Anyone remember...?

L.Jenkins

Anyone remember the show back in 2004, there's something about Miriam. I remember that it was still somewhat taboo and the idea of a man going out with a transgendered woman was a big thing. I articularly remember there was such an uproar over it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/There's_Something_About_Miriam

Links234

that horribly exploitative crap that played up on the disgusting idea that transwomen are only out to trick guys? yeah, I remember reading about it.

L.Jenkins

It was a horrible idea. With that I don't to many men would have liked the idea of dating a Trans Woman. I wonder would it be the same today?

Links234

doubt attitudes have changed all that much in a few years.

L.Jenkins

The joy of a 'modern society'. Trans people have been around since the early 1900's, it's now 2010, you think it would be a more liberal and accepting one. Still don't appriciate that tv show and the mockery it made of Trans people.

Links234

ItsThatManAgain wrote: »

Trans people have been around since the early 1900's

trans people have been around for thousands of years and in many different cultures and continents

there's this nasty idea that advances in medical science brought about transgender identities since medical transition has been made possible, but that's like saying that people with a sight defect have been around since glasses were made.

L.Jenkins

I stand corrected. The advance in medical science has brought the ability to tranisition, but not ones identity. Trans people have been here as long as humanity. I believe the Native Americans call Trans People two-spirit and it was widely accepted and acknowledged in there society and culture.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Two-Spirit

Links234

look up hijra, there were even early forms of SRS carried out on them

L.Jenkins

Wow, that would be an exceptionally painful experience. I applaude them for undergoing such a risky and painful precedure.

Links234

ItsThatManAgain wrote: »

Wow, that would be an exceptionally painful experience. I applaude them for undergoing such a risky and painful precedure.

yeah, it's astounding
I know one girl online who actually removed her own testes

as bad as I feel sometimes, I can't imagine being in such a bad way to carry out self-surgery :eek:

L.Jenkins

Some people just feel so despite for a change that they will go to that extreme and may use it sometimes to get SRS. I think I'd wait too for surgery.

Links234

ItsThatManAgain wrote: »

Some people just feel so despite for a change that they will go to that extreme and may use it sometimes to get SRS. I think I'd wait too for surgery.

somethign like that would actually hinder them getting SRS, that it's self harm and your psychologist wouldn't write off on the documents to get your surgery.

L.Jenkins

I could imagine it would, I would feel bad for anyone who would do that to themselves, because to will to change can be such an overwhelming feeling.

Links234

I read an absolute horror story once about some woman in the states who couldn't afford SRS and decided to cut off her penis, an ambulance was called, they re-attatched it and left her with a big huge bill that was more than the cost of SRS. :eek:

L.Jenkins

The poor woman. The health system in the Country is shít. I feel very sorry for her in her situation. Hopefully one day she can work it all out.

Links234

yeah, I don't know if it's really true or not, or just some story that's circulated to scare people off attempting any kind of self surgery.

L.Jenkins

Well its convinced me to wait. Another issue I read up on, on the other forum was help with family. A teen described his treatment by family when he told them. It was scary, they even threatened to kill him.

Im definately going to wait until I'm living on my own before i tell any relation.

Links234

ItsThatManAgain wrote: »

Well its convinced me to wait. Another issue I read up on, on the other forum was help with family. A teen described his treatment by family when he told them. It was scary, they even threatened to kill him.

Im definately going to wait until I'm living on my own before i tell any relation.

that kinda thing happens all too often
http://www.haaretz.com/print-edition/news/jaffa-men-charged-with-beating-transgender-brother-1.300659

I'm very lucky that my family says they still love me

L.Jenkins

You've told your family. Atleast they're accepting of it. I'm bricking at the idea of telling my family, but that's along time down the road. My mother has a shítty attitude as of late and doesn't give me much hope when I need to tell them.

That will happen before I start HRT so they will know I serious and not taking the píss. I wish my family were liberal

Links234

yeah, like I said, I'm one of the lucky ones.

I do hope your parents are ok with it though, or at least still talk to you

L.Jenkins

I don't know if I should be spilling my guts out here, but reading that forum really hit home today. I was essentially told not to live in a dream world and in the naive belief that my parents especially would accept me with open arms.

The more I read, the more preperation I'll have to do to prepare myself for whatever comes my way. I only wish it could be as easy as clicking my fingers and puff it's all over with a Disney ending. Delusions sadly. So besides working on the small things, I'm working on getting work and an apartment in Galway. Things are looking up slightly as I'm up for interviews for a course in Galway with the possibility of work.

Links234

well, as always, I wish you the absolute best of luck

L.Jenkins

And that you do I'll pick this one up tomorrow, so tired. Tired and emotional

shoegirl

I think things have moved on a little since then, it was exploitative crap. I think some of the guys actually sued the production company. Still it did kinda get through the message that reassignment can produce results that enable most people to just get on with their life and move on, which is, I think, useful to at least some people who are gender variant.

Links234

shoegirl wrote: »

Still it did kinda get through the message that reassignment can produce results that enable most people to just get on with their life and move on, which is, I think, useful to at least some people who are gender variant.

I really can't agree there,
there's even been some pretty gorgeous transwomen on Jerry springer who you could say the same about, but the show was still guilty of reinforcing the very negative and damaging opinion that trans women are just out to deceive and trick guys. reality shows like this aren't doing anything good at all when they're reinforcing horrible disgusting stereotypes.

you want to see a reality show that got out a good message? America's next top model when they had transgender model Isis King competing:



she wasn't portrayed as the butt of a joke, not some sexual deceiver out to turn tricks, not some curiosity, but just as a woman competing with other women. she was on the show because she was stunning and beautiful and she deserved to be there with all the other girls. they showed her as a strong, beautiful, confident woman, but above all they showed her for who she is as a person.

that's a message, that's the kind of trans women we should see on TV, not someone's who is actually desperate enough to go along with the sickening premise of "lol I have a penis, you got fooled, hahaha!"

L.Jenkins

shoegirl wrote: »

I think things have moved on a little since then, it was exploitative crap. I think some of the guys actually sued the production company.

They all sued the production company, because they all felt deceived. It hasn't done much for PR.

shoegirl wrote: »

Still it did kinda get through the message that reassignment can produce results that enable most people to just get on with their life and move on, which is, I think, useful to at least some people who are gender variant.

SRS may produce some exceptional results, but it could possibly hang over your head that your Transgendered. For example, would you be honest with someone and tell them you were born a different gender or keep quite about it.

Speak Now

Isn't Miriam still post op even all these years later.

From reading your posts on here i get the impression you girls can't wait to get the reassignment done.

Would there be lots of pre-op's happy to stay that way or is it just a decision some make to stay in the "Entertainment" industry

L.Jenkins

I can't speak for everyone. With respect to my current gender, it's gotto go. I'm determined to make a full transition, not to suit society but myself. I doubt to many here are transitioning for entertainment purposes either.

Links234

Jerry Seinfeld wrote: »

Isn't Miriam still post op even all these years later.

From reading your posts on here i get the impression you girls can't wait to get the reassignment done.

Would there be lots of pre-op's happy to stay that way or is it just a decision some make to stay in the "Entertainment" industry

Well yes and no, there's a lot of girls who are perfectly happy with having a penis, and there is a lot of girls who make their living in pornography where having a penis is a bonus. but there's also plenty of girls who are extremely uncomfortable with it, some who are kinda uncomfortable, or some who aren't bothered either way. Not everyone experiences gender dysphoria the same way, everyone's different

but the actual genital reassignment surgery is only a small part of the picture
the transition from male to female is mostly about hormones. it's the hormones that make your breasts grow, that change the shape of your body with body fat redistribution, how your facial features soften and look feminine, your skin soften and change in texture, body hair, body odor. it's hormones that are the most important thing because they effect changes inside and out.

so even for someone like me who's really uncomfortable with what's between her legs, surgery is still just a small part of things. I want to have breasts probably as much as the surgery, or I want to feel that my body is female, I want to look in the mirror and not see someone male looking back at me, all of those things on their own are as important or perhaps more important than surgery.

a lot would say that genital reassignment is just the icing on the cake

and there's a lot of people who don't even like the terms pre-op, post-op, non-op. it's kinda objectifying, and classifying people by their surgical status is really not looking at them as people. a girl is a girl, it doesn't matter what's in her pants, she's still female. even in miriam's case I'd still consider 100% a woman no matter what's between her legs.

baby and crumble

i'm possibly going to be annoying and shallow here and say the only reason i remember that show is because Miriam was such a fox!

Links234

zoegh wrote: »

i'm possibly going to be annoying and shallow here and say the only reason i remember that show is because Miriam was such a fox!

she was gorgeous

Speak Now

Links234 wrote: »

she was gorgeous

She still is

baby and crumble

duuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuude...

That pic is epic. You've made me very very happy. (And another word that begins with 'h' but that's prob against forum rules so I'll leave it be... )

Links234

I suppose, but I've read she's working as an escort these days
between that, and taking part in such a horribly exploitative show, I can't say I've got much respect for her

there's so many transgender women out there I find far more attractive and have way more respect for

baby and crumble

Can I ask, why do people think it was exploitative? What I took from it, and most people I ever spoke to about it, was that it showed that trans women can be super feminine and hot, and also that men can be shallow tools.

Links234

zoegh wrote: »

Can I ask, why do people think it was exploitative? What I took from it, and most people I ever spoke to about it, was that it showed that trans women can be super feminine and hot, and also that men can be shallow tools.

The whole premise of the show is to play off a trans woman's identity as deception, that her femininity is a ruse, a hoax or a trick. we are never encouraged to see her as female, the whole message of the show is that here is a woman who isn't who she says she is, it says that her identity as a woman is false, and at the end of the show the "truth" will be revealed that she's a "man"
the show's message is that she's a fake.

this is an absolutely horrible and extremely damaging stereotype to perpetuate, and the notion of transwomen being deceivers and tricksters is what drives a lot of transphobia, people feel the need to call out the woman for what they see as a deception, which leads to all kinds of verbal attacks and harassment.

the show also sends the message that being with a transgender woman is a horrible situation and a really bad thing. that they have this huge cash prize for the contestant that actually accepts to go with her pretty much says this

it's exploitative of the very worst transphobic attitudes in society and it's exploitative of trans people's identities, playing them off as fake. IF the show also sends the message that trans women can be extremely hot, then that's just to be taken that trans women can be even more dangerous deceivers than you might expect.

baby and crumble

Ok, fair point. I guess I never saw it that way.

I just saw it as showing the men involved up for the shallow morons they were...

Links234

the controversy in the media before the show was aired played the men up as victims, if there was ever an idea to show them up as shallow morons, it got lost in that

but really, it's not like this show is alone in portraying a negative and damaging stereotype, everything from the Crying Game to "reality" shows like Jerry Springer are doing that