attention.

Annasopra

GSOIRL wrote: »

Hi Tragedy

Well it could be just one busybody as I'm in the same area. I'm emailing all our TD's this morning in regards to this. If you kick up a bit of a fuss as well it may get more attention.

email all the DLR councillors as well

GSOIRL

Jaysus that was a pain. Who knew there were so many councilors. I emailed the 22 that had working email addresses and my 5 TD's. Now lets see how many do anything about it.

Stuxnet

ask ivor callely, he'll get you all the documents you need

GSOIRL

Tragedy wrote: »

I just got the same request from(provide evidence of other income as your declared income is considered as being an insufficient income to support you through college, in line with the recommended national guidelines.) Dun Laoghaire Rathdown Higher Education Grants Section, so it isn't just one busybody doing this.

Well I finally got someone from the DLRCOCO to admit there has been a "misunderstanding". Mistake was too much to ask I suppose.

Anyway I've asked that they contact anyone who has been told this and been asked for information because of the misunderstanding to be contacted immediately to inform they that they don't need to prove they have sufficient funds.

I'd be interested if you get contacted or otherwise it might be worth your while giving them a ring.

InkNut

GSOIRL wrote: »

Well I finally got someone from the DLRCOCO to admit there has been a "misunderstanding". Mistake was too much to ask I suppose.

Anyway I've asked that they contact anyone who has been told this and been asked for information because of the misunderstanding to be contacted immediately to inform they that they don't need to prove they have sufficient funds.

I'd be interested if you get contacted or otherwise it might be worth your while giving them a ring.

Well Done. Fight the power:D Seriously though fair play for doing all that, its sad that someone has to get it all sorted themselves sometimes, but it goes to show that one person really can make a difference.

I wish you all the best with your future studies:)