advice needed on lack of energy/motivation

Simmo39

I'm fast running out of ideas and the don't want to continue the way my training has being going the last 2 months, any advice is more than welcome and i can take criticism, i think

I'll give a quick run down on my story so far, Im 29 year old male, 70kg , 10% body fat and my V02 is 60ml/kg, my background is football and mountain biking but at the end of the football season (Oct 09) i wanted to do something else and wanted to put my running and biking together so Duathlon was my answer.

I spent Oct-Dec base running (no more that 80% HR) between 6km-10km x 4/5 times a week and 1 LSD at the weekend about 12km-15km.
In January i got my road bike a trek 4.5 so once the weather was ok i got out on Spins every weekend starting off at 40km spins and by the middle of february i was up to 100km and continued with my running, i entered my first race in Punchestown March this year which i finished 53rd but had so much room for improvement and needed more structure to my training so started with a V02max test in April where i found out i had the speed and endurance but needed to get my speed/endurance (work on my lactate) together and most importantly i found out all my training to date was basically in the wrong heart rate zones so that means even more room for improvement, which i was delighted about but I advised not that I had to train harder but that I needed to cut back my training days and needed more rest days for recovery. My new training routine was;

Monday - Core and strength
Tuesday- Lactate run 10min 92%max, 10min 75%, 10min 92% then warm down
Wednesday- 1hr cycle 65%
Thursday- rest day
Friday- Lactate cycle 20min 92% max, 10min 75%, 20min 92% then warm down
Saturday - Rest day
Sunday - 3hr Endurance cycle 80%max HR

Then the following week i would alternate the days and training and swop a lactate session for an endurance run 12km at 80%, for the first month i could really notice some difference in both my running and cycling i felt so much stronger in both but then all of a sudden i couldn't complete my lactate runs at 92% and struggled to get my heart rate up that high even, so i done a week at 80% training and tried the lactate run the following week and again the same feeling of no energy and could only get my heart rate to 85% and that was a struggle, so i took a week off altogether and came back at my training feeling good and positive, i done a week of no more that 80% heart rate and then got back into the lactate training and completed the first week and felt ok but this week i have felt really tired and noticed my resting heart rate which was 36 and rarely went over 40 is now the lowest is 44 and sometimes at 50 and if i move its gone up to 81.Im just getting frustrated at this stage because i feel like I'm giving this everything, i even knocked alcohol on the head this year and have a very good diet, I eat according to what training I do on the day and my body stats shows this as i started off with a 16% body fat and am down to 10% since i started this training.

Can anyone shed some light on my situation as i am quickly running out of ideas and motivation now after only doing 1 race

RoyMcC

Thought I'd bump this up for you Simmo. I hope one of the sports scientists on here can deal with it - my eyes are glazing over trying to understand it all.

Maybe that's it though. Why not just kick back and stop analysing so much? Play it the way you feel for a while without agonising over the detail. I know I couldn't enjoy running if I was tearing my hair out with the statistics all the time.

Simmo39

Thanks for your time RoyMcC, sorry if my essay bored you to tears:o i think it also bored 100+ viewers maybe it could be used for bedtime reading! I'm going to start enjoying it again and take it from there. hopefully someone will be able to help me with the reason for the dip in performance so i can get my head around it so i can avoid it happening again. thanks.

digme

I'd say post your diet as you might not be getting enough calories in?

InTheTrees

+1 on posting your diet.

Its probably not relevant at all but last year I was diagnosed as having high cholesterol.

I figured if fat was the culprit I'd just cut out fat completely. WHich I did. For about three months.

After which time all I wanted to do was lie in bed and sleep. I had no energy at all, despite eating plenty. lesson learned, fat is essential in your diet, its where you get energy from.

SO you never know. The above example was extreme but it can happen in a more subtle way. You saying you've been losing fat and that could effect your energy levels.

ger664

I would include a 65% 1 Hr run on Saturday and reduce the intensity of the endurance effort on Sunday to 70%-75% depending on how you feel.

If you do not feel like doing the recovery runs/cycles then rest but I always find that they help more if I just reduce the effort when needed.

Simmo39

thanks for the feedback, my typical diet would be;
7am; Porridge 70g with banana or raisins, honey and glass of OJ
10am; 2 slices brown bread and jam or recovery days i would have 2 scrambled eggs.
1; 130g couscous with mixed beans and tin of tuna or 150g pasta and chicken fillet
4; bagel with a banana,50g cashew nuts
8; last nights dinner, salmon, mashed potatoes, carrots,broccoli and garden peas.
i work in an office so i have 2 liters of water at my desk a day and snack on fruit.

Simmo39

thanks ger664, thats a good suggestion and does make sense, i will give that ago and see how i feel. thanks.

nachoqueen

Hi Simmo,
im no expert but
Are you eating enough kcal?, i had a look at your food diary,
Do you have a specific goal in mind cos training and diet should be tailored to it
Are you feeling TATT ( tired all the time)

Simmo39

nachoqueen wrote: »

Hi Simmo,
im no expert but
Are you eating enough kcal?, i had a look at your food diary,
Do you have a specific goal in mind cos training and diet should be tailored to it
Are you feeling TATT ( tired all the time)

Hi, I try to eat more carbs the day i have a hard session or the day before a long cycle. Ive started a food diary to keep an eye on my food intake try to get 3000kcal+ all depending on the training ahead.

Do you think it could be down to my food intake? Lately i have been feeling tired all of the day..

madon

Simmo39 wrote: »

Hi, I try to eat more carbs the day i have a hard session or the day before a long cycle. Ive started a food diary to keep an eye on my food intake try to get 3000kcal+ all depending on the training ahead.

Do you think it could be down to my food intake? Lately i have been feeling tired all of the day..

I think you should go to the doctor for a check up especially if you are feeling tired all day.

tunney

Simmo39 wrote: »

I'm fast running out of ideas and the don't want to continue the way my training has being going the last 2 months, any advice is more than welcome and i can take criticism, i think

I'll give a quick run down on my story so far, Im 29 year old male, 70kg , 10% body fat and my V02 is 60ml/kg, my background is football and mountain biking but at the end of the football season (Oct 09) i wanted to do something else and wanted to put my running and biking together so Duathlon was my answer.

I spent Oct-Dec base running (no more that 80% HR) between 6km-10km x 4/5 times a week and 1 LSD at the weekend about 12km-15km.
In January i got my road bike a trek 4.5 so once the weather was ok i got out on Spins every weekend starting off at 40km spins and by the middle of february i was up to 100km and continued with my running, i entered my first race in Punchestown March this year which i finished 53rd but had so much room for improvement and needed more structure to my training so started with a V02max test in April where i found out i had the speed and endurance but needed to get my speed/endurance (work on my lactate) together and most importantly i found out all my training to date was basically in the wrong heart rate zones so that means even more room for improvement, which i was delighted about but I advised not that I had to train harder but that I needed to cut back my training days and needed more rest days for recovery. My new training routine was;

Monday - Core and strength
Tuesday- Lactate run 10min 92%max, 10min 75%, 10min 92% then warm down
Wednesday- 1hr cycle 65%
Thursday- rest day
Friday- Lactate cycle 20min 92% max, 10min 75%, 20min 92% then warm down
Saturday - Rest day
Sunday - 3hr Endurance cycle 80%max HR

Then the following week i would alternate the days and training and swop a lactate session for an endurance run 12km at 80%, for the first month i could really notice some difference in both my running and cycling i felt so much stronger in both but then all of a sudden i couldn't complete my lactate runs at 92% and struggled to get my heart rate up that high even, so i done a week at 80% training and tried the lactate run the following week and again the same feeling of no energy and could only get my heart rate to 85% and that was a struggle, so i took a week off altogether and came back at my training feeling good and positive, i done a week of no more that 80% heart rate and then got back into the lactate training and completed the first week and felt ok but this week i have felt really tired and noticed my resting heart rate which was 36 and rarely went over 40 is now the lowest is 44 and sometimes at 50 and if i move its gone up to 81.Im just getting frustrated at this stage because i feel like I'm giving this everything, i even knocked alcohol on the head this year and have a very good diet, I eat according to what training I do on the day and my body stats shows this as i started off with a 16% body fat and am down to 10% since i started this training.

Can anyone shed some light on my situation as i am quickly running out of ideas and motivation now after only doing 1 race

So you just repeat this week every week with minor alterations? Most of your training being at 92% of HR? MHR for bike and run - you're not using the same figures are you?

You advised you do train like this?

Simmo39

tunney wrote: »

So you just repeat this week every week with minor alterations? Most of your training being at 92% of HR? MHR for bike and run - you're not using the same figures are you?

You advised you do train like this?

Ive been working on lactate training to try get my speed/endurance together hence the 92% hr training, i have realised since posting that i was using the same HR zones for the bike and running. i done my V02 test on the treadmill so going to roughly cycle 10bpm lower than my running heart rate zone, this could be a big reason why i overtrained? thanks for your help regarding this.

tunney

Simmo39 wrote: »

Ive been working on lactate training to try get my speed/endurance together hence the 92% hr training, i have realised since posting that i was using the same HR zones for the bike and running. i done my V02 test on the treadmill so going to roughly cycle 10bpm lower than my running heart rate zone, this could be a big reason why i overtrained? thanks for your help regarding this.

You went and got tested.
Did they advise this training programme or did you make it up yourself?

Simmo39

tunney wrote: »

You went and got tested.
Did they advise this training programme or did you make it up yourself?

Hi tunney, i was advised to do 3 lactate sessions every 2 weeks and do 1 endurance run and cycle per week with a core and strength session and a recovery cycle or run per week.

Is there something wrong with the structure of this training? Maybe i need to get a good 8-12 weeks of base training under my belt before i start to try get my speed/endurance down and im attempting to much to soon? thanks.

tunney

Simmo39 wrote: »

Hi tunney, i was advised to do 3 lactate sessions every 2 weeks and do 1 endurance run and cycle per week with a core and strength session and a recovery cycle or run per week.

Is there something wrong with the structure of this training? Maybe i need to get a good 8-12 weeks of base training under my belt before i start to try get my speed/endurance down and im attempting to much to soon? thanks.

Advised by whom? I really am curious. Once you stop dodging I'll start answering.

Simmo39

tunney wrote: »

Advised by whom? I really am curious. Once you stop dodging I'll start answering.

I done my V02 test at Irishfit, they are so helpful and gave me a break down of the training that i need to do to improve my speed/endurance!

It feels wrong announcing them on this tread because they are so nice and helpful.

Simmo39

ok I have 2 weeks off training at this stage and still feeling tired most of the day and getting 8 hours sleep a night, my resting heart rate is still about 10% higher than normal and its very erratic, it can be at 44 and once i get out of bed and stand up its at 85+, i went to the doctors on Thursday to get my bloods tested and she sent me up to Naas to get a chest x ray to check the heart and lungs. Without the results of the bloods She thinks either I'm coming down with something or just overtrain.
I will get the results Thursday so will update this thread then..

Any suggestions are greatly appreciated:)

Simmo39

I got my blood results back and creatinine,total proteins, albumin,folate and cholesterol levels are on the high side but the doctor just said maybe to stop taking my protein supplement. I have an underactive Thyroid but no need to go on tablets for it just do a retest in 6 weeks.
The last 2 days i have started to feel a small bit better but still tired its 3 weeks since i last trained and it feels like it still can be a few weeks before i start to get over this..

Has anyone come across or had this tired/overtrained feeling before that you can help me out with?

Gringo78

What protein supplement are you on? You didn't mention that before.....

tunney

Getting dangerously close to medical advice.
Normally I think the mods are a little over-zealous in locking things down but I think this could turn into a thread with potential to be locked.

Going back to the original question. I'd ditch the training programme and heart rate zones you were given. Its alot of fast work and without a proper periodisation plan and step backs and some easy work it could end up with the athlete overtrained.

Some years ago I combined too much stress - training, diet, work and lifestyle and I ended up with cortisol level issues. I got my cortisol levels tested, identified the problem, and took steps to address it.

donothoponpop

Simmo39 wrote: »

I got my blood results back and creatinine,total proteins, albumin,folate and cholesterol levels are on the high side but the doctor just said maybe to stop taking my protein supplement. I have an underactive Thyroid but no need to go on tablets for it just do a retest in 6 weeks.
The last 2 days i have started to feel a small bit better but still tired its 3 weeks since i last trained and it feels like it still can be a few weeks before i start to get over this..

Has anyone come across or had this tired/overtrained feeling before that you can help me out with?

<mod>You are discussing medical advice, and looking for opinions from people who aren't qualified. Please read the charter. </mod>