cctv system

cj maxx

hi folks
im thinking of putting a few security cameras (3/4) around my house and farm as a general security precaution and to observe visitors/animals at nighttime.
i'd like a wireless system because some cameras may be moved during the year(though not that often)
basically im lookin for advice on a value for money(cheap) system that offers a good visual quality day and night , can be viewed on the tv while recorded on harddrive /dvr and the range at which they can be set from the base unit.
if need be it can be a wired unit
if anyone has got something similar or can offer advice on i would appreciate it

Jnealon

What is your budget for the job and will you be installing this yourself

cj maxx

budget im not really sure, couple of hundred was what thinkin. on sites that sold 3/4 cameras plus remote boxes for that price. what they are like , i dont know.
installation ? yeah i think i would try it. positioning the cameras etc -no prob. tuning into tv and setting up a computer to record i think my brother could do. he's into that.
do you think its feasible to get an ok system for that money

Jnealon

I can't really recommend anything for a couple of hundred euro.
Having a look at some budget kit I would be hard pressed to get 4 cameras and a dvr for 600-700 euro.
Anything less than that would be very low quality imo

KoolKid

I would recommend you shop around. Ask for all the specs on camera's and DVR. Do not commit yourself to anything. Post back here with specs or a link and I will give you an opinion on it from there. The first question is what do you want from a CCTV system. ?
To be a deterrent?
To gather evidence?
To observe?
To control access?

Tim M-U

I found one for €567.84 including vat from meteorelectrical: http://www.meteorelectrical.co.uk/fire-safety_cctv_cctv-digi-view-4-kit-4-channel-system.html?osCsid=f59c2cf26bbaa03b0707f3b068335d74 .

DIGI-VIEW 4 KIT CCTV System complete with;
1 X 4 Channel DVR c/w 160GB Hard Drive and power outputs for cameras
4 X Day/Night weatherproof Cameras with Integral IR illumination
4 X 15 metre Cables
1 X Connection Cable for CCTV Monitor or Standard Television
Day/Night Cameras for LED illumination
Digital full screen Recording
Built-in on screen motion detection
Up to 16 weeks continuous Recording
Cameras suitable for Indoor or outdoor use
USB output for captured Image Transfer
Quad or single screen view

Camera specification
Description 1/4" Colour Day & Night Infrared Camera
Pick up Element SHARP 1/4" CCD Image Sensor
Number of Pixels <NTSC> 510(H) x 492(V) <PAL> 500(H) x 582(V)
Back Light Compensation ON
Auto Electronic Shutter ON
AGC ON
Sync Mode Internal Sync
Scanning System 2:1 Interlace
Auto White Balance ON
Resolution 420 TV Lines
S/N Ratio > 48dB
Gamma 0.45
Minimum Illumination 0.92 Lux. F/2.0 (0 Lux with IR)
Horizontal Sync Frequency <PAL> 28.3 KHz
Video Output 1.0Vp.p. 75ohm
Power Source DC 12V (Supplied from DVR)
Water Resistance IP66
IR LED 10PCS
Night Viewable Range 5-8 meters
Power Consumption 350mA max
Operating Temperature -10°C to +60°C
Lens 3.6mm lens
Shutter Control <PAL> 1/50-1/110,000 sec
Dimension 52 (D) x 75 (H) mm
Net Weight 0.6kg

DVR specification
Description 4 channel stand alone DVR
Hard Drive Fixed - Internal 160GB Seagate IDE
Video Input Format PAL
Video Output 4 channel composite
Power Output 4 channel composite
Motion Detection Selectable - Sensitivity adjustable
Alarm Input 4 selectable no/nc
Alarm Buzzer 1 selectable
Display Frame Rate 100 frames per second
Record Frame Rate Max 25 frames per second adjustable
Record Quality Adjustable - high, medium, low
Recording Modes Continuous, motion, manual, scheduled
Display Resolution 720 x 576
Recording Resolution 320 x 136, 640 x 272
Compression Format Modified mpeg 12 - 20 k bytes / frame
Search Facility Time - date - camera

DVR Record Times (160GB hard drive)
DISPLAY FORMAT QUALITY 25FPS 12FPS 6FPS 1FPS
EACH SCREEN HIGH
NORMAL
LOW 64HRS
92HRS
116HRS 128HRS
184HRS
232HRS 256HRS
368HRS
464HRS 1536HRS
2208HRS
2784HRS
QUAD SCREEN HIGH
NORMAL
LOW 116HRS
172HRS
256HRS 232HRS
344HRS
452HRS 464HRS
688HRS
904HRS 2784HRS
4128HRS
5424HRS

Depending on your environment of which it will be in though.. it's wired though..I noticed this while on the website although it may not be the best?
Expect to pay extra for wireless cctv.

these kits may not be the best though.. http://www.cctvdirect.co.uk/categories/CCTV-Kits/4-Camera-Kits/

Jnealon

Very low quality kit there tim.
Electronics line are well known for their cheap intruder alarm kit, the 3 euro PIR being an example

cj maxx

thanx 4 the info guys. i'll get checking more sites this week . can you highlight what makes this a low quality system so i can use it as a guide .
would go to a local technichan but think i got a raw deal on a simple alarm system before so want to learn what im gettin for my buck
cheers

Tim M-U

as I mensioned, it could be complete ****e but some people might be interested..

KoolKid

160 GB HDD and claiming 4 months recording?
Thats going to be very low quality
Record fram rate of only 25 FPS is very low.
USB output for captured Image Transfer ? I take it from that there is no DVD/CD rewriter.

The basic essentials
HDD minimum 500GB
Record fram rate 100fps
CD or DVD rerwriter
Digital watermarking of images.
Cameras 480 tvl or higher
Camera Lens 3.5-8mm minimum.

@ Tim. I don't thik cjmc is saying he's interested. He is just looking for what measues the quality of a system. Hope the above helps.:D

cj maxx

it does
sorry, was away for a few days so havent really trawled the net for systems yet. should get on to tonight/tomorrow so i'll post back whats on offer

ferguson

but then you have the cost of planning permission etc don't you?

what you you guys in thev know think of this

KoolKid

Planning permission?
That system you linked to is absolute muck for the price.
Saving onto an SD card? Probably no digital watermarking so images are useless.
This would nearly do a better job.

ferguson

koolkid wrote: »

Planning permission?

yest for cctv pp is needed even if camera inside house. that is what i was told anyway

That system you linked to is absolute muck for the price.

ok thanks for tip

Probably no digital watermarking so images are useless.

what does digital watermarking do/mean?

This would nearly do a better job.

thanks

Hope I am not going too far OT but i was looking at a solar powered PIR light.There has been a bit of anti social behaviour/ minor theft around here lately Has anyone any experience of something like this

kc66

I bought this during the week for £275. Was £300 until yesterday and had £25 voucher. Not sure if I would pay £400 for it now.

Technical specifications:
DVR
Model KG-SHA104 ( 4CH )
Video Compression H.264
Video System NTSC / PAL (Optional)
Operation System Linux
Video Input / Output BNC 4-channel / VGA 1-channel ; BNC 2-channel
Audio Input / Output RCA 1-channel / 1-channel
Audio Compression 8kHz*16bit ADPCM
Display Frame Rate PAL: 100 fps ; NTSC: 120 fps
Playback Resolution PAL:CIF(352x288),HD1(704x288), D1(704x576)NTSC: CIF(352x240),HD1(704x240), D1(704x480)
Recording Frame Rate PAL:100fps@CIF 25fps@D1, 50fps@HD1,NTSC:30fps@D1, 60fps@HD1,120fps@CIF
Recording Mode Always / schedule (motion detection)
Recording Pack Time 15/30/45/60mins selectable
HDD Interface One fixed HDD rack, supports up to 1TB SATA HDD,USB removable HDD (320GB Included)
Network Interface RJ45, 10M/100M
Network Protocol Support TCP/IP, DHCP,DDNS, PPPoE
Network Function Support to live view with IE (Internet Explorer) & with mobile phone
USB2.0 USB mouse, USB disk (backup, upgrade)
Playback Playback 4 channels at the same time
Playback Search Date, time, file list
Playback Mode PLAY / SLOW / FWD / Frame by frame
Backup Backup via USB flash disk, USB HDD disk, USB CD/DVD-RW & Network
PTZ Control Built-in RS485, support PELCO-P & PELCO-D
Alarm Mode Motion Detection, video loss, HDD loss, HDD full
Power Supply DC 12V/3A (power adaptor included)
Power consumption 10-15 W (exclude HDD)
Working Temperature 50 F to 104 F (10 to 40)
Dimension 300*224*55mm (WxDxH)
Weight (Approximately) 2.9kg
Cameras:
image Sensor: 1/4 Color CCD
Signal System PAL/NTSC
Effective Pixels PAL: 500(H)X582(V) ; NTSC:510(H)X492(V)
Horizontal Resolution 420TV Line
Viewing angle:(Built-in Lens) 3.6mm (80 degrees)
Video Output 1.0Vp-p. 75ohm (BNC)
Number of LEDs: 24 LED (Upto 20m Nightvision)
Audio: No
S/N Ratio >48dB
Gain control: Auto
Minimum Illumination 0 LUX /F1.2
Gamma Characteristict 0.45
Shutter Speed PAL: 1/50-1/100.000sec ; NTSC: 1/60-1/100.000sec
indoor use Yes
Outdoor use: Yes
Power Consumption 12V DC, 200mA (IR ON)
Weather Proof IP66
Operating Temp -10~50 C

KoolKid

ferguson wrote: »

yes for cctv pp is needed even if camera inside house. that is what i was told anyway

Planning permission is not required for normal CCTV installations.

ferguson wrote: »

what does digital watermarking do/mean?

Digital watermarking is used to prove that digital video imaging has not been tampered with or altered. Digital video without this can be ruled inadmissable as evidence of any incident.

ferguson wrote: »

Hope I am not going too far OT but i was looking at a solar powered PIR light.There has been a bit of anti social behaviour/ minor theft around here lately Has anyone any experience of something like this

Never used them. A standard mains powered sensor light would be around €15 & more reliable.

ferguson

koolkid wrote: »

Planning permission is not required for normal CCTV installations.

then why did planning put that it is required to me in writing. they said any cctv had to have pp and plans/reports from architects to be on the application for PP. all this in writing from planning dept

Also see

Digital watermarking is used to prove that digital video imaging has not been tampered with or altered. Digital video without this can be ruled inadmissable as evidence of any incident.

ok

KoolKid

ferguson wrote: »

then why did planning put that it is required to me in writing. they said any cctv had to have pp and plans/reports from architects to be on the application for PP. all this in writing from planning dept

It may be a requirement if looking for PP on a build or major renovation.
It is not a requirement just to Install CCTV. For example when apply for PP for a hotel etc it would be a requirement to show what the plans are for CCTV. But the planning permission is not for CCTV.
Belive me ..I,ve been doing this over 20 years .

ferguson

koolkid wrote: »

It may be a requirement if looking for PP on a build or major renovation.
It is not a requirement just to Install CCTV. For example when apply for PP for a hotel etc it would be a requirement to show what the plans are for CCTV. But the planning permission is not for CCTV.
Belive me ..I,ve been doing this over 20 years .

Not a major renovation just if i want to have cctv in this house. No major renovation except for putting up the cctv. And it is just a private home not hotel etc..
Did you look at the link from Kildare?

I was told even this needed pp

KoolKid

Have never come across this as a requirement.
Install the CCTV you want. Let them contact you if they have issues with it.
Never have I or a customer applied for PP on a domestic application.
As for the light????? I have heard it all now.

ferguson

koolkid wrote: »

Have never come across this as a requirement.
Install the CCTV you want. Let them contact you if they have issues with it.
Never have I or a customer applied for PP on a domestic application.
As for the light????? I have heard it all now.

I would not want to do this as i am now aware i need pp and would be in more trouble if there was an issue. cannot now plead ignorance. should havejust put it up and kept mouth shut. I am not paying for architects reports etc

I agree re light, pp for a light:D

KoolKid

Your choice , but I have CCTV on my property. I have never had any problems. I have had occasions where the Guards looked for images from it. I know at least 2 Councillors in my area would know I have them. Never an issue.
Honestly I install domestic CCTV regularly never been an issue.

Jnealon

I think that planner is misguided.
As long as the installation complies with the necessary data protection act and meets current regs there is no need for planning

Shades799

Hey, rather than start off a new thread I thought I'd get this one going again.

I've had a couple of incidents lately around the house, some fencing was broken on the side of my house, someone tried to pry open my back patio door and someone’s been looking in my shed (there's nothing in there only crap), and when all the snow happened there was a lot foot prints around my patio door and my back garden that weren't mine.

I think some kids (those darn kids!) are using my house as a through way, and I don't necessarily mind that as much but I don't want to know who they are, and what they're up to, if it's all above board and they're just using my house as a short cut I don't really mind (I'm cool like that!) but if they are getting up to something I want to be able to catch it on camera.

I live in a standard semi-d in a Celtic tiger estate. I have a front door, front bay window, gate that leads to the walk way to the back of my house (I keep the gate locked but they just climb over), shed out the back, garden, back patio door and back kitchen window.

I would like a system, with 2 cameras, one I would point at my front door and bay window and catch one side of the entrance to by back garden and another that would point down at my patio door and get the shed, patio door and other side of the lane.

I'd also like a system which is clear enough to identify a face (even at night??) could be admissible in court and also, allow me to see what's going on if I'm away from the house with my iPhone 4 (along with being able to view the tapes on my computer). Motion triggered would be an advantage but I would probably leave it always on in case the motion sensor missed anything.

So my question is this, can anyone recommend a system that would meet my requirements, and what sort of price can I expect to pay?

Jnealon

That's a big area to cover with just two cameras.
To identify a person they will need to take up between 50 - 100% of the screen height.
From the sounds of it you could do this at the front of the house but would be pushing it at the back.
Expect to pay around 1000-1200 for two cameras, dvr and a flat screen installed