german eastern and western army uniforms

private2bcadet

since before the WW1 era the german army uniform of nearly all ranks features what looks like a roman numeral for the number 2 on the colar... to this day german soldiers still have these numeral looking symbols.

simple question, what does this 2 signify? or is it even a two?

i have a dress tunic of the modern germany army, signals corps(i have a completely random collection of military memorabilia), and it also features these numerals

tac foley

Sir - I don't think it is a Roman 2, but simply a device made up of bars - please have a look at THIS site....

http://www.tridentmilitary.com/German-WW2/German-Army-insignia.html

tac

PS - my two Godsons, who were both majors in the Luftwaffe and retired last year to fly for Lufthansa, had stylised eagles, not bars.

private2bcadet

tac foley wrote: »

Sir - I don't think it is a Roman 2, but simply a device made up of bars - please have a look at THIS site....

http://www.tridentmilitary.com/German-WW2/German-Army-insignia.html

tac

PS - my two Godsons, who were both majors in the Luftwaffe and retired last year to fly for Lufthansa, had stylised eagles, not bars.

ya i was just unsure if it was actually a numeral or what its significance was. ya it seams that its only the army that wear the bars! thanks for the info

peasant

There ya go:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waffenfarbe

Them things,

called "Kragenspiegel" are on all dress uniforms of the Heer (army) in the Bundeswehr. Luftwaffe (air force) gets a wing symbol instead, the Marine (Navy) doesn't do them any more.

Officers get the "II" in silver, noncoms in gold and lower ranks in grey.
The background colour is according to the troop function in the first article

Little Alex

I always thought that the "II" had some sort of meaning too, but seeing as how it was used by the Reichswehr, Wehrmacht and NVA, it must actually have no particular signifigance since these three armies would be total opposites of each other... but then again, it must having some sort of meaning...

Anyway, I am visiting Berlin soon and am myself interested in assembling an East German uniform.

I was wondering if anyone knew of any good shops or flea markets where I could find them on sale.

Little Alex

I was hoping that there would be some uniforms on offer at the Sunday markets - if only so that I could try them on to figure out the correct size that I need, but there weren't any to be found... plenty on eBay though.

Doesn't matter, because I'm kind of on the way towards getting together a couple of DDR uniforms. And if anyone is interested I'll post the pics here.

The uniforms I have in mind: DDR-Reichsbahn (railway company), Luftverteidigung (air defense/force), Grenztruppen (border guards) and MfS-Dzierzynski (elite Stasi bodyguard/security regiment).

So far I have the Reichsbahn tunic and trousers.

I am awaiting two Absolventenabzeichen (graduation badges) which I got really cheaply on eBay...

simplybam

Not quite on the subject but here are a couple of interesting facts, methinks:

The NVA (National People's Army - east German army) retained the old Wehrmacht uniforms in design for it's entire life span until the wall came down.

The East German Rail service was still called the 'Reichsbahn' thus kept the name of the rail service from Imperial Germany (Deutsche Reichsbahn founded in 1920) and Nazi Germany (1933-1945).

Just a couple of interesting facts I believe considering the whole idea behind the DDR.

Morlar

simplybam wrote: »

Not quite on the subject but here are a couple of interesting facts, methinks:

The NVA (National People's Army - east German army) retained the old Wehrmacht uniforms in design for it's entire life span until the wall came down.

The East German Rail service was still called the 'Reichsbahn' thus kept the name of the rail service from Imperial Germany (Deutsche Reichsbahn founded in 1920) and Nazi Germany (1933-1945).

Just a couple of interesting facts I believe considering the whole idea behind the DDR.

As an FYI there are some early Occupation zone Sachsen Polizei-uniform designs here (as well as Volkspolizei) :

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056360986

Little Alex

They certainly are anomalies! :pac:

simplybam wrote: »

Not quite on the subject but here are a couple of interesting facts, methinks:

The NVA (National People's Army - east German army) retained the old Wehrmacht uniforms in design for it's entire life span until the wall came down.

The NVA was established in 1956 and with it the "old" Wehrmacht-style uniforms were reintroduced. This certainly raised eyebrows, especially since up until then the "police" (KVP) had its own new style of uniform, such as in Morlar's post.

The story goes that the Russian Defense Minister approached his DDR counterpart upon the establishment of the Warsaw Pact and asked him why he was wearing a Russian uniform, reminded him that he was in fact German and basically told him to do something about it: Stalin was, of course, long since dead and discredited at this stage.

How the NVA came by its tunic...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-SvGkk7F_O4

The voiceover insults the Bundeswehr: ... in contrast to the American uniforms of the West German mercenaries...

They say that the design of the Wehrmacht uniform goes back to 1813, so it is a German and not a Nazi uniform.

simplybam

Thanks for that very informative video.

Much appreciated