Attic Conversion - Hipped roof

dvpower

I've being toying with the idea of getting my attic converted for use as a guest bedroom or a kids playroom.

Problem is, my house is a standard semi-D but with a hipped roof. I'm having difficulties visualising how a stairway would go up there and how much space would be left if it did.

Anyway, my basic question is, is it really possible or practical to convert an attic in a property with a hipped roof and what are the disadvantages of doing so (or design tips to mitigate them).

I'd very reluctant to go for a hip to gable conversion for reasons of planning hassles and cost.

Peter Sweeney

Depends on the size and ceiling height of the attic space.

Most modern 3 bedroom houses would not have adequate floor to ceiling height (over 50% of the floor area should be 2.4 meters high) to meet with building regulation standards as a habitable room irregardless of whether there is a hip or gable style roof.

There may be a number of similar houses in your estate that have attic conversions (look for skylights in the roof at the back of the house). Simply asking one of your neighbours to have a look at their conversion may give you a good understanding as what is possible in an attic of similar size.

mickdw

You will have little space due to the hip imo. The answer above highlights the problem of 50% of the room having full ceiling height which might be difficult to achieve but even forgeting this, the hip will mean very little useable space.
Depending on house layout, you may also have alot of remodelling to do on the first floor to faciliate a stairs to level 3

dazzlermac

is it a full hip(hip rafter from ridge to wall plate)or a dutch hip(hip rafter from ridge to roughly half way between ridge and wall plate)??

dvpower

dazzlermac wrote: »

is it a full hip(hip rafter from ridge to wall plate)or a dutch hip(hip rafter from ridge to roughly half way between ridge and wall plate)??

Its a full hip (if I understand terminology correctly).
But its a semi-D, so the hip is on one side only (if that makes any sense).

dan_d

Does your existing stairs run from ground floor to first floor under the low point of the roof, or the highest point? As in, against the party wall or the gable wall?

ricman

Theres good info here http://www.above-it-all.co.uk/loft_conversions/loft_stairs.
see here http://www.laddersalesdirect.co.uk/home-diy-ladders-loft-ladders-c-311_105.html
would it be possible to get a loft ladder and just leave it down ,all the time.
IF SPACE is restricted on the upper landing .

ricman

A carpenter ,builder could probably design a small stairs to go in a restricted space ,perhaps made of metal tubes ,to save space.
see here http://www.spirecoengineering.com/Attic-stairs.htm
iron basket type saves space.

dvpower

dan_d wrote: »

Does your existing stairs run from ground floor to first floor under the low point of the roof, or the highest point? As in, against the party wall or the gable wall?

My stairs, unfortunately, run against the gable wall (under the low point of the roof).

I'm having difficulties envisaging how another stair would contort itself into the attic. Admittedly, spatial skills aren't my strong suit.

dazzlermac

dvpower wrote: »

My stairs, unfortunately, run against the gable wall (under the low point of the roof).

I'm having difficulties envisaging how another stair would contort itself into the attic. Admittedly, spatial skills aren't my strong suit.

you can turn the stairs a couple of times so that as u walk into attic your last run of stairs is runnin the same way as your hip(hard to explain).i would advise get a chippy to have look and he would know by taking a few quick measurments.

dvpower

dazzlermac wrote: »

you can turn the stairs a couple of times so that as u walk into attic your last run of stairs is runnin the same way as your hip(hard to explain).i would advise get a chippy to have look and he would know by taking a few quick measurments.

I think I understand what you're getting at.
I found this on the internet, which is a pretty accurate representation of my layout. I think this is basically how it would go (the entrance might be a little closer to the centre of the attic and the return on the stairs would need to be closer to avoid a gable window).
There's still the makings of a reasonably sized room up there.



That brings me to another question: am I allowed to put a small skylight on the hip, basically to provide some light to the new stairway and below, or do I need planning permission because it faces out to the side, not the back, of the house?

Peter Sweeney

In most circumstances skylights are only allowed to the back of the house.

Attic conversions normally would be exempt developments under Section 4(1)(h) of the Building Control Act 2000. This section states "development consisting of the carrying out of works for the maintenance, improvement or other alteration of the structure, being works that only affect the interior of the structure or which do not materially affect the external appearance of the structure so as to render such appearance inconsistant with the character of the structure or of neighbouring structure" shall be exempted developments.

If a number of similar houses along your row have skylights to the side of their dwelling then it is feasible that fitting a new skylight to the side of your property is an exempt development. Ask the Local Planning Authority.

Unfortunately, Planning Authorities do take a very narrow view of this section.
Planning Authorities in almost all cases take the view that planning permission is required unless the contrary can be shown.

Mellor

Peter Sweeney wrote: »

If a number of similar houses along your row have skylights to the side of their dwelling then it is feasible that fitting a new skylight to the side of your property is an exempt development. Ask the Local Planning Authority.

You were right about the attic being exempt.

But the above is wrong. If other houses have have set a precedent then it is considered premitted development, not exempt. Only items in the schedule are exempt.

dvpower

Mellor wrote: »

You were right about the attic being exempt.

But the above is wrong. If other houses have have set a precedent then it is considered premitted development, not exempt. Only items in the schedule are exempt.

Does permitted mean that you must ask, but they'll say yes or that you don't need to ask?

De.Lite.Touch

A friend told me about these references in the Planning Board.
220205: 32 Ballinclea Heights, Killiney, Co. Dublin. (D06B/0707)

226900: 32 Ballinclea Heights, Killiney, Co. Dublin. (D07B/0828)

RL2287: 32 Ballinclea Heights, Killiney, Co. Dublin

RL2284: 32 Ballinclea Heights, Killiney, Co. Dublin

He says ask your planner every time, but bring copies of these with you.

- De.Lite.Touch

shane acb

i would send stairs up through a bedroom. you will loose bout 3ft wide by 8ft long out of the room,but you gain another room so its well worth it. this means you land in the high part of roof.

astrofool

Two houses opposite us (3 bed semi-d) filled out the hip roof when doing the attic conversion.

We were lucky in a bigger 4 bed semi-d, and already had a pitched roof, and conversion was already done when we moved in, had room for a landing space to the attic, as well as having a massive room with good head height.

De.Lite.Touch

Some useful advice from the Department of the Environment:

http://www.environ.ie/en/DevelopmentandHousing/BuildingStandards/PublicationsDocuments/FileDownLoad,1657,en.pdf

http://www.environ.ie/en/DevelopmentandHousing/BuildingStandards/PublicationsDocuments/FileDownLoad,5093,en.doc

A friend fell tripped and fell down the last tree steps of a tapered stairs, broke her wrist and bumped her head leading to concussion.

Ladders are not allowed for permanent access to a converted attic - you need a proper stairs.

You need to be able to get outr safely if a fire starts.

De.Lite.Touch

dvpower

shane acb wrote: »

i would send stairs up through a bedroom. you will loose bout 3ft wide by 8ft long out of the room,but you gain another room so its well worth it. this means you land in the high part of roof.

A stair with a 180 degree turn from a landing would serve the same purpose?
Sacrificing that much space from an existing bedroom would be too high a price to pay IMO.

shane acb

hi, yeah a 180 can also work but usually means takin space from box room. and the head height still can not be great in some cases. it also leaves you with big stairs in your landing.
fair enough you keep the space in bed room.
so it is defo worth lookin at.