NVG's Cheating or not?

cheecch251

Hi lads,

I was just wondering what the rules are regarding the use of night vision goggles on night ops. I have a cheap set that came with my MW2 prestige edtn and they only work out to 60-70 feet and the picture isnt that clear. Also they have bright red LED's on the front that will give you away the minute you turn them on, they restrict your vision and you constantly have to move your head.

Now if they are not against the rules what are people's thgts on them and there use?

If people think this is just down right cheating, I have no problem in leaving them at home just want to hear what you think.

Cheers

jeawan

All Armed forces use NVG's so i can't see why it would be classed as cheating as we are playing a Sport that simulates war to some extent and i do know allot of people that have NVG's so use em if you have em i say it makes tactical sense.

cheecch251

Yeah i could use them but is it fair since most people dont have them.

Will it put my team at an unfair advantage? And where do you draw the line on equipment you can bring in?

jeawan

if you have them and the other team doesn't so be it tbh i wouldn't worry about fair or not , if the site says no NVG's then fair enough but if not then use them.
They are part of your gear that you can use the same as Camo, grenades, claymores or mines not all people use them but sometimes they lead to an advantage in the game if you have them.

cheecch251

well just putting it out there for debate, the lads might agree with you in the forum but when there getting popped in the dark and have no idea where its coming from i think their opinion on them will change pretty quick:D

jeawan

True it is one of the things on my List to buy but it always gets put back for other items but again i haven't played any Night games yet so i have no need of them

cheecch251

Im going to the dark mists thing with the lads from north dublin rangers hopefully, I completly forgot i had them till i found my prestige MW2 with them in the box i wouldnt go out n buy a set the risk of destroying them in a bad fall is too great with them being so expensive.

The ones i have are cheap and cheerful and its not a big loss if/when they break. they will only pick up movement at distance so its not a huge advantage really.

But having said that we will be using chem lights and torches and they will pick them up a mile away.:cool:

Bernie Mac

Well lets put it this way, if I have a grenade (any generic type) for example and my opponent doesn't, does it mean that I am cheating? no not at all.

If I have a Systema PTW and my opponent is using an un-upgraded JG G36 for example does it mean I am cheating? again no.

So in you case go for it use them you are not cheating by any means. But odds are from what i have seen of people with cheat NVG's they usually discard them after a game or two as their own natural night vision is clearer

cheecch251

good point bernie,

I was just thinking will they become more of a burden than an advantage

Stonewolf

As far as I know all the decent NVG stuff is restricted anyway.

jeawan

cheecch251 wrote: »

good point bernie,

I was just thinking will they become more of a burden than an advantage

As bernie said if they are cheap probably a burden , if they are a good set Advantage , a friend has the MW2 ones and he said they are not great so i reckon it up to you id probably not use em.

cheecch251

well i suppose so but might just try them if they are cr@p so be it il just stash back in the pouch and leave them at home the next time.

But its worth looking into anyway, just wanted to put it to the people and gauge reaction.

Dread-Lock

Cheating? No of course not (at least in my opinion).
But I'd personally say those night vision goggles would probably be more of a burden. I've never used them but there was a huge thread on them when they first came out and apparently they're pretty sh!t and they light you up like a Christmas tree.

jeawan

Stonewolf wrote: »

As far as I know all the decent NVG stuff is restricted anyway.

How so ? as you can buy 1st gen and 2nd gen off the shelfs in town and on the internet easy enough i know you are not allowed to use rifle NVG scopes but goggles i didnt know there was a law or restriction on them.

Dread-Lock

jeawan wrote: »

How so ? as you can buy 1st gen and 2nd gen off the shelfs in town and on the internet easy enough i know you are not allowed to use rifle NVG scopes but goggles i didnt know there was a law or restriction on them.

I believe Gen 3 and above are restricted (you need a license).

Ayrtonf7

I was walking around Lidl the other day and low and behold I see they are coming back with there NvG binocular. Tempted to buy it, its 150 euros but thats 150 euros I dont have at the moment, and with the limited use id get from it I probably wont. I have heard its pretty decent for the price however.

As for Cheating with NvG, I believe it only becomes a problem with u mount it on you Aeg (i mean firearm )

jeawan

Ayrtonf7 wrote: »

I was walking around Lidl the other day and low and behold I see they are coming back with there NvG binocular. Tempted to buy it, its 150 euros but thats 150 euros I dont have at the moment, and with the limited use id get from it I probably wont. I have heard its pretty decent for the price however.

As for Cheating with NvG, I believe it only becomes a problem with u mount it on you Aeg (i mean firearm )

when are they coming back stock ?

cheecch251

Like i said before even if you get a good set they do have their disadvantages too.

1. Your peripherial vision (excuse the spelling if its incorrect) is badly restricted to the point where your neck will be in bits from all the left to right and right to left scaning you will have to do.

2. If they are fixed on a head band will they count as eye protection? If so ,and the batt goes or there is another problem and you need to take them off your are in a serious situation in the middle of a fight.

3. Its another bit of kit you have to carry with you.

4. Will they affect your accuracy?

5. If and when you fall on them (which you will ref point 1), are they an investment you are willing to lose?

These are all things you have to weigh up against the advantage of being able to see in complete darkness.

Ayrtonf7

Jeawan as far as I know near the end of july. The 28th or something like that give or take a day or two.

Rew

Unless the rules say no its not cheating.

Cheap NV with active IR looks like someone using a torch at night to other NV. Without active IR it requires a fair bit of ambient light (works OK in the open but not indoors or under trees etc.

Puding

It would be cheating is the game/event rule set said no nvg and you used them anyway,

Personaly found gen1 or 1+ only good for observation, and more of a hinderance than a help for anything else

know if you spending a few grand on a gen 3 and up the qually means a lot more is possible

It does feel a bit unfair when you go to an event and see a lot of guys with more moneys worth of gear in optics than your car may be worth but in relity I've yet to find it to overpowering and always been able to stay competitive you just need to know the tricks to level the playing field

Dread-Lock

jeawan wrote: »

when are they coming back stock ?

http://www.lidl.ie/ie/home.nsf/pages/c.o.20100722.p.Night_Vision_3x40

fayer

Puding wrote: »

Personaly found gen1 or 1+ only good for observation, and more of a hinderance than a help for anything else

+1 Useless! I got a set in form the US, not worth it unless you get a very large IR strobe.

miniture

cheecch251 wrote: »

Like i said before even if you get a good set they do have their disadvantages too.

1. Your peripherial vision (excuse the spelling if its incorrect) is badly restricted to the point where your neck will be in bits from all the left to right and right to left scaning you will have to do.

2. If they are fixed on a head band will they count as eye protection? If so ,and the batt goes or there is another problem and you need to take them off your are in a serious situation in the middle of a fight.

3. Its another bit of kit you have to carry with you.

4. Will they affect your accuracy?

5. If and when you fall on them (which you will ref point 1), are they an investment you are willing to lose?

These are all things you have to weigh up against the advantage of being able to see in complete darkness.

And with most NVGs that come out from your face you cant bring your AEG up to your shoulder prperly without knocking the NVGs off your face or having the AUG completely block your view

ED E

I could see a use in them if you pre arranged that your team would wear strobing IR units on their backs, but they'd be vulnerable to opposition with NV.


Its such a pity thermal is so dear.

AlternateID

I'm guessing most of the posters here haven't played a night game. I'm also guessing that most have never used the lidl nv.

Don't waste your money on it. You may think it'll be worth it but it wont. Night games are about stealth, cunning and patience. One guy working as a spotter with a torch and a few rifle ment watching nearby will be far more effective. Night games are, in my opinion, the best airsoft games. Even the most trigger happy will enjoy themselves even though they may not fire a single shot. Constant paranoia and pumping adrenaline.

On the subject of gen 3, I can't afford it but want it. You are looking at thousands to get even bad gen 3 gear. I got the oportunity to use a rifle mounted nv scope in Senny in May and can tell you it was awesome. Not the best bit of kit available but still I wanted it.

There was also a small group of lads that had head mounted gen 3 that we followed for a bit who really sucked. They're kit was the best and they could of dominated the night game but they didn't seem to know what to do or where to go.

Is using NV cheating? Certainly not. Although I don't own nv I wouldn't play any site that band it as a rule.

Rew

I've used the military stuff its not the be all and end all. You have to go active IR in buildings or forests, the rifle sights are good but you cant walk/move using them only spot or shoot due to the magnification.

Even on active with the goggles I found it difficult to move easily in a forest without out tripping/falling. Its extreamly disorientating, difficult to pick up static targets (some guy in a bush). Your field of view is very narrow and your depth perception very poor.

I was recceing an enemy position that was using commercial/lidil NV and they were lighting their own position up like Christmas with IR, I would have seen next to nothing if they had kept it off!! It was like guys with torches to me.

In an open area I could clearly see enemy at 150m-200m with the rifle sight, again it was very difficult to pickup static targets, they just blend with the background.

Obviously in some environments its more useful then others and practice helps a lot!

You can get IR chemical light sticks which are handy for various marking tasks instead of strobes.

If you are using it and someone pulls out a strong white light source then can cause your NV gear allot of grief.

coys

AlternateID wrote: »

I got the oportunity to use a rifle mounted nv scope in Senny in May and can tell you it was awesome. Not the best bit of kit available but still I wanted it.
.

Yea heard about that, was meant to be the bees knees, Apparently you could see people stacking up outside the buildings no bother.

I got a chance to mess about with the MW2 ones and my god the were awful, in a game you would spend more time falling over due to lack of depth perception than actually trying to fire your AEG.

Loads of people had none in senny (myself included) and it was immense fun and an adrenaline rush, plus with that little bit of natural night vision you should be alright.

+1 for the torch spotter idea btw!!

cheecch251

Well you have settled it for me lads gona leave the cr@py NVG'S at home dark mists.

Now off to start my bugs bunny diet:D

evilrobotshane

I was at a game where one of the guys in my section had one of the supermarket monoculars, and it was actually quite handy. Not for navigation or combat or anything, but when holding a position or waiting in ambush having one person acting as a spotter with them let us get the drop on approaching groups - we saw them long before they saw us. There's not much use for everyone having them, but one guy in a section I reckon is a fine idea.