Forestry grant

younggrinner

Hello all,

Going to plant 9ha forest later this year under coilltes aforrestation scheme. I was wondering if there was anybody out there who has done this and if so did you do the planting work yourself or did you get a contractor in?

I'm interested in doing it myself but have a feeling that, at ca 2500 plants per ha, its a gigantic workload and may be more cost effective just to get a contractor. Would be interesting to hear from anybody, specifically re plant costs and time required to get it done.

Thanks!

Saph

Maybe the Society of Irish Foresters can advise www.sif.ie

The_Conductor

Saph wrote: »

Maybe the Society of Irish Foresters can advise www.sif.ie

Its actually http://www.societyofirishforesters.ie/

Its not as simple as nipping out, buying your 25k trees and planting them.......
There are numerous very strict rules governing aforestation, land preparation, rules governing proximity to waterways, roads, residential property etc.
You need to have a professional forester do up a managment plan, ensure you comply with all guidelines, have the site inspected at all relevant stages by the Department inspector etc.......

You could spend a few days out with the contractor doing some of the planting yourself- particularly in some of the less easy to access parts of the site- which might satisfy your want to do some of the planting yourself?

Ps- in many cases you may now also need planning permission to plant forestry!!!

nmblade

But is that not all part of Coillte's farm partnership scheme? In that they will deal with all the formalities involving grant applications.

On top of that dont they do all the other stuff such as site assessment, subsequent establishment and future management plans?

Effectively I have formed the impression that Coillte actually take all the work away from the landowner, just as long as they get their cut out of the future thinnings (80:20) and clearfell (60:40) (in the case of conifers such as Sitka spruce anyway that may vary for broadleaves).

The_Conductor

nmblade wrote: »

But is that not all part of Coillte's farm partnership scheme? In that they will deal with all the formalities involving grant applications.

On top of that dont they do all the other stuff such as site assessment, subsequent establishment and future management plans?

Effectively I have formed the impression that Coillte actually take all the work away from the landowner, just as long as they get their cut out of the future thinnings (80:20) and clearfell (60:40) (in the case of conifers such as Sitka spruce anyway that may vary for broadleaves).

In short- it depends.
With the new guidelines- and esp. the stipulations regarding planning permission, there is now a body of work for which the landowner has responsibility- where previously Coillte (or Greenbelt or any other contractor) could simply go in and do the work following the go ahead from the Department.

It is also very much the case that monoculture Sitka- our bread and butter crop- is being discouraged as much as possible- in favour of mixtures, and with the best grants (as previously) being ringfenced for broadleaved crops on better land. At least we can now use many species that were once considered to be weeds (such as birch).

The reason I went into the detail I did above- was because the OP indicated they wanted to do a chunk of the work themselves........

JohnBoy

Where would one find these guidelines, in relation to the landowners responsibility?

We're looking at doing a small bit of forestry and our forester made no mention of planning permission. (maybe because it's not required for our size, but It'd be nice to see the rules for one's self)

The_Conductor

JohnBoy wrote: »

Where would one find these guidelines, in relation to the landowners responsibility?

We're looking at doing a small bit of forestry and our forester made no mention of planning permission. (maybe because it's not required for our size, but It'd be nice to see the rules for one's self)

The big change occurred in 1996 when planning permission became necessary for any afforestation that would bring the cumulative forested land in any given townland to greater than 70ha. Since then the much smaller plantations requiring planning permission have in the main been in less 'rural' areas. I'll have a dig around and see if I can find the current guidelines.

S.

nmblade

You see that's where I worry about going into a venture with Coillte, they have not done any afforestation of new land in their own estate in the last 4-5 years. Rather they have these farm partnership schemes where they're not obliged to purchase land.

Also they favour species such as Sitka spruce (at least 60% across the whole estate). Potentially there could be some kind of hidden agenda when advising landowners who would otherwise lack knowledge as what to plant etc. Although I can only anticipate this because I have never dealt with them in such a way. Their reputation has never been the most hectic either.

I'd actually like to see a case study of someone who has availed of the scheme.

doctor evil

What kind of trees and how many are planted in these schemes?

Caoimhín

A few things need to be cleared up here. I am a consultant forester and do this full time, it is the core of my business.

It is NOT a Coillte grant. It is a grant from the Department of Agriculture (Forest Service).

You can contract any company or individual forester you like (if they are on the approved list, available from the Forest Service).

The suitability of the land and the species of trees to be planted can only be assessed the grant aid applied for by an approved forester.

The plan and application is then sent to the Forest Service for approval, an inspector will usually visit the site to sign off on it.

In MOST situations you do not need planning permission from the local authority. If the land to be planted in an area of high or moderate landscape the plan will be referred to the local council for comments/suggestions/objections. Unless the proposed site is in an area of the county specifically mentioned in the county development plan as "specially preserved" ie the Burren etc, the county council cannot stop the establishment. (I had this out with Roscommon County Council this year). The Forest Service has the final say on the proposal to plant and what to plant.

Once the land has been planted in accordance with the Afforestation guild lines; http://www.teagasc.ie/forestry/financial_info/fin_suppt/afforestation_grant_rates.asp
It will then be re-inspected by the Forest Service before payment. All work on the site must be carried out by Vat registered, insured sub-contractors with tax clearance. Again, the application to draw down the grant must be made by an approved forester/forestry company.

There are a number of different schemes available. The standard is afforestation but there is also FEPS and the Native Woodland Scheme. To establish which is best for you I would strongly suggest that you meet with the local Teagasc forester on site to discuss this. The Teagasc service is free and impartial..

It is standard for most companies/consultant foresters to provide a 4 year "establishment" contract. 25% of the grant aid is withheld by the Forest Service until year 4 to ensure correct establishment and maintenance of the forest.

I won’t make any comments about the Coillte "Farm partnership scheme" here as it is not appropriate, but it is up to you to do your homework before you sign the contract. Forestry is a long term venture, sometimes covering 2 generations so do not enter into any contract without getting independent advice.

The_Conductor

doctor evil wrote: »

What kind of trees and how many are planted in these schemes?

Depends on the species, the mix (if any) in use, and the site. Whether the forestry is being planted as a commercial concern- or for other purposes can have an impact as well.

barbersfort

I had 9 Ha planted on medium quality clay based land; we went for a mixture of broadleaf and Scots Pine as part of FEPS scheme; it took the forester and his guys a considerable amount of time to prepare the land (dig gullies etc) and carry out planting. There is no way I could have done the same in the same timescale and to the same level of work.

Im very pleased with their results along with their subsequent after care (e.g they had to replace over 2500 trees in yr 2 alone).

mcmahonp

younggrinner wrote: »

Hello all,

Going to plant 9ha forest later this year under coilltes aforrestation scheme. I was wondering if there was anybody out there who has done this and if so did you do the planting work yourself or did you get a contractor in?

I'm interested in doing it myself but have a feeling that, at ca 2500 plants per ha, its a gigantic workload and may be more cost effective just to get a contractor. Would be interesting to hear from anybody, specifically re plant costs and time required to get it done.

Thanks!

Best to talk to a local private Forestry consultant. You'll need one to ensure you make the right decisions and to apply for any grants.

http://www.societyofirishforesters.ie/consultantforesters.htm#list