pronunciation of definite article "an"

stephanus

Hi there,

here's a question I've been wondering about since I first encountered the definite article of Irish: Is the n pronounced when in front of a consonant? It is dropped if the article comes between two consonants like in "leis an bhfómhar" that's what my book tells me.
But what about "an fear" for example. Do I pronounce the n here?

pog it

stephanus wrote: »

Hi there,

here's a question I've been wondering about since I first encountered the definite article of Irish: Is the n pronounced when in front of a consonant? It is dropped if the article comes between two consonants like in "leis an bhfómhar" that's what my book tells me.
But what about "an fear" for example. Do I pronounce the n here?

Yeah as far as I know when you are using the definite article with a noun you do pronounce the 'n' and the 'an' sounds like 'un' as in the word 'sun'.

Like you're saying if it was ag an dochtúir or something like that, the 'n' in that case isn't sounded.

It's the same with 'ag'. So 'ag damhsa' sounds like 'a damhsa'. But if it was a vowel starting noun, you would hear the 'g' as in 'ag ól'.

deise go deo

Right, well thats news to me, I would never have pronounced
''ag damhsa'' as ''a damhsa'' now i'm not very good at Irish but i'm sure i'v never heard it.

Also I would pronounce ''an'' as ''on''

Might be a dialect thing, I'm from Munster, I'm headin up to Conemara next week,god help me I wont understand a word.:o

pog it

deise go deo wrote: »

Right, well thats news to me, I would never have pronounced
''ag damhsa'' as ''a damhsa'' now i'm not very good at Irish but i'm sure i'v never heard it.

Also I would pronounce ''an'' as ''on''

Might be a dialect thing, I'm from Munster, I'm headin up to Conemara next week,god help me I wont understand a word.:o

Well the ag damhsa is pronounced as 'a damhsa' in all the dialects as far as I know. Yeah, 'an' can be pronounced as 'on' or 'un', whatever you like best yourself!

stephanus

Great! Another mistery solved!

Thanks for the replies.

conor.hogan.2

ag damhsa - with the g pronounced means ''at a dance'' - i think.

Malice

stephanus wrote: »

But what about "an fear" for example. Do I pronounce the n here?

I would say that yes, you do pronounce the 'n'.

pog it wrote: »

So 'ag damhsa' sounds like 'a damhsa'.

I have to say I've never come across this myself either.

conor.hogan.2 wrote: »

ag damhsa - with the g pronounced means ''at a dance'' - i think.

Not that this has anything to do with the original post but I would have thought "ag damhsa" simply meant dancing.

stephanus

I flipped a few pages in my book and found what Mr Ó Siadhail has to say on the subject. With "ag" you don't pronounce the "g" in front of a consonant very often ommitting the whole thing in connection with a verbal noun. But in front of a vowel you sound the "g".
Still this is only lesson 16 out of 35 so there may be some more enlightenment on that to come.

As to the article matter I have found another opinion stating the the "n" is NOT pronounced in front of a consonant in normal speech but it CAN be sounded when speaking very clearly. This may explain why I sometimes hear it pronounced and sometimes I don't depending on the sentence structure and intonation of the sentence, I guess.
Language is like law, I fear. Three sources and four opinions.

Krusader

with "ag" when doing an action, when its before a vowel, you add the g on to the next word in speech
e.g. a gól, a géisteacht, a gimeacht

obviously in the written word these would just be: ag ól, ag éisteacht...srl

pog it

Crosáidí wrote: »

with "ag" when doing an action, when its before a vowel, you add the g on to the next word in speech
e.g. a gól, a géisteacht, a gimeacht

Crosáidí: just wondering have you a source for that?

Krusader

listen to buntus cainte, and you'll hear it through out the series of books

pog it

What dialect do you hear that in on Buntús cainte? I'm thinking that *possibly* this is very pronounced in Donegal Irish? As in the G being withheld that bit longer, so you get a . géisteacht.

I'm familiar with the g being pronounced in front of the vowel noun, but not as much with the g going right onto the noun. It's subtler than that in Conamara at least, so that's why I was interested in hearing what your source was (i.e. dialect/etc.) as its different to what I have heard.