NCT/DoE(VTN) Discussion

Slidey

So I want to gauge what ordinary punters think..

Should the DoE system be set up like the NCT where one company has control of the whole system and there is no vested interest in garage owners getting their own vehicles tested or should the NCT be split up and ran by private operators throughout the country like the DoE currently is and the MOT in the UK?

How should the people in charge crack down on hooky tests?

I could get a hooky NCT in a few days and as for DoE tests, its laughable. When I get told as a DoE tester by a customer that if he went to X they would pass that fault it says to me there has to be reform..

Thoughts?

OldmanMondeo

A DOE centre is not allowed to test their own vechiles. This change came about after the Bus Eireann crash in Meath that claimed lives off several school children.

The RSA regulary test DOE / VTN centres to ensuer they are up to the job.

But like everything else there are some people who find it worth their while to take back handers.

Slidey

OldmanMondeo wrote: »

A DOE centre is not allowed to test their own vechiles. This change came about after the Bus Eireann crash in Meath that claimed lives off several school children.

Not true.

Bue Eireann no longer test their own fleet AFAIK.

OldmanMondeo wrote: »

The RSA regulary test DOE / VTN centres to ensuer they are up to the job.

But like everything else there are some people who find it worth their while to take back handers.

I would not consider once every 6 months or so to be regular. I feel there should be vehicles sent into to be tested to check for compliance.

Does this happen in the NCT?

OldmanMondeo

Maybe we getting our wires crossed, Bus Eireann are no longer allowed to test their own fleet. They can do the Tacho and speedo work alright, but DOE testing can not be done by a company on its own fleet.

As far as dodgy certs go, for both NCT and DOE, anyone caught doing it shold be shut down and never allowed operate again. God only knows what death traps they are allowing on the road.

Slidey

OldmanMondeo wrote: »

but DOE testing can not be done by a company on its own fleet..

I'm not so sure about that, any sales vehicles that leave this garage are tested by either myself or our co-worker

OldmanMondeo

Slidey wrote: »

I'm not so sure about that, any sales vehicles that leave this garage are tested by either myself or our co-worker

Probably a loop hole, Truck is not in garage name, VLC will still show name off previous owner.

Slidey

Well there was nothing said about it at any of the courses I have done and I have definitely tested vehicles with the garage name on them.

I have also never tested anything from the other truck garage in the county

dirtydiesel

I think the nct should be operated the same way as the doe, there must be plenty of garages out there who have the equipment required and would be glad of the work.
It would take care of the backlog and keep things running smooth when the yearly test for older cars starts.

Guy:Incognito

dirtydiesel wrote: »

I think the nct should be operated the same way as the doe, there must be plenty of garages out there who have the equipment required and would be glad of the work.
It would take care of the backlog and keep things running smooth when the yearly test for older cars starts.

I think the DOE should be switched to the NCT system. The DOE , like the UK MOT system is way to open to dodgyness.


Random checks wont work because all that does is check if the guys are competant and doing the tests, hich they will be. Dodgy tests dont work on a basis where you picked a random garage , go in and ask if they take backhanders. It's word of mouth and recommendations from peopel who know the guy. Every time I have a conversation with people on anyrhing to do with the DOE I'm offered numbers of places to get the test passed no questions.

There has been plenty of dodgy MOT stories in the UK papers over the years.

L1011

I've been handed a DOE cert a day after being given a document with two FAILS on it, and getting the one I was told to correct corrected. Don't trust the system as far as I could throw it; and that wasn't even a case of looking for a bogey cert!

The RSA can't test for bribeability and willingness to pass mates vehicles, no matter how well they test independent VTN centres.

-Corkie-

I dont know but its easy to pass vehicles in some centres as opposed to others. I talkin about doe now. I use the same centre all the time and have got pass certs where I shouldnt. I do always sort the problem afterwards just in case though....

Slidey

MYOB wrote: »

I've been handed a DOE cert a day after being given a document with two FAILS on it, and getting the one I was told to correct corrected. Don't trust the system as far as I could throw it; and that wasn't even a case of looking for a bogey cert!

SARASON wrote: »

I dont know but its easy to pass vehicles in some centres as opposed to others. I talkin about doe now. I use the same centre all the time and have got pass certs where I shouldnt. I do always sort the problem afterwards just in case though....

See, these I don't think would ever happen in the NCT. My opinion, there is no competition between the centres so why would they bother taking the chance.

MYOB wrote: »

The RSA can't test for bribeability and willingness to pass mates vehicles, no matter how well they test independent VTN centres.

Why not send in a truck with known faults and see what it comes out with, no bribes offered, no talking to the driver.

Guy:Incognito

Slidey wrote: »

Why not send in a truck with known faults and see what it comes out with, no bribes offered, no talking to the driver.

All that will prove is that the tester missed something/is lazy/is human etc. These are faults with people not specific issues with abuse of the system.

-Corkie-

Stekelly wrote: »

All that will prove is that the tester missed something/is lazy/is human etc. These are faults with people not specific issues with abuse of the system.

And on top of that if I have a good few vehicles and test everything there they are not going to fail me as it would cost 100 euro for a retest. In saying that anything critical like brakes/steering will not pass even with bribes...;)

kildare.17hmr

Slidey wrote: »

See, these I don't think would ever happen in the NCT. My opinion, there is no competition between the centres so why would they bother taking the chance.

Not true, iv had NCTs passed and the tester tellin me this and that came up, will ya get it sorted before it goes out;).

kildare.17hmr

SARASON wrote: »

they are not going to fail me as it would cost 100 euro for a retest.

your usin the wrong test centre if thats wot ya pay for retests:D

L1011

Slidey wrote: »

Why not send in a truck with known faults and see what it comes out with, no bribes offered, no talking to the driver.

All that proves is that they test stuff properly, if the premises also had a garage attached you'd need to send a vehicle with no known faults through to make sure none appeared.

It does NOTHING to check to see if they're corruptible.

Slidey

MYOB wrote: »

All that proves is that they test stuff properly

Ummm, thats my point.

Vehicles are not being tested anywhere near properly

L1011

Slidey wrote: »

Ummm, thats my point.

Vehicles are not being tested anywhere near properly

Vehicles are often not being tested anywhere near properly in NCT centres either. The main problems with a decentralised privateer approach that a centralised one either prevents or reduces are corruption and fake fails.

gofaster_s13

Enforcement, Enforcement, Enforcement, if a haulier knew that there was a high likelihood of traffic core or the RSA stopping him at a random check then he wouldnt chance a dodgy cert, its an easy check up for the authorities(how many times have people here been behind trucks running over 90kmh, trucks with faded markings, vehicles with obvious rust etc which can be seen without a roadside check) they just don't bother.

Guy:Incognito

gofaster_s13 wrote: »

Enforcement, Enforcement, Enforcement, if a haulier knew that there was a high likelihood of traffic core or the RSA stopping him at a random check then he wouldnt chance a dodgy cert, its an easy check up for the authorities(how many times have people here been behind trucks running over 90kmh, trucks with faded markings, vehicles with obvious rust etc which can be seen without a roadside check) they just don't bother.

What do you mean dodgy certs? The certs are 100% real and supplied by the garage that legitmately is in the VTN system. It's the passing of the test by handign over a few quid thats the problem, after that theres no way of tellign the vehicle wasnt legitimately passed.

What happens in dodgy DOE centres would be the same as if you went to the mechanic in the NCT place with €100 and asked him to pass your car and he did. You'd have a legitimate cert and disc, it just wouldnt have been gotten legitimately.

Slidey

I think what he means is that you would have a cert when you shouldn't have one.

The lads that I know who are in the RSA are no dopes. AFAIK they were all previously testers so know their stuff.

As gofaster said, if I'm behind a lorry/van I'd have a fair idea if it doesn't/shouldn't have a cert.

The RSA guys would be the same but there is not enough of them out there and they are basically powerless without the Gardaí