South on Track (Patrickswell/Charleville alignment to be preserved)

Sponge Bob

The Dept of Transport asked the South Western ( and I equally assume the Mid Western) regional authoritity to preserve the alignment. So they intend to.

South on Track should walk it and photo it sharpish before the industrious yeomanry of rural Limerick bulldozes it

http://www.swra.ie/contentFiles/newsImages/Final_Directors_Report_on_submissions.pdf

The Department of Transport, while noting that the construction of a direct rail link between Charleville to Patrickswell, is not within the current
investment framework, recognises that it makes good sense to protect the
alignment and route of the Cork – Limerick direct rail corridor.

dowlingm

*facepalm*

Bit late to preserve something already impaired by roads, and the chances of rebuilding it in the next 30 years are hugely unlikely. How about spending the money (and there will be some to undertake studies and other bureaucratic timewasting) on doing something - anything - with the Limerick-Patrickswell bit. Light rail. A busway. A greenway. A poetry trail. SOMETHING.

Stonewolf

Complete waste of time and money unless they intend to preserve not just the track bed but a corridor which would allow any future rebuild to take a route unlimited by Victorian engineering as the WRC rebuild should have taught us all.

Hungerford

IIRC there's a CIE social club on the alignment close to Limerick station.

Seriously, the chances of the project ever getting built are about the same as me being appointed chief executive of Iarnrod Eireann.

corktina

what a nonsense idea!

dowlingm

In fairness, if that's where the direct curve is the X-Files lads would have a hard time finding it. You'd probably have to buy out a bunch of the adjoining houses to avoid a noise problem given how long it's probably been since it was used last (1960s probably?)

I was looking at it in Bing Maps and my eye wandered - is this a burned out car I see before me? (Cancel the 3d, switch to Birds Eye and zoom in one level)

Chris_5339762

Am I the only one who thinks this is a good idea?

I've always said that Cork - Dublin trains should go via Limerick. If the whole line was 200kmh capable it would make sense. Granted, a lot of work would need to be done but at least they're preserving whats left of the alignment rather than building on it.

Sponge Bob

Brian Guckian is too late to submit any of these proposals ....if he is reading this. Public consultation on Regional plans closed in early summer .

The Charleville - Patrickswell idea was thrown around on Boards before. What is interesting is that the DoT picked it up and requested the Regional Planning Authorities run with it.

Victor

All the old alignments, within reason, should be protected.

Chris_5339762

We're being watched.

Judgement Day

A bit late in the day.

dermo88

The route you show the link to on the Bing map is the former Limerick to Foynes line which is under Iarnrod Eireann's so called "care and maintainance" program. Which, if railways had personalities, is a bit like being the son of Frank Gallagher in shameless. Further west, the line deviates and heads south from Patrickswell towards Killmallock, via Croom and Bruree (best known as DeValeras birthplace).

It has not carried a regular passenger service since 1934, and was only used for the GS&WR to gain access to Limerick City prior to 1901, for some reason or other the Waterford and Limerick company did not cooperate with them very well, until they (WL&WR) were forced to merge after a subsidy was withdrawn in 1900.

By all accounts the alignment looks like suffering from the perennial curse of late built Irish railways, lots of level crossings, steep gradients, light construction. Which.......

is why it closed in the first place. Still.....its kind of them to dream up a better alternative for Limerick to Cork, if its required.

dowlingm

Chris_5339762 wrote: »

Am I the only one who thinks this is a good idea?

I'm guessing you're the only one with enough money in his pocket to relay, realign, resignal and re-equip the trackage in question (basically Portlaoise-Limerick-Charleville), so...

corktina

dowlingm wrote: »

I'm guessing you're the only one with enough money in his pocket to relay, realign, resignal and re-equip the trackage in question (basically Portlaoise-Limerick-Charleville), so...

Yes, Im afraid its only a good idea on paper. Diverting via Patrickswell would scarcely improve the service or increase passengers whilst doubling the expenses. A far better idea would be to re-build Lim Junc and improve the services and connections there.

foggy_lad

These old alignments and old tracks from the age of steam should all be cleared off the map unless there is some historic non railway reason to turn them into something as they will never make proper functioning railways again. There is no longer a need for stations in the middle of nowhere whose sole purpose was to provide water coal etc for locomotives.

It is 2010 not 1810 or 1910 and railways will have to modernise or die and that means forgetting about where they once used to go and what they once were, and concentrating on how to get people to places they want to go today not where they went 100 years ago!

westtip

foggy_lad wrote: »

These old alignments and old tracks from the age of steam should all be cleared off the map unless there is some historic non railway reason to turn them into something as they will never make proper functioning railways again. There is no longer a need for stations in the middle of nowhere whose sole purpose was to provide water coal etc for locomotives.

It is 2010 not 1810 or 1910 and railways will have to modernise or die and that means forgetting about where they once used to go and what they once were, and concentrating on how to get people to places they want to go today not where they went 100 years ago!

Greenways. The simple answer and will grow tourism.

Judgement Day

westtip wrote: »

Greenways. The simple answer and will grow tourism.

On your bike...:D

Sponge Bob

Greenways in scenic areas....by all means. But in middle Limerick or for that matter in South Sligo ????

Newport - Mulraney - Achill or Camp - Dingle makes sense.

Partizan

Is there a case to reopen part of the Foynes line as far as Rathkeale and establish a commuter service for Rathkeale, Adare, Patrickswell and Raheen for Limerick city?

Sponge Bob

I am considering making 'a case' for a hybrid sort of railcar that can tow bicycles in a chained convoy behind it on a hybrid trackway with a bicycle lane on top of the sleepers ...coz the Greens would absolutely love that being the utter dipsticks they are.

But a 'business' case for Limerick South Western Suburban services. No!

westtip

Sponge Bob wrote: »

Greenways in scenic areas....by all means. But in middle Limerick or for that matter in South Sligo ????

Newport - Mulraney - Achill or Camp - Dingle makes sense.

Sponge take a look at the sustrans website they have greenways now in the uk running through major urban areas...and they are used as alternative routes for commuting.

westtip

Partizan wrote: »

Is there a case to reopen part of the Foynes line as far as Rathkeale and establish a commuter service for Rathkeale, Adare, Patrickswell and Raheen for Limerick city?

no

flyingsnail

westtip wrote: »

no

Why?

Sponge Bob

It would be the economics of the madhouse. Even Willie O'Dea wouldn't promise it

Express buses would do the trick save for Foynes which would be a local bus.

T Corolla

Partizan wrote: »

Is there a case to reopen part of the Foynes line as far as Rathkeale and establish a commuter service for Rathkeale, Adare, Patrickswell and Raheen for Limerick city?

Is there a population density sufficent to justify. I prefer if they work on the section between Limerick Station and Ennis first before making cases for anymore lines.

Sponge Bob

Oh....and the Rathkeale Bypass is built where Rathkeale Station once was , here . Toggle 25" map on and off .

dowlingm

I'd be more concerned about getting Irish Cement traffic off the roads via the Mungret track than passenger to Rathkeale, not to mention the shale traffic. Back in the day there might have been scope to build a freight platform at Raheen when the industrial estate was bombing along but I think that opportunity has passed.

The ore deposit at Pallasgreen did create some interest in shipping it via Foynes if developed but if that was ever contemplated it would probably be better to build a new 15km alignment from Mungret to Askeaton rather than barrelling around Adare to get to Foynes on the existing alignment. For the money required to do that you could probably triple track and gold plate the Oola-Belview trackage instead.

Edit to note - the SFPC did want to get freight going to Foynes but IE wanted them to bear all the costs of reinstating service on a track that was, ha ha, "under care and maintenance". This is partially government's fault since they won't assist rail freight directly.

Sponge Bob

On that general point, there is a huge amount of international interest in orebodies in Limerick, particularly Zinc Ore, Pallasgreen is one such and is close to the Limerick Junction line and ore could be shipped out via Foynes ( see right) as the Silvermines ore was until some years back.

IE does not carry freight EXCEPT for Zinc Ore nowadays, from Tara in Navan. I dread to think of it on that sh1theap of a road the N24

The most recent large ( world class) find is in Stonepark which is halfway between the LJ line and the direct alignment. Prospecting will continue in a WSW direction from there on a Fedamore Monaster Croom sort of line.

Soon as they reach Croom with a large find you announce the formation of SOT Dowlingm

Sponge Bob

Sponge Bob wrote: »

On that general point, there is a huge amount of international interest in orebodies in Limerick, particularly Zinc Ore, Pallasgreen is one such and is close to the Limerick Junction line and ore could be shipped out via Foynes ( see right) as the Silvermines ore was until some years back.

IE does not carry freight EXCEPT for Zinc Ore nowadays, from Tara in Navan. I dread to think of it on that sh1theap of a road the N24

The most recent large ( world class) find is in Stonepark which is halfway between the LJ line and the direct alignment. Prospecting will continue in a WSW direction from there on a Fedamore Monaster Croom sort of line.

Soon as they reach Croom with a large find you announce the formation of SOT Dowlingm

I'm convinced at this stage that Fianna Fáil have too many vested interests in roads to support rail freight. While we are a small country there are some flows that could be transported by rail but there's no interest from the powers that be.

And I won't let IE off the hook here either, the current management don't seem interested either. The situation at Foynes is an absolute farce, a busy port with a rail link which IE refuse to use.

dowlingm

Has Limerick Port moved downriver? I know SFPC wanted to do it but there was resistance from some in the city (those who weren't lining up to build yet more hotels on the vacant quays)

Stonewolf

Sponge Bob wrote: »

I am considering making 'a case' for a hybrid sort of railcar that can tow bicycles in a chained convoy behind it on a hybrid trackway with a bicycle lane on top of the sleepers ...coz the Greens would absolutely love that being the utter dipsticks they are.

But a 'business' case for Limerick South Western Suburban services. No!

http://www.yeskafei.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/27803.jpg

YFlyer

Karsini wrote: »

And I won't let IE off the hook here either, the current management don't seem interested either. The situation at Foynes is an absolute farce, a busy port with a rail link which IE refuse to use.

Hi Karsini

Would you know if there is any word of the Limerick Foynes line opening with Fine Gael now in government?

Dan Neville was furious when the line was closed to bulk.

I'm involved in writing a EU proposal with University of Limerick, Shannon Development and others in utilising the biomass resources in the MidWest region for fuel and platform chemicals.

Thanks

Ray

dowlingm

I think the question was not would we see Foynes reopened but would Sean Barrett close the whole thing. Luckily for Irish Rail employees he'll be Ceann Comhairle instead

Judgement Day

dowlingm wrote: »

I think the question was not would we see Foynes reopened but would Sean Barrett close the whole thing. Luckily for Irish Rail employees he'll be Ceann Comhairle instead

Not the Sean Barrett you're thinking of - he is an economist who occupies one of the 'ivory towers' in TCD.

westtip

Victor wrote: »

All the old alignments, within reason, should be protected.

They are all needed for the National Cyle network

dowlingm

Judgement Day wrote: »

Not the Sean Barrett you're thinking of - he is an economist who occupies one of the 'ivory towers' in TCD.

seriously? I thought they were the same guy for years!
:eek: