Abbey Street Luas stop

etchyed

...has had temporary railings along it for well over a year now, possibly two. They were originally put up when the delta junction works were being carried out at Connolly and the eastbound platform at Abbey Street was widened to facilitate it becoming the terminus temporarily.

The Point extension is now long open, the works at Connolly stop were finally finished a few weeks ago, yet these ugly barriers, which serve to make a grim location look even worse, seem to have become a permanent feature of Lower Abbey Street.

foggy_lad

Are they not there to stop the junkies and winos from falling into the path of busses and cars coming from O'Connell street?

AlekSmart

Are they not there to stop the junkies and winos from falling into the path of busses and cars coming from O'Connell street?

Interesting point Foggy_Lad and one I had overlooked.

The barriers are industrial in nature,which means they are effective,in contrast to whatever would be erected there after a "Design Tender" for some more artistic element.

It`s perhaps worth noting that what is perhaps Dublins most heavily bussed street, O Connell St itself,has not a single safety barrier or even better,a shelter to cater for it`s Bus using patrons.

The "Old" O Connell St had some "scaffolding" barriers strategically placed at the busier stops,ugly perhaps,but effective with it.

Now in stark conflict with all the oul guff spewed about "Health & Safety" we have a street which in Bus Stop terms has a far higher risk factor than what went before.

Perhaps the most startling example of this is the Official Nod & Wink given to the Dualway Group to station a staff member and require it`s City Tour Drivers to stop and dwell in a totally illegal and highly dangerous location which obscures both pedestrian and driver/rider vision...The O Connell St/Sackville Place junction.

But,Cookie_ Monster is correct,the needs and rights of the general public don`t really appear to count for a lot,it`s far better to gain membership of a disenfranchised or discriminated against group.

foggy_lad

After further thought on this it is more likely because of the nature of the Luas stop its positioning and how passengers are allighting only a few feet from heavy traffic on that street and the likelihood of some continuing on to cross the street without first checking the road is clear. Even if there were the normal Luas stop barriers these are easily vaulted by those in a hurry.

On O'Connell street there are no busses or other vehicles depositing passengers perpendicular to the flow of traffic as all are deposited onto footpaths where they can't walk into traffic lanes without an absolute direction change so no barriers are required.

antoinolachtnai

Putting up rails has to be done in a very circumspect way. Rails can often serve to trap pedestrians in an incident and cause further injury. A luas stop is quite a special case.

Heart

The issue I have with these railings are as a cyclist heading down Abbey St. the road space shared between cyclists and other vehicles (particularly buses/large vans) was reduced and is quite narrow now.

H

BenShermin

Take a tram down one of Brussels busiest streets, Rue Royale. The station stop signs are on normal footpaths, but the tram itself stops in the fully exposed central meridian. When the tram comes to a stop at the station all passengers walk onto the car filled street to board the tram and vice versa for disembarkation. The drivers of cars actually take the "sensible" approach in this situation and stop and wait until the tram is ready to depart the station. To make matters slightly more unhealthy and unsafetyish some of these tram stations double up as bus stops!

...and people blame Brussels for ridiculous H&S rules;).

AlekSmart

On O'Connell street there are no busses or other vehicles depositing passengers perpendicular to the flow of traffic as all are deposited onto footpaths where they can't walk into traffic lanes without an absolute direction change so no barriers are required.

Valid observation,but in the case of O Connell St the deduction from it may not be quite so clear.
A barrier placed with a little thought can be a very great safety aid to Passengers and Busdrivers.

However,it does take a bit of observation and understanding of the mechanics of mass human movement to know where to erect the barrier for greatest effect.

For example,anybody watching the old Eugene Lambert & Judge black & white ads which accompanied the arrival of the yellow School Buses into Ireland will remember the exhortation to the Chizzlers gettin off the bus to Wait until the bus had driver away before crossing the road.

One of my daily tasks is to watch,in a vaguely interested manner as persons who alight from my bus then make an immediate right turn and walk directly across the front and without looking straight into the traffic which,by now is whizzing past the offside.

The presence of a barrier at certain stops,extending forward from the Bus door would at least give the overtaking motorist/cyclist/motorcyclist a sporting chance of avoiding the dunce.

Equally at certain locations a barrier extending back along the side of the bus has the effect of keeping people from squeezing up along the nearside and inserting themselves into the head of the queue,but far more dangerously also putting themselves into what can be a blind spot for the Busdriver under certain conditions.

Given that,unlike the British with their wartime traditions of ration and air-raid shelter queuing we Irish are highly dismissive of queuing as a desireable or civilized practice,we therefore definitely require some form of assistance to protect us from ourselves.

and people blame Brussels for ridiculous H&S rules

And as BenShermin points out,who wants to be like those boring ol Belgians...

etchyed

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARGH!

I didn't start the thread to question why there were barriers! There were permanent (more aesthetically pleasing) railings there before the stop was widened to serve as a temporary terminus.

Alek, you often speak a lot of sense but I'm not really sure what you're getting at dismissing what you call "artistic" barriers. Apart from the fact that the previous railings were stronger, it's not really too much to ask that a street in the core of Dublin city centre not be blighted permanently by safety barriers the likes of which you'd see on a building site or at a music festival.

I'm surprised that nobody's brought this up before here and even more surprised that you've all spectacularly missed the point.

AlekSmart

it's not really too much to ask that a street in the core of Dublin city centre not be blighted permanently by safety barriers the likes of which you'd see on a building site or at a music festival.

Etchyed,I`m not a total phillistine in matters artistic and i do have an appriciation of the aesthetic needs of what is after all a main thoroughfare in the Capital City of a modern European State.

What intrigues and by times infuriates me is the lack of any coherent or competent approach to this basic,yet important element of Street Design.

The O Connell St Integrated Area plan was not portrayed as a back-of-an-envelope job.
Indeed it was proferred as one of Irelands highest profile cases of Urban Streetscape renewal,with some of the brightest and best Urban Renewal Professionals on the case.

Yes we have a fine imposing boulevardie kinda street,but as of now it is also a fully functioning main traffic artery,particularly so when the Bus Service element is factored in.

Surely at some point,somewhere in the design and consultation process the Design Team would have assessed the reality of several hundred Bus movements per hour and many thousands of passenger movements all of which requires some element of active management.

There is little point in taking a large Urban Renewal concept such as The O Connell St IAP from Design to Completed and then looking back in anger when glaring omissions such as the absence of safety barriers and even,seating,are subsequently pointed out.

The entire point of this IAP approach remains the integration of such mundane elements into the greater design ethos of the overall plan...what happened in O Connell St then...or is it beyond Irish Street Furniture designers to fashion some uniquely Irish modern approach to a safety barrier....It does`nt always need to be "On hire from Scafco"

Victor

There is a planning permission grant for a remodelling of the stop - 2145/10 - http://www.dublincity.ie/Planning/PlanningPermission/PlanningSearch/Pages/PlanningSearch.aspx One advantage of the existing high barrier with a fine mesh is that it makes bag snatching (by someone on the road) more difficult.

Heart wrote: »

The issue I have with these railings are as a cyclist heading down Abbey St. the road space shared between cyclists and other vehicles (particularly buses/large vans) was reduced and is quite narrow now.

Cyclists need to command the lane. When the PP was under consideration, we had a look at this. Admittedly it is low speed road and high speed passing isn't really possible.

Slice

I think they should just raise that stretch of road bordering the luas platform and tile it a terracotta colour to denote that pedestrians have right of way. That would encourage vehicles to proceed with caution along it.

Heart

There looked to be a JCB in action here today, a start on the remodeled platform maybe?

H