To fund or not to fund

tomie

There was quite a lengthy discussion at last night’s Tuesday meetup about funding. I didn’t participate as I was a little lost on the context for such a debate.

I don’t think as a hackerspace entity we should spend any time on seeking outside sources of funding. If someone wants to make a donation or give us an exceptional deal then it would be churlish and foolish to say no. As long as it is understood there is no reciprocal agreement beyond common civility.

First of all hackerspace as an idea is one of independence and freedom. The point of being self-funded is that it is a demonstrable and meaningful reflection of the members feelings for the space. If no one wants to contribute then it fades away and that will be the end of it. On the converse the more people that are interested the lower we can charge for membership and hopefully we will one day reach the point of not even having to discuss a starving hacker rate.

At the moment all the money coming in is allocated to the functioning of the space, rent, electricity and so on. In the unlikely event of having excess capital (remember rates will reduce as membership goes up) then it will probably be better to use it to create a better space for all the members other than devoting funds to any one project. I’m talking about buying materials such as LEDs and arduinos, and tools that can be used by everyone.

The danger with both external and internal funding is you end up with one group of people managing the money and another having to request it or petition for it. A management structure would inevitably be created where some people will end up managing the purse strings and that would really, really suck. At the moment the financial agenda is straightforward and can be dealt with publicly at the meetups.

Also, since all activities in the space are inherently creative by definition, any rule by which one project would be funded and another one not would be arbitrary in nature and without real meaning. It would have the consequence of creating division between those deemed worthy and those not. And who has the right to do that?

However, if individual projects get external funding and the 091labs members associated with that project want to use the space and make a contribution to the runnings of the lab that would be really great.

This is my opinion and I know others differ but I thought I would just lay out my concerns.

einshteen

The danger with both external and internal funding is you end up with one group of people managing the money and another having to request it or petition for it. A management structure would inevitably be created where some people will end up managing the purse strings and that would really, really suck. At the moment the financial agenda is straightforward and can be dealt with publicly at the meetups.

Not sure what you mean by this...

Also, since all activities in the space are inherently creative by definition, any rule by which one project would be funded and another one not would be arbitrary in nature and without real meaning. It would have the consequence of creating division between those deemed worthy and those not. And who has the right to do that?

Any funding we get would help pay the rent, not to fund particular projects.

As I said before, we're in a tough position in Galway because unlike Dublin or San Francisco which has high rent but a large population, we have high rent and not a lot of people. I would jump at the chance to get funding for the space, it would mean I wouldn't have to go down after work some days and stay working on stuff for the space until 2am. It would mean more time for projects instead of chasing after the rent every month. It would mean lower fees for members so that we could be more inclusive. It would mean we could run free workshops for things like school tours etc. Having to worry about the rent has been a good motivator up to now while we were getting the space up and running but as we're growing it quickly become a hindrance to what we can do with the space.

Funding doesn't have to involve compromising the integrity and philosophy of the space. What we're paying for rent now is a ridiculously good deal and we'd be very lucky to come across any reasonably sized place close to that price range again.

Barry

tomie

einshteen wrote: »

Not sure what you mean by this...



Any funding we get would help pay the rent, not to fund particular projects.

As I said before, we're in a tough position in Galway because unlike Dublin or San Francisco which has high rent but a large population, we have high rent and not a lot of people. I would jump at the chance to get funding for the space, it would mean I wouldn't have to go down after work some days and stay working on stuff for the space until 2am. It would mean more time for projects instead of chasing after the rent every month. It would mean lower fees for members so that we could be more inclusive. It would mean we could run free workshops for things like school tours etc. Having to worry about the rent has been a good motivator up to now while we were getting the space up and running but as we're growing it quickly become a hindrance to what we can do with the space.

Funding doesn't have to involve compromising the integrity and philosophy of the space. What we're paying for rent now is a ridiculously good deal and we'd be very lucky to come across any reasonably sized place close to that price range again.

Barry

The whole thing is brilliant but the natural tendency for a groups such as these is that a small subgroup of people tend to be more involved than others which is totally understandable. We all have different commitments and obligations elsewhere that occupy our limited time and energy. But we must be mindful of keeping everything as 'flat' as possible to avoid a hardcore them and part-time us. Likewise, donations and funds to run the space and provide tools and materials for all to use but funding specific projects is a minefield.

Just voicing a concern from my experience of similar projects back in the day I can see I may have conflated this idea with my personal, highly anarchic view of State involvement in any kind of project. Sorry for confusion.

einshteen

tomie wrote: »

The whole thing is brilliant but the natural tendency for a groups such as these is that a small subgroup of people tend to be more involved than others which is totally understandable. We all have different commitments and obligations elsewhere that occupy our limited time and energy. But we must be mindful of keeping everything as 'flat' as possible to avoid a hardcore them and part-time us.

Of course most of us have other commitments, and it's unfortunate that we don't yet have an official committee so that we can delegate these tasks and distribute the workload. Until then...

Likewise, donations and funds to run the space and provide tools and materials for all to use but funding specific projects is a minefield. Just voicing a concern from my experience of similar projects back in the day I can see I may have conflated this idea with my personal, highly anarchic view of State involvement in any kind of project. Sorry for confusion.

Of course, but as long as funding doesn't come with any strings attached and goes towards paying the rent rather than on specific projects then we agreed it's a good thing?

tdr

Be careful of accepting any funding.
Your membership fee should cover your rent.
Because if your funding goes and your membership fee is too low then you will lose your space.
As your Constitution states "The primary income source for the organisation will be the membership fee, all other sources will be secondary income."
Therefore all other funding is secondary and should be used for tools, space improvements,groups projects.
This also allows you to be more independent.