Drinking at the Dún Laoghaire Festival

alexlyons

Quick question. I know a decent amount of guards and don't have the usual opinion of them that most my age do. I also work on the water front in Dún Laoghaire.

At the festival last week, whilst distracting my self from the drunken mess of people around, I noticed a temporary county council sign cable tied to a lamp post, stating that it was an offense to drink in a public place etc. It was an official sign, nothing wrong with it.

However, the area around Dún Laoghaire Harbour is private property, owned by Dún Laoghaire Harbour company and very technically speaking you are not meant to be on their property unless you have business within the harbour walls.

As it is private property, I was wondering about the laws about drinking in a public place. Asking a guard over the weekend wouldn't have been a good idea, they had enough to deal with, coupled with the fact that most were drafted in and possibly wouldn't have known it is private property.

As its private property, were the guards within their rights to take drink, even unopened, which they were, away from those on the grounds?

Don't get me wrong, most of the people they took the drink off definitely shouldn't have even been trusted with a glass of water for fear of drowning, I'm just curious....

johnfás

You'd have to define the boundary of the Harbour first. Quite possible that it was happening on the water front but not within the boundary of the Harbour. The legal boundary may not be as one might imagine it.

alexlyons

I know the boundary, it was well within the boundary, that's not the issue. I'm certain it was on harbour company property

Pauleta

They only cracked down on this last year. As far as i know they didnt do anything in years previous.

johnfás

alexlyons wrote: »

I know the boundary, it was well within the boundary, that's not the issue. I'm certain it was on harbour company property

OK, here are a few issues for you to think about.

It is illegal to be intoxicated in a public place where that intoxication is to such an extent to cause reasonable apprenhension that one might cause danger to themselves or another.

Dun Laoghaire Harbour is a public place, irrespective of it being vested in a private state company, owing to s.3 Criminal Justice (Public Order) Act 1994 which defines a public place as:

( a ) any highway,
( b ) any outdoor area to which at the material time members of the public have or are permitted to have access, whether as of right or as a trespasser or otherwise, and which is used for public recreational purposes,
( c ) any cemetery or churchyard,
( d ) any premises or other place to which at the material time members of the public have or are permitted to have access, whether as of right or by express or implied permission, or whether on payment or otherwise, and
( e ) any train, vessel or vehicle used for the carriage of persons for reward.

Second, in relation to consuming alcohol, whether intoxicated or not - the Bylaws of Dun Laoghaire Harbour provide:

No person shall, while within the Harbour:
Consume alcohol in the public areas of the Harbour, including the ferry terminal or have in his possession in those areas a container of alcohol, the seal of which indicates that it had previously been opened, and a person under the influence of intoxicating liquor shall not be allowed to enter or remain within the Harbour.

It is quite possible that the Gardaí have an agreement in place with the Harbour Company to support the Harbour Police in the maintenance of the Bylaws of the Harbour. It is not likely that you are privvy to such an agreement. You can take it from me that such agreements ordinarily exist between the Gardaí and private bodies which exist for public recreation - for example sports stadiums.

Where they are dealing with an intoxicated person, the Gardaí can enforce the law irrespective of such an agreement by virtue of the harbour being a public place.

alexlyons

johnfás wrote: »

It is quite possible that the Gardaí have an agreement in place with the Harbour Company to support the Harbour Police in the maintenance of the Bylaws of the Harbour. It is not likely that you are privvy to such an agreement. You can take it from me that such agreements ordinarily exist between the Gardaí and private bodies which exist for public recreation - for example sports stadiums.

Where they are dealing with an intoxicated person, the Gardaí can enforce the law irrespective of such an agreement by virtue of the harbour being a public place.

Cool the jets there chap. I never once stated that I should be privvy to such an agreement. You answered the question and I thank you for that, but there is no need to be condescending about it. Just because I was asking about a particular law doesn't mean I have, or want to break it. I know many members of the harbour police and other staff working within the harbour, I am thankful for the guards doing what they did, I was merely wondering what the technicalities were.

Everyone who questions actions by the guards or a certain law, isn't trying to get around it or try to seem above it, which frequently seems to be the thoughts of most people up to speed on these matters. I'd ask those who hold these opinions to ride their high horses back to reality.

johnfás

alexlyons wrote: »

Cool the jets there chap. I never once stated that I should be privvy to such an agreement. You answered the question and I thank you for that, but there is no need to be condescending about it. Just because I was asking about a particular law doesn't mean I have, or want to break it. I know many members of the harbour police and other staff working within the harbour, I am thankful for the guards doing what they did, I was merely wondering what the technicalities were.

Everyone who questions actions by the guards or a certain law, isn't trying to get around it or try to seem above it, which frequently seems to be the thoughts of most people up to speed on these matters. I'd ask those who hold these opinions to ride their high horses back to reality.

Critical? Want to break it? I suggested neither. I was stating that you were unlikely to have knowledge of any agreement between the Harbour Company and the Gardaí. If you had such knowledge you would not be posing the question. It is therefore unsurprising that you were not aware that such an agreement may exist. Jeez dude, take it easy. I was simply explaining to you what the technicalities are likely to be.

Nowhere in my post did I suggest that you were trying to get around the law, where on earth would you get that notion? Cheers for saying thanks for taking the time to write a long reply answering your queries.