ceefax on UPC digital.

deanh

have noticed since yesterday that it is not available on BBC1 and 2 on digital cable, in Cork. Has anyone else noticed this? Does it mean anything about future services e.g. interactivity? or am I just pointlessly speculating?

jack presley

deanh wrote: »

have noticed since yesterday that it is not available on BBC1 and 2 on digital cable, in Cork. Has anyone else noticed this? Does it mean anything about future services e.g. interactivity? or am I just pointlessly speculating?

I've the HD Digital+ box from UPC and even the teletext that they do have is rubbish. It takes an age to get to an Aertel page.

Alun

Yes it seems to have disappeared alright, maybe this is associate with DSO in the UK, and the feed that UPC use for their BBC channels?

Alun

jack presley wrote: »

I've the HD Digital+ box from UPC and even the teletext that they do have is rubbish. It takes an age to get to an Aertel page.

It's the same teletext/ceefax feed that everyone gets. Of you're not happy with the teletext function of the UPC box just do what I do and use the one on your TV. The UPC box one has no memory, as opposed to most modern TV's that effectively have every page ready in memory after they've been on for a few minutes, so the experience is more like it was in the old days when you just had to wait for each page to come along.

deanh

Alun wrote: »

Yes it seems to have disappeared alright, maybe this is associate with DSO in the UK, and the feed that UPC use for their BBC channels?

Yes, that is what I was thinking Alun as the feed was sourced from analogue?. What with teletext on UTV and C4 gone, I wish a replacement interactive service could be added.

jack presley

Alun wrote: »

It's the same teletext/ceefax feed that everyone gets. Of you're not happy with the teletext function of the UPC box just do what I do and use the one on your TV. The UPC box one has no memory, as opposed to most modern TV's that effectively have every page ready in memory after they've been on for a few minutes, so the experience is more like it was in the old days when you just had to wait for each page to come along.

Unfortunately there's no analogue feed with the UPC Digital+ HD box so I can't switch to analogue when i want to read teletext. This is what I used to do when I had my old UPC box but when i upgraded this option went too!

Alun

jack presley wrote: »

Unfortunately there's no analogue feed with the UPC Digital+ HD box so I can't switch to analogue when i want to read teletext. This is what I used to do when I had my old UPC box but when i upgraded this option went too!

You can still feed the analogue signal to your TV with a splitter or simple T-connector. I do this even on my Thomson box that does have an analogue output because it rather stupidly filters out the lower frequencies that CH4 and Discovery are on in my area (still).

icdg

Gone here in Dublin too, as well as on BBC One NI analogue. Still on BBC Two NI analogue though.

SPDUB

icdg wrote: »

Gone here in Dublin too, as well as on BBC One NI analogue. Still on BBC Two NI analogue though.

Was still working Bank Holiday monday night on BBC1 NI analague but had stopped working by sometime during the breakfast news

djimi

Not trying to be smart but do people still use teletext? Surely if you have an internet connection then teletext is kind of obselete?

jack presley

djimi wrote: »

Not trying to be smart but do people still use teletext? Surely if you have an internet connection then teletext is kind of obselete?

That involves getting up off the couch and moving to the PC on the other side of the room. I can't be doing that!

djimi

Thats precisely why I bought a netbook and a phone with WiFi on it; once I sit down I dont have to get up for anything!

chuckles30

does anyone know why it's gone or if it will be back? I can't find anything to suggest that it's been switched off. Or is it just something specific to UPC? My mother has UPC and uses teletext all the time.......she doesn't even know how to work a computer, but I've got my ear bent all weekend because ceefax is gone!!!
I have Sky and can get the digital teletext no problem.

Mountjoy Mugger

Gone on BBC1 (digital) but working on BBC2 (digital) on UPC HD box.

deanh

back working this evening on BBC2 in Cork.

WLSM

djimi wrote: »

Not trying to be smart but do people still use teletext? Surely if you have an internet connection then teletext is kind of obselete?

Thousands of hard of hearing/deaf people in Ireland use it for the 888 subtitles - they can't watch tv without it. It's the only reason my mother pays for the UPC package. It's no good to her and thousands others without the teletext. BBC1 and C4 are gone on her tv so far. I called UPC who say it is because of the source they use and they may be changing it in a few months time. ITV is to go and maybe others in the meantime.

Why pay for these channels if you can't use them? I am going to switch the mother over to Sky.
Has anyone had any issues with the 888 Subtitles on the Sky package?

djimi

WLSM wrote: »

Thousands of hard of hearing/deaf people in Ireland use it for the 888 subtitles - they can't watch tv without it. It's the only reason my mother pays for the UPC package. It's no good to her and thousands others without the teletext. BBC1 and C4 are gone on her tv so far. I called UPC who say it is because of the source they use and they may be changing it in a few months time. ITV is to go and maybe others in the meantime.

Why pay for these channels if you can't use them? I am going to switch the mother over to Sky.
Has anyone had any issues with the 888 Subtitles on the Sky package?

If you hit the info button on a channel on UPC cant you select to turn the subtitles on? You can using the HD+ box anyway.

WLSM

We just have the normal digital box, don't have HD+

djimi

It cant handle subtitles, no? (Im not arguing, just curious). My gf used to have the little grey box in her old apartment and as far as I can remember you could turn on subtitles in the info section of that box too.

dunworth1

djimi wrote: »

It cant handle subtitles, no? (Im not arguing, just curious). My gf used to have the little grey box in her old apartment and as far as I can remember you could turn on subtitles in the info section of that box too.

i have one of the sagem boxes and can turn on thes ubtitles via the button on the remote

Alun

WLSM wrote: »

We just have the normal digital box, don't have HD+

Doesn't matter, all the digital boxes do subtitles.

WLSM

Hi,
It's not that the box can't handle subtitles, it can - it's that UPC have discontinued this service for some of the channels (BBC1, C4 and ITV in time) in some areas. The source they use is different to that used by Sky for these channels.

They didn't give any notice or info on it as far as I know - the response from their customer service was simply "oh yeah, we don't do it any more for those channels" - I wasn't satisfied with that answer so I've asked them to come back to me with the technical details, the customer service girl didn't know the why or when about it.

marclt

Don't get sky in that case, just get a freesat box... no subs and all the BBC/ITV/C4s you need. Hit the subtitles button and there is no need for 888 anymore.

You can still access RTE via analogue presumably.

Alun

WLSM wrote: »

It's not that the box can't handle subtitles, it can - it's that UPC have discontinued this service for some of the channels (BBC1, C4 and ITV in time) in some areas. The source they use is different to that used by Sky for these channels.

Subtitles are working (right now) both via the box menu and teletext page 888 (even if normal teletext isn't) on BBC1, BBC2, UTV and CH4 (and a whole lot more) here in Bray. Also the subtitles delivered via the box menu are, as far as I know, independent of any teletext service, so should still be available even if teletext is phased out, or in fact never existed on that channel such as on E4 and More4.

WLSM

It might be the case in Bray but not in Co. Limerick - as I said, I phoned them and they said they have stopped the service down here.

Yip Analogue still works. I didn't think you could get subtitles with freesat, does it work with your box?

icdg

Digital subtitles working for me on all UK terrestrials, though not 888 teletext subtitles (at least not through the teletext decoder in the STB, but it may not be able to handle them). Don't see why they would discontinue the service in some areas and not others? How many super head-ends do UPC have these days?

I'd say it's the weather. Sometimes UPC use satellite as a backup when their feed from Divis isn't satisfactory. I remember seeing this with Channel 4 when all programmes were in 16:9 letterbox rather than 14:9.

richardjjd

Just spoke to UPC (18/08) BBC have closed off the Ceefax service outside of the UK. UPC are entirely unsympathetic - their only response was "It's not our fault, it wasn't our decision. There's no refund due to you as a result of the reduced service as we never charged it for you in the first place".

Now I'm cross about it. If their customer service rep had expressed *any* level of sympathy or had made any attempt to explain why UPC didn't inform its customers about this change, I probably would have left it alone. I've submitted a formal complaint about it for what its worth.

WLSM

I got the same response from UPC - the so what, not our fault attitude really bugged me. My letter of complaint and request to end the service went off today.

I tried complaining to the Broadcasting Authority of Ireland but as they oversee the Irish broadcasters and not the Irish service providers they don't want to hear about it either. Maybe the BAI's mandate needs to be changed to include service providers. UPC is a Dutch co., SKY, a UK one. They sell their wares here but are not regulated here.
When analogue is finally turned off, a lot of Ireland will be using SKY or UPC. The BAI can tell RTE/TV3 what they should do, RTE/TV3 can spend a lot of money providing this service, e.g. subtitles, but the service provider is under no obligation to comply if it doesn't suit them.

richardjjd

richardjjd wrote: »

Just spoke to UPC (18/08) BBC have closed off the Ceefax service outside of the UK. UPC are entirely unsympathetic - their only response was "It's not our fault, it wasn't our decision. There's no refund due to you as a result of the reduced service as we never charged it for you in the first place".

Now I'm cross about it. If their customer service rep had expressed *any* level of sympathy or had made any attempt to explain why UPC didn't inform its customers about this change, I probably would have left it alone. I've submitted a formal complaint about it for what its worth.

Oh the delights of dealing with UPC customer service.

Got a call from their representative who repeated the above - the BBC have removed this service and there's nothing we can do about it. They are talking to BBC but aren't hopeful of the service been restored.

I suggested it might have been useful for them to communicate the removal of the service to their customers - even to put it in the context of it being a BBC decision outside of UPC's control. Communications with customers are the responsibility of our marketing department, I was told. I asked to talk to their marketing department and was advised that the department don't talk to customers. I really dislike getting the run around like this (its someone else's fault but you can't talk to them is a fairly childish way of engaging with customers).

I mentioned this and other threads (and that I would be posting an update following our conversation) and was told UPC monitor this site on a daily basis (hi!). She didn't want to address the issue of UPC having an offical representative on the board to engage with customers, which I suggested might be a good idea.

What she did say was that UPC directly communicate - by email - with posters on boards.ie about issues which have been brought up on the site. I find that unbelievable (but if its true, perhaps UPC could contact me after having read this).

patrickmooney

What are the chances UPC would replace it with digital ceefax? Slim to none.

thefishone

I have (Cisco HD box) ceefax on BBC2 only,came back about 2 days ago

SPDUB

richardjjd wrote: »

Just spoke to UPC (18/08) BBC have closed off the Ceefax service outside of the UK. UPC are entirely unsympathetic - their only response was "It's not our fault, it wasn't our decision.

Any explanation of why it's still on BBC2 if the BBC have closed off the service outside the BBC

And according to this poster it is still available on analogue from Divis

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=67378158&postcount=7

lawhec wrote:

Must be the case that UPC are using a different feed that doesn't carry Ceefax. It's working fine for analogue reception up here.

Infoanon

Lack of subtitles is starting to annoy - does the Good Friday agreement not ensure the availability of the FULL BBC service ??

It does not seem to make any sense that BBC would pull the Ceefax service.

Unfortunately its yet another reason to switch over to Sky - something which I am trying to avoid.....

Antenna

Karsini wrote: »

I'd say it's the weather. Sometimes UPC use satellite as a backup when their feed from Divis isn't satisfactory. I remember seeing this with Channel 4 when all programmes were in 16:9 letterbox rather than 14:9.

Channel 4 via satellite currently has traditional teletext and working OK

BBC1,2,UTV via satellite don't - but all do have the usual 'Page 888' subtitles available as normal via the TV's teletext function (and entering 888 as normal).

highdef

Infoanon wrote: »

Lack of subtitles is starting to annoy - does the Good Friday agreement not ensure the availability of the FULL BBC service ??

It does not seem to make any sense that BBC would pull the Ceefax service.

Unfortunately its yet another reason to switch over to Sky - something which I am trying to avoid.....

Subtitles are still available on the four UK channels. They never went away and as long as they are broadcast, UPC will broadcast them. They won't be taken away though as they HAVE to be there.

Infoanon

highdef wrote: »

Subtitles are still available on the four UK channels. They never went away and as long as they are broadcast, UPC will broadcast them. They won't be taken away though as they HAVE to be there.

Just checked - No Subtitles on BBC 1 on UPC digital , subtitles are on analogue BBC 1.

Subtitles are working on other Digital services thus is this a fault at UPC ??

Re Ceefax - I cannot see how this can be removed under the Good Friday agreement. UPC should be ensuring that it is immediately restored.

highdef

What model of set top box have you got? If you don't know what make it is, can you describe what it looks like? Also, if you can describe what the remote looks like and if it says UPC or ntl on it.

Opinicus

On a strange note: on my BBC1 last night subtitles were coming up without ceefax being turned on. I hit the teletext button a few times and it went to pg.100 not 888.

I'm on MMDS in the South West.

Infoanon

highdef wrote: »

What model of set top box have you got? If you don't know what make it is, can you describe what it looks like? Also, if you can describe what the remote looks like and if it says UPC or ntl on it.

NTL large old grey pace box

icdg

Infoanon wrote: »

Lack of subtitles is starting to annoy - does the Good Friday agreement not ensure the availability of the FULL BBC service ??

It does not seem to make any sense that BBC would pull the Ceefax service.

That's the BBC's ultimate intention, yes. Its' never been broadcast on DTT in the UK and when the last ITV region (ironically enough, including UTV) switches to digital in two years time, Ceefax will be no more. Teletext Limited is already gone.

Unfortunately its yet another reason to switch over to Sky - something which I am trying to avoid.....

Good luck there, Ceefax on Sky officially closed in 2002. (I say officially, in fact a skelton service mainly aimed at cable viewers in the continent whose cable companies are using DSat as their source for the UK terrestrials is still running, but I think its TV schedules and not much else?). The BBC's view is that on digital platforms, BBC Red Button (and the inbuilt subtitling feature) has replaced Ceefax and there's no further need for it. BBC Red Button isn't available on UPC, but digital subtitles are.

Infoanon

icdg wrote: »

Good luck there, Ceefax on Sky officially closed in 2002. (I say officially, in fact a skelton service mainly aimed at cable viewers in the continent whose cable companies are using DSat as their source for the UK terrestrials is still running, but I think its TV schedules and not much else?). The BBC's view is that on digital platforms, BBC Red Button (and the inbuilt subtitling feature) has replaced Ceefax and there's no further need for it. BBC Red Button isn't available on UPC, but digital subtitles are.

The service on the red button is the equivalent (or superior service) of what we knew as 'Ceefax'

At its simplest I can no longer view BBC 'text' on UPC - I can only view the service on Sky

highdef

Infoanon wrote: »

NTL large old grey pace box

I'm guessing that's the old Pace Di300 - Not positive on that box but if it doesn't do subtitles, it's the only model that is like that. Give UPC a call and they'll swap out the box for you.

Infoanon

highdef wrote: »

I'm guessing that's the old Pace Di300 - Not positive on that box but if it doesn't do subtitles, it's the only model that is like that. Give UPC a call and they'll swap out the box for you.

Thanks - the STB has been troublesome lately - have it 7+ years !

robbie67

hi i have just tried ceefax on my UPC box and it's back i don't know when it came back hope it back for good