Getting a Staff, Pit etc..

johnnyjb

Hi i am looking for info and advice about getting a dog preferably a Staffordshire Bull Terrier. A friend of mine has just got puppy and so far he seems a good choice. Im not in the position right now to get one but would consider it in year or so.

Im not looking for a show off dog for scaring people or the usual associated image some people have. ive started looking at info on the web but would like some first hand info and opinions of whether a staff would be the right choice.

Ive had one jack russel years ago but didnt know much bout training ( he was put down) as i was early teens but i think when i get a place of my own i might be up to the task. I have always had a family member or friend with a dog so am always in contact with one.

sligopark

First dog - staffie - no bud - not fair on the dog.

If you had a russell go the same again or something like a parsons - heaps in the rescue centres waiting for a well meaning chap like yourself to give them a home and them to give you a daily smile

http://www.irishanimals.ie/corkkerry_homes.html

morganafay

I would get another type of dog, another terrier or something first, work on training that. And when you know you're a good dog trainer, then get a staffie, because they probably should be very well trained and socialised and all, just in case.

Westie_Owner

morganafay wrote: »

I would get another type of dog, another terrier or something first, work on training that. And when you know you're a good dog trainer, then get a staffie, because they probably should be very well trained and socialised and all, just in case.

You should go for a west highland terrier. Super dogs.

Cherry Blossom

Westie_Owner wrote: »

You should go for a west highland terrier. Super dogs.

Just to expand on this a bit. Westies are extremely willfull and stubborn and require firm consistant training. They are are also highly intelligent, affectionate on their own terms and very loyal to their owners. Great practice for something bigger and stronger with similar traits, but a lot easier to find a good home for if it all goes wrong. No dog should be left alone for any extended period of time but in the case of Westies there should be someone home all the time when they are puppies and they can't be left alone for any long period in adulthood. If your going to be living alone and working full-time, you can't have a dog, simple as.

sligopark

get what you are used to - a russell terrier or parsons - similar in temperament - then if you still fancy a staff ot bull breed and are a confident experienced owner why not - they deserve a loving and experienced home otherwise they end up in rescue like EGAR if they are lucky - if not pts - they are too good a dog to be wasted as such

Bullseye1

If I were getting a terrier it would be a Kerry Blue. What a beautiful looking dog but like all terriers they have the impression they are bigger than the are.:D

Kev M

Pit's and staffy's are very full on dogs, and have an unfair bad rap. They're the most victimised breeds on earth... If you get one, you're taking on a responsibility to look after and promote the breed.

sligopark

Bullseye1 wrote: »

If I were getting a terrier it would be a Kerry Blue. What a beautiful looking dog but like all terriers they have the impression they are bigger than the are.

Kerry Blue????

WHAT?

Not to be smart but do you know anything of their temperament?

Fractous to say the least - even those working dogs shun them - known a few from childhood and to be honest I wouldn't gift my enemy with one

OP avoid at your peril

Whispered

In fairness sligopark, as you can see from the thread about RB dogs, it's very unfair to speak about a breed like that. Obviously there are people out there who love the breed.

I know 2 KB's, one a snappy little brat, the other, an amazing family pet.

sligopark

Whispered wrote: »

In fairness sligopark, as you can see from the thread about RB dogs, it's very unfair to speak about a breed like that. Obviously there are people out there who love the breed.

I know 2 KB's, one a snappy little brat, the other, an amazing family pet.

sorry and you might be right but having had alot of contact with different breeds I would have to say Kerry Blues are very high maintenance (hair wise at the very least) strong willed and aggressive (they were worked toward badger) - they need alot of socialisation and an experienced owner not to mention working or walking all of which could not be compared to a RB or bull breed

Kerry Blues are a no no for the inexperienced owners and for those not wanting to outside kennel

As I stated earlier those working them won't use them as they are too fractous and those in breed various breeds (inc pit and staff) won't bring them into lurcher breeding

I would say this is fairly telling...

lrushe

Kerrys like a lot of dog breeds are aquired by people who see a cute puppy and bring it into their home without doing a tap of research into what they require. Kerrys like all terriers including Staffs and Pits march to their own drum and are not, imo, for a novice owner. If you do want one of these dogs be prepared to put alot of work in, do your research into the different breeds and just when you think you've learnt everything there is to know, learn some more. Try go to a dog show and talk to breeder and see their dogs, then if you still feel ready take it from there.

morganafay

sligopark wrote: »

Kerry Blue????

WHAT?

Not to be smart but do you know anything of their temperament?

Fractous to say the least - even those working dogs shun them - known a few from childhood and to be honest I wouldn't gift my enemy with one

OP avoid at your peril

My friend had a couple of really lovely Kerry Blues, though completely hyper and crazy. But I've met some really really aggressive ones, and had to try to groom them, which wasn't fun at all. They were some of the scariest dogs I've met.

belongtojazz

I'm not sure a Jack would be advised as a first dog either. They are brilliant little dogs but again if not reared right they can easily earn their reputation as snappy yappy little dogs.
They need a firm hand, early and lots of socialisation and a huge amount of exercise. If they get all of that then they are the best dogs in the world.

Good luck with whichever dog you choose and well done for doing your research before just jumping in

arybvtcw0eolkf

My first dog was a Pitbull, my second a Staffie - neither was ever brought for training, and neither have killed yet!.

OP a staffie is as good a choice as any other dog if your going to look after it properly. And if your not going down the show dog route, or breeding it then look at staffies in the pounds & shelters first.

seamus

Alan Grumpy Shin wrote: »

OP a staffie is as good a choice as any other dog if your going to look after it properly. And if your not going down the show dog route, or breeding it then look at staffies in the pounds & shelters first.

Agreed. Staffies are no more difficult to raise than any other dog. Some breeds will require more determination than others when you are training them (Akitas for example are notoriously stubborn), but the same basic training techniques will work on all breeds.

Socialising for Staffies or any bull breed is important primarily because, as someone said above, when you take one on, you are unwittingly agreeing to become an ambassador for the breed. So the more relaxed your dog acts around other dogs, the better. When you're aware of the social stigma that comes with a RB, you're doubly embarrassed when the dog does something dog-like and barks or growls at another dog.

The pounds and shelters are fit to burst with Staffies, particularly as many rehoming centers will choose not to take them in.

TooManyDogs

I think the key to getting a dog, ANY dog be it first dog or 10th dog, is to fully understand the dog in question. Go and research the breed you're looking at from Lab to pit to JRT. If it's a cross breed or mutt then go and research each possible breed that could be in it and make sure you're fully aware of the traits of each breed/s.

When you've done your research then be 100% honest with yourself - are you going to walkt he 5 miles min a day a border collie needs to be fully happy? Are you going to go out of your way to socialise your staffie with every person/dog/cat/whatever you have the oppertunity to and create oppertunities if there are none appearing? Are you willing to have a spaniel that will more than likely try to swim in a puddle if there isn't water available, and swim in the sea/river/lake etc if it is there and spend half the day with a soaking wet coat?

So basically if you want a staffie/pitbull then grand, do your research, talk to people with experience so that way you get the highs and lows of that breed. Maybe not people who are rabidly for or against any particular breed, you might not get a balanced view then. Every breed has their good AND bad points, and not every breed suits every person. JRTs can seem like an easy option because they're common and small but rescues are falling down with them because they can be snappy, aggressive and territorial if not brought up properly.

OP why not talk to EGAR on Boards? She'd be the very person to give you good advise about bull breeds and you could see if they might be a good choice for you.

wetdogsmell

i can't belive somebody sugested getting a kerry blue instead of a staff for a novice dog owner,, be careful taking advice from people on this site mate as some of them seem to know less about dogs than you, but at least you realise it
read some books on the breed your into getting

morganafay

I definitely agree that just because someone on here says something like, "I have one of those dogs, they're great", doesn't mean you should listen to them, because they're biased, you need to get as much info as you can and get a balanced picture.

Bullseye1

wetdogsmell wrote: »

i can't belive somebody sugested getting a kerry blue instead of a staff for a novice dog owner,, be careful taking advice from people on this site mate as some of them seem to know less about dogs than you, but at least you realise it
read some books on the breed your into getting

Eh? As an experianced dog owner and someone who knows many Kerry Blues I take exception to this post. With all dogs its important to do some research.

I also stated that if I were on the look out for a terrier it would be a KB.

Bullseye1 wrote: »

If I were getting a terrier it would be a Kerry Blue. What a beautiful looking dog but like all terriers they have the impression they are bigger than the are.

They are not for everybody:rolleyes:

Bullseye1

sligopark wrote: »

Kerry Blue????

WHAT?

Not to be smart but do you know anything of their temperament?

Fractous to say the least - even those working dogs shun them - known a few from childhood and to be honest I wouldn't gift my enemy with one

OP avoid at your peril

Wow the bias against the KB. Don't listen people who preach hyperbole on any breed.;)

Bullseye1

lrushe wrote: »

Kerrys like a lot of dog breeds are aquired by people who see a cute puppy and bring it into their home without doing a tap of research into what they require. Kerrys like all terriers including Staffs and Pits march to their own drum and are not, imo, for a novice owner. If you do want one of these dogs be prepared to put alot of work in, do your research into the different breeds and just when you think you've learnt everything there is to know, learn some more. Try go to a dog show and talk to breeder and see their dogs, then if you still feel ready take it from there.

This should be applied to all breeds. Lots of time training and walking is secret to success. And of course patience. If there are trainers in your locality seek their advice. As someone who has kept larger breeds (Ridgebacks) people advised against me getting this breed. People have bias against different breeds and these people are not the best people to take advice from. Talk with people who deal with the dogs in question for better advice. I suggest the OP contact the secretary of the Staff Terrier club in Ireland if such an organisation exists.

Bullseye1

Alan Grumpy Shin wrote: »

My first dog was a Pitbull, my second a Staffie - neither was ever brought for training, and neither have killed yet!.

OP a staffie is as good a choice as any other dog if your going to look after it properly. And if your not going down the show dog route, or breeding it then look at staffies in the pounds & shelters first.

Is there a club for Staff owners in Ireland?

arybvtcw0eolkf

Bullseye1 wrote: »

Is there a club for Staff owners in Ireland?

I don't know, ask 'wetdogsmell' he's probably the most experienced on the various bull & working dog breeds I know.

In fact I'd consider him an authority on them.

adrenalinjunkie

adrenalinjunkie wrote: »

If your going to be living alone and working full-time, you can't have a dog, simple as.

+ 1, sister's ex gave her a present of a yorkshire terrier shortly after our Mum passed away :rolleyes: (nice thought and all). Sister now lives alone with the yorkie but she drops the dog into Dad's house every morning before going to work and collects her each evening. Dad works a few mornings a week so the dog would be alone for 5 hours or so a couple of times a week. The very odd day if he is playing golf early (10am or) the dog spends the guts of the day alone which is fairly awful. When she was a puppy she was never left alone all day.

morganafay

I don't agree that you can't work full time and have a job. You just have to make the time. The dog might only be awake for 6 hours a day anyway, so you just have to get up early, spend time with the dog, and then spend lots of time with them in the evening. It takes work but lots of people do it and it's fine. Most dogs are fine to stay home all day and will just sleep. It's better for them to have company, but most people can't stay home all day . . .

lrushe

Bullseye1 wrote: »

This should be applied to all breeds. Lots of time training and walking is secret to success. And of course patience. If there are trainers in your locality seek their advice. As someone who has kept larger breeds (Ridgebacks) people advised against me getting this breed. People have bias against different breeds and these people are not the best people to take advice from. Talk with people who deal with the dogs in question for better advice. I suggest the OP contact the secretary of the Staff Terrier club in Ireland if such an organisation exists.

I do apply this to all breed, there were 3 breeds mentioned so those are the 3 I commented on????

Cherry Blossom

morganafay wrote: »

I don't agree that you can't work full time and have a job. You just have to make the time. The dog might only be awake for 6 hours a day anyway, so you just have to get up early, spend time with the dog, and then spend lots of time with them in the evening. It takes work but lots of people do it and it's fine. Most dogs are fine to stay home all day and will just sleep. It's better for them to have company, but most people can't stay home all day . . .

Yes it is fine if you are in a position to make alternative arrangments, or have more than one dog, but I don't think anyone is going to recommend getting 2 dogs at the same time to basically a first time owner. Not everyone is prepared to pay a dog walker or doggie day care centre and personally I don't think its fair to burden relatives (whom you don't live with) with your dog, if they want to spend all day 5 days a week keeping a dog company surely they'd rather it was their own

morganafay

morganafay wrote: »

Most dogs are fine to stay home all day and will just sleep. .

Whenever we leave her in the house alone, even for 30 mins or so when we come back it's obvious she's after being snoozing. Still leaving a dog alone for 5 days of the week all day to snooze is fairly horrible.

johnnyjb

Thanks for all the replies.

I got the answers i expected and i doubt i would of started off again with a staff.They really are a needy dog and arent as cruel as the media and old wifes tails make out.

Ive one morething. Its hard to imagine a dog (Even a well trained) not barking or going for person in its lifetime even if provoked, if a little terrier attacks a child it most likely not kill a child but pits and staffs are so strong and could potentionally. I see pictures of peoples babies next to their staffs. I think this is very dangerous

lrushe

johnnyjb wrote: »

Ive one morething. Its hard to imagine a dog (Even a well trained) not barking or going for person in its lifetime even if provoked, if a little terrier attacks a child it most likely not kill a child but pits and staffs are so strong and could potentionally. I see pictures of peoples babies next to their staffs. I think this is very dangerous

And here we go again!

There has been a recent thread on this topic, please please read it and educate yourself. I don't mean that in a harsh way but it is exhausting repeating the same thing over and over again as I'm sure other posters can relate.

andreac

johnnyjb wrote: »

Thanks for all the replies.

I see pictures of peoples babies next to their staffs. I think this is very dangerous

Sorry but i dont agree with that statement. Staffies are actually known as the nanny breed and are great with children so you cant generalise with a statement like that. Any dog has the potential to do harm to a child, a staffie in a pic beside a child is no different than having a pic taken with a child beside a collie or a labrador...

Its statements like that that give these fab dogs a bad reputation if you ask me.

Cherry Blossom

johnnyjb wrote: »

Thanks for all the replies.

I got the answers i expected and i doubt i would of started off again with a staff.They really are a needy dog and arent as cruel as the media and old wifes tails make out.

Ive one morething. Its hard to imagine a dog (Even a well trained) not barking or going for person in its lifetime even if provoked, if a little terrier attacks a child it most likely not kill a child but pits and staffs are so strong and could potentionally. I see pictures of peoples babies next to their staffs. I think this is very dangerous

I think you've missed the whole point :rolleyes: If you are unable to train and control a dog properly (any dog, any breed!!!!) you have no business owning a dog (any dog, any breed!!!) 'Little Terriers' as you call them have pretty sharp teeth, the combination of an incompitant owner and a quick lunge at the artery in the neck and you have a dead child in no time at all. Again I would not recommend any terrier breed other than a Staff to you, Staffies have a natural affection towards children that no other breed comes close to. An awful lot of 'little terrier' breeds have quite the opposite attitude to them.

arybvtcw0eolkf

johnnyjb wrote: »

T
Ive one morething. Its hard to imagine a dog (Even a well trained) not barking or going for person in its lifetime even if provoked, if a little terrier attacks a child it most likely not kill a child but pits and staffs are so strong and could potentionally. I see pictures of peoples babies next to their staffs. I think this is very dangerous

100% correct, killer's - every last one of 'em.. In fact I changed Richo's name to 'Larry and Ruby's to Murphy' by deed poll today.

Worst thing I ever done was get a bull breed, I live in perpetual terror now.

Yes, I've given up justifying my dogs to these comments now.

johnnyjb

If a human can kill a child then a animal (staffs included ) can.
Im looking for an insight not criticism because people have the need to defend their dogs.

I see i wont get any help with a query so im not gonna bother lame internet bullies anymore.

In regards to this q. being done repeatedly, its a public forum not a private conversation if you dont like the question asked dont bother clicking.

How can you pretend to be good owners when you automaticaly shoot down a human. Sad

Hellrazer

Johnny infracted.Consider this a warning.Next time Ill ban you for a week.

LucyBliss

If the owners of both the dog and the child have done right by them and trained each of them in the correct way to behave with each other and others, then the worst that's ever going to happen to that child is that they get a severe face licking or are stared at eagerly by the dog while they watch tv, until they get up and take it for a walk or play fetch with it.

Personally, I think the pictures that people have posted of their dogs and kids are fantastically adorable. They show how well the dogs have been integrated into the family unit and how the kids regard them with affection and respect. Keep them coming, I say!

EGAR

if a little terrier attacks

You have obviously never seen a little Terrier at work.

As for the rest:

http://blog.dogsbite.org/2008/01/fatality-victim-justin-mozer-killed-by.html

ISDW

EGAR wrote: »

You have obviously never seen a little Terrier at work.

As for the rest:

http://blog.dogsbite.org/2008/01/fatality-victim-justin-mozer-killed-by.html

You just can't win though can you, reading that link. A JRT kills a child, but they have to mention the fact that a pitbull also lives at the same house. It had nothing to do with the attack, but it has to be mentioned, and then some of the people commenting on the story drag it back to bull breed attacks again even though it wasn't the pit that did anything.:rolleyes:

I would never leave a dog unattended with a child, any dog. Huskies were bred to work during the day and sleep with the children at night to keep them warm, but I still wouldn't ever let any of my dogs sleep with a child. Yes, my 15 year old son has a dog sleeping in his room at night, and has had for a couple of years, but he is not a small child. Obviously if someone is taking the photos that have been put up on here, then there is an adult in the room, unless all of you have amazing remote controlled cameras?

EGAR

Lol, usually if a different breed attacks then it's a freak accident.

Of course the Pit Bull whispered into the JRT ear: kill kill kill....

padunne

The first comment on that article makes me laugh or cry i dont know. They say straight away to check the bite marks as they are sure it was the pit bull. How can you change peoples minds when you have a report saying it was JRT and they will not believe a bull had no involvemt.
Id hate to see that person on a jury as id say they dont really listen to facts.