Old Dublin bus refund tickets

MTT

I recently came across an envelope full of very old Dublin Bus refund tickets, when I say old they are in £'s not €.

Does anyone know if they can still be cashed in, I'm assuming there is a time limit.

HxGH

MTT wrote: »

I recently came across an envelope full of very old Dublin Bus refund tickets, when I say old they are in £'s not €.

Does anyone know if they can still be cashed in, I'm assuming there is a time limit.

You could give them a call perhaps?
If you don't want to waste your time heading into town?

http://www.dublinbus.ie/Contact-Us1/

xOxSinéadxOx

I can't imagine they would go out of date, it's your change!

ilovelove

I can imagine they would go out of date. In fairness most things have a "window" in order to get you're refund, its like cashing a cheque,they have 6 months until they go bad. None the less, ring them up and see what they can do, no harm in trying!!

BenShermin

According to Dublin Bus themselves refund tickets never go out of date.

They should give you a rate of £1 punt = 1.27

andy jackson

hi ,
no - there is no time limit on change tickets ,

just a suggestion , i suppose depending on how much your tickets are worth , but a lot of charities welcome these change tickets ,
have a look at charity boxes in your local shops - quite a few of these boxes say " we welcome bus change tickets"

andy . dublin bus driver

L1011

Dublin Bus would be relatively happy to get those tickets out of circulation, so to speak, as they're not allowed reclaim the refund money - although I'd imagine they scoop off the interest from the fund!

MTT

Thanks everyone for your advice. Andy, I'll take your advice as you are a dublin bus driver!
thanks

liger

andy jackson wrote: »

hi ,
no - there is no time limit on change tickets ,


andy . dublin bus driver

I always thought that refund tickets were valid for 12months. A couple of years back there was an article in the papers that as DB weren't allowed to keep the money and couldn't be expected to hold onto it forever. A donation of 265k worth of epuipment/toys etc was made to Our Ladys hospital in crumlim that year. Now DB have the community scheme that charities/groups apply to each summer for funding. Isn't that being funded ( at least in part) by unclaimed refund tickets??

amacachi

liger wrote: »

I always thought that refund tickets were valid for 12months. A couple of years back there was an article in the papers that as DB weren't allowed to keep the money and couldn't be expected to hold onto it forever. A donation of 265k worth of epuipment/toys etc was made to Our Ladys hospital in crumlim that year. Now DB have the community scheme that charities/groups apply to each summer for funding. Isn't that being funded ( at least in part) by unclaimed refund tickets??

Yeah I thought at some interval or other they invalidated tickets beyond a certain age and donated the amount they tallied to to charity. Or we had a shared dream. :pac:

L1011

The make an assumption it'll never be claimed after a certain time but they'll pay it out anyway - they have to. Realistically the trickle of decade+ old tickets coming in can easily be covered by the ones that are never claimed from current issue.

dandruff_ie

andy jackson wrote: »

hi ,
no - there is no time limit on change tickets ,

just a suggestion , i suppose depending on how much your tickets are worth , but a lot of charities welcome these change tickets ,
have a look at charity boxes in your local shops - quite a few of these boxes say " we welcome bus change tickets"

andy . dublin bus driver

well said Andy

If you did not miss the tickets in the first place maybe you can give it to charity

Kevin Dublin Bus Driver

Cookie_Monster

liger wrote: »

I always thought that refund tickets were valid for 12months. A couple of years back there was an article in the papers that as DB weren't allowed to keep the money and couldn't be expected to hold onto it forever. A donation of 265k worth of epuipment/toys etc was made to Our Ladys hospital in crumlim that year. Now DB have the community scheme that charities/groups apply to each summer for funding. Isn't that being funded ( at least in part) by unclaimed refund tickets??

ticket valid for ever basically. DB can only hold the money for a year though. If you claim after this they just have to take the hit. Though in reality they will just take it against other current "holding" money as they will never be in the situation where they will have to pay out 100%

Celtise

I had just been wondering if there was a limit on claiming refunds since the website didn't indicate (as far as I saw) so thanks for answering. However it does say: "Keep the refund section attached to your original ticket." Is this enforced? I hope not as I always just kept the refund part.

L1011

Celtise wrote: »

I had just been wondering if there was a limit on claiming refunds since the website didn't indicate (as far as I saw) so thanks for answering. However it does say: "Keep the refund section attached to your original ticket." Is this enforced? I hope not as I always just kept the refund part.

Never had it enforced. Also, cause some drivers don't issue them unless pushed I've had some that have never *been* attached before.

I think they just want it intact enough to have all the codes on it, which doesn't require the original at all.

AlekSmart

MYOB wrote: »

Never had it enforced. Also, cause some drivers don't issue them unless pushed I've had some that have never *been* attached before.

I think they just want it intact enough to have all the codes on it, which doesn't require the original at all.

The "Change Tickets" are valid in perpetuity which essentially means for ever and ever and ever Amen.

The only qualifier being that the Change Ticket must be accompanied by the commensurate Travel Ticket,although that requirement,I understand is not widely enforced.

However,just to address NYOB`s point about "some" Busdrivers not issuing them.

With the Autofare system the Driver does not handle cash at all,in fact,on Autofare routes,to attempt to handle any cash in a fare transaction is a serious disciplinary matter which could result in suspension/dismissal (Many Drivers are blissfully unaware of this).

The entire area of the Cash Fare transaction has now developed into what is probably the largest single source of delay on the City`s Bus Service.

With 50% of customers still being facilitated to use cash,it would appear that none of the relevant authorities,particularly the Dept of Transport-NTA,have any understanding of what the term "Dwell Time at Stops" actually means.

The last set of figures I saw outlined the following scenario...

Regular Contactless (Smart) Transaction - 3 seconds
Impeded Contactless Transaction (Misread/Represent) - 5 sec
Regular Cash Transaction (No Change) - 7 sec
Regular Cash/Change ticket Issue - 9 sec

If you superimpose these seconds onto a very busy route,for example a 16 or 16A at 5 major City Centre Stops you can begin to see a very undesirable situation developing before your eyes.

The actuality of the Cash Transaction is also worthwhile dissecting as it is nowhere as simple as may be first thought.

Of the 50% cash customers I would suggest 50% of them are long term regular customers who Know,or think they know,their correct fare.

These folks just have the amount already counted and simply drop it in the Vault with a " €1.15-€1.60-€1.80-€2.20 Please",take their ticket and move on....grand...the best possible example of the cash transaction.

The remaining 50% of the 50% ( ) are the ones which require some understanding and attention.

Within this group can lurk several sub-groups which in the context of Bus Route operation can cause it to sink,swim or just STOP.

There is the serial underpayer,who boards at a Stop and asks for a €1.15....Now the Driver knows that this fare expires at a stop/stage rarely used by any body and proceeds to enquire as to the customers destination.....which may be quite difficult to ascertain.

The correct phraseology would be "How far are you travelling" or "What journey are you making" as some people can react negatively to "Where r ya goin,Bud"

"Ah sorry...thats €1.60"...Response ,"But But But..I ALWAYS pay €1.15 etc etc" and thus the DELAY begins....

Next up in the 50% of the 50% comes the change-ticketeer.

My ideal ones,yet again,the Filipinos !

On the rare occasion when they do not have the exact fare or a pre-paid ticket,the Filipino will hold up their €2 coin directly to the Drivers face and ask for their lower fare.

Grand..this enables the driver to pre-enter the amount into the Ticket Machine and Bingo !...the change ticket issues along with the Trave Ticket. RESULT !

Interestingly,it will be seen that we are now getting down to perhaps 25% of 50% of 50% and herein be devils...:eek:

The customer who drops in a group of coins and asks for a specific cash fare..."€1.60 Please" .....then pauses..."Excuse me you never gave me my change ticket"

"How much didja put in"......etc etc....

When a customer drops in an amount of Coin and asks for a cash-fare I will take it on trust that that is the amount he/she has tendered and issue the Travel Ticket instantaneously.

(I would suggest that 90% of my cash customers are scrupulously honest with the remainder dividing between genuine mistakes and chancers)

Now,heres the kick....If customers require the unadvised Change Ticket,I can decide to inspect each cash transaction individually,a process which if performed for one will be performed for all and that WILL result in a gigantic delay to the journey for everybody.

So I take it on trust and nod through the occasional €1.43 and a couple of brass farthings or the odd shirt button,cos it`s in the interest of keeping the journey going for everybody else,50% of whom have utilized a non-cash method.

It should also be noted that a substantial number of my customers drop in a €2 coin for their lesser fare and simply walk on without any comment,pause or other delay...quite obviously seeing €2 as a reasonable amount for their Bus journey.

Please do remember that the Busdriver has no interaction with Cash at any stage in the proceedings,so your change is not going into some Worldwide Confraternity of Busdrivers Tea-Money or similar.

The unclaimed change-ticket money is lodged into a special account (Non-Interest bearing I believe ?) with a mechanism now in place which allows sums to be disbursed back into the Community via the "Community Support Programme" something which has benefitted many voluntary local groups throughout the City.

Apologies for (another !) long post,but I hope it goes some way to offer an alternative view of the current situation on the platform.

The Platform cash-transaction is the Bus version of severe indigestion.

Given the single-door single aisle design of our fleet it is now the greatest source of self-imposed delay on Bus services,a situation which seems set to continue as the Authorities are markedly reluctant to offer real incentives to switch to contactless card use.

Just to end on this issue,take a look at TfL in London and their Oyster Card.

A single Bus journey in London`s central zone will cost a cash-payer £2 stg.....paid off bus at a kerbside machine.
A single Oyster Bus Journey will cost 90p.....Thats how you spell INCENTIVE.

Fast Forward to modern go-ahead Ireland and we see the imminent introduction of our Integrated Ticketing Product....

From what we have been told by The Integrated Ticketing Implimentation Board it is proposed to INCREASE the current cash Busfares by an amount,this process is already underway.

Then,later this year,the NEW! Integrated Ticket "Product" will be introduced with it`s charging scale at the old rate..ie: the present cash scale...."sure`n isn`t that a discount...?"

We badly need a facepalm smiley on this Thread !!! :eek:

BenShermin

Great post as always Alex.

One thing I have noticed of late on one of the new "network direct" routes (I won't name the route) is drivers not knowing the fare stage scheme for the route. Point to point on this route I travel 12 stages. The fare for this is €1.80, but a few times the driver has stated that the fare is actually €2.20 because the driver himself is unaware that the destination is within the 8 to 13 stages zone.

This results in me politely correcting the driver as to the actual fare and searching through my pockets filled with change, Fine Gael propoganda flyers and loose Fishermans Friends that fell out of the packet to find an old bus ticket to prove that I am not trying to scam Dublin Bus out of 40c.

Cue the tut tuts from fellow commuters who assume I'm delaying the service and it doesn't make a pretty picture at all. It gets worse when I've proven the fare is €1.80 and I then politely inform Mr Busdriver that I dropped €2 in the slot and that he owes me a 20c refund slip:P!

It's bad enough that the bus is delayed by people asking "here Mister, is Merrion Square in town?", or "ya wah, I thought the 39a went through da village," without the driver not even knowing the fare scheme.

I dream of a day when I can just swipe a prepaid card across a yellow circle to gain access to buses, trains and trams. With the economy the way it is my dream might come true, I might end up emigrating to London someday:rolleyes:!

antoinolachtnai

Strictly speaking, the driver is right and you are wrong, even though you are right.

The bylaws on Dublin Bus make it clear that determining the correct fare is a matter for the driver, not the passenger. If you have a problem with the fare charged, that is really something you should take up with Dublin Bus.

This will not change with the integrated ticket. You will still need to state your destination to the driver and he will need to determine the correct ticket to issue onto your smartcard.

BenShermin

antoinolachtnai wrote: »

Strictly speaking, the driver is right and you are wrong, even though you are right.

The bylaws on Dublin Bus make it clear that determining the correct fare is a matter for the driver, not the passenger. If you have a problem with the fare charged, that is really something you should take up with Dublin Bus.

So in other words I should waste MY time and money on endless phonecalls and 55c stamps to 59 Upper O'Connell Street to claim back the 40c that I'm owed?

I'm sorry, but I think if it happens again I will once again argue the point on the ground and I believe that the "human" driver behind the screen will accept the mistake and issue the correct fare. It saves me the hassle of making a formal complaint and it saves the driver possible disciplinary action against him as a result of the formal complaint.

I know you're only strictly speaking, but if there was paperwork for every single little mistake I don't think our society would make any progress. The law is an ass and all that.

L1011

AlekSmart wrote: »

However,just to address NYOB`s point about "some" Busdrivers not issuing them.

I know the driver's can't be obtaining cash from it; its just from experience of when I used the bus regularly (when Maynooth was 2.20 the first time around before going back to 2) there were a few specific drivers who appeared to be blind as to the shape of 50c/€1 coins and had to be poked for your 30/80c receipt.

AlekSmart

BenShermin: One thing I have noticed of late on one of the new "network direct" routes (I won't name the route) is drivers not knowing the fare stage scheme for the route. Point to point on this route I travel 12 stages. The fare for this is €1.80, but a few times the driver has stated that the fare is actually €2.20 because the driver himself is unaware that the destination is within the 8 to 13 stages zone.

A veritable masterclass in the intricacies of the Fare/Stage system as operated by Dublin Bus.

However Ben,please do bear in mind that somebody in Dublin Bus`s senior managerial team felt it worthwhile to erase all Stage Markings from Bus Stops on our network.

The only Stages left marked can be counted on the fingers of a hand and a half.

Now,the lack of Stage Markings is not a particular imposition on a grizzled oul lad like myself,but can you imagine what this total absence means to a person from Nigeria,Romania,Lithuania or wherever who is trying to do their job correctly ?

The presence of a Stage number on the relevant stop totally removes any and all ambiguity from the process.
It also allows the customer the luxury of deciding for themselves whether to walk to the next Stage if that will reduce their Fare.

It`s one thing to have Stage Markings missing,but it`s a far more serious and basic issue to have a company remove all traces of these while continuing to insist that the Fare/Stage system remains it`s basic method of charging.

Why were these markings so comprehensively removed ?

In common with the Country in general,nobody appears to give a Toss one way or the other.... :eek: