Discrimination is pretty horrible.

wattlendaub

So my boyfriend and I were on the DART yesterday, minding our own business and playing our respective Nintendo DS and Sony PSP when two lads boarded the same carriage we were on.

After a brief while, one of them asked us did we have any smokes, to which we replied no, we didn't. The more aggressive of the two asked my friend was he "bent", which we laughed off and ignored.

A few minutes later, they began to tearing up a nearby copy of the Sun, rolling the paper into balls and throwing them at the two of us. Their aim was fairly shoddy, but it was pretty clear they were trying to antagonise us. Shortly after that, they began heckling us, so I had enough. We got up and moved to leave the carriage, and one of them got up and followed us to the door, went to push at me, giving rather hateful stares, pretty much shunning us as if we didn't belong on the same DART as them.

I was pretty shaken and disgusted, I felt like tearing into the two of them but I didn't want to give them the satisfaction of getting mad. We told the fellow manning the DART station we got off at and he notified the security, but I'm sure the scumbags more or less got away.

It was pretty upsetting to have to deal with that, I don't understand how someone can be so hateful. I'm not used to being discriminated against like that, which is why it shook me up so much.
Should we have acted any other way? In retrospect I feel like I should have stood my ground, but I suppose avoiding violence was the best option to take.

Anyway, I just felt like venting!

steveoracle

It's difficult but it's best to ignore idiots like this, they're pointless ignorant people who's opinion is irrelevant. Most people respect you for who you are couldn't care less about your orientation.

Ste

It may not make you feel any better, but it probably was not homosexual discrimination as such. Unless something about you makes it OBVIOUS then him saying “bent” was probably just a lucky guess that you are not straight.

It sounds to me like the lads were out for a fight, bored and unhappy with their own life as they are, and you were the unlucky targets. If you were two straight guys sitting there, nothing would have been different about what happened and how it played out. Them saying “bent” is what they likely say to everyone and you just happened to actually be gay this time.

There is CCTV on Darts and Dart stations is there not? I would go and follow this up with the Gaurds if I were you.

Remember, people like this are the kind of people who hate themselves and their own lives. Acting like they did towards you is their attempt to justify their self loathing, by making OTHER people hate them as much as they hate themselves. There is nothing YOU should feel about this except genuine pity for them, and hope that THEIR life gets better.

thirtythirty

Tbh I'd say that was less about discrimination, and more about two retard knackers picking up on any characteristic that wasn't scumbag-esque: namely playing "nerdy computer games"!

You two yesterday, maybe rockers today, someone else tomorrow.

I wouldn't dwell on it - they're gonna have s/hit lives, probably die early due to malnutrition, and are so poor that they have to ask strangers for smokes

wattlendaub

Thanks for the replies. I agree with the sentiments that they are worthless, pathetic and hateful, which is why I'm trying not to let it get at me!

As for whether it was about discrimination or not, they were making derogatory gay jibes at us, asking "Do you spit or swallow?" and the like. Classy guys. It seemed fairly clear that they were aggressive toward us due to how focused on our sexual orientation their remarks were, but maybe I'm wrong?

Their behaviour was probably mostly attributed to boredom and not having anything better to do with their lives, as you all have said. In a way they actually help boost my self esteem, though inadvertantly.

They most likely would say those things to any two guys, just to rile them up, little did they know they had two ACTUAL gay guys on their hands. Probably would have made them worse, who knows.

I know when I am out with the girls and people cop I am with both of them... some of the comments they feel ok coming out with are an embarrasment to their upbringing.

oisindoyle

Wattlendaub,,sorry to hear of your experience ,it sounds horrendous .

To me it sounds like you were victims of a homophobic attack albeit (thankfully) verbal ,but there is no doubt in my mind from what you said in your post,that they were looking for a fight ,because you were gay .

You did right to walk away.I know two rights dont make a wrong ,but lets hope next time they do this to a gay couple ,they get their just rewards!

I think your letter is very powerful and shows how people who are gay have to put up with this sh*t all too regularly.Given that we have a CP Bill beign discussed in the Senate today and the Senators resigned on "moral" grounds,plus we have a sizeable group of protestors with disgusting banners all anti homosexual and homophobic.Would you send your letter above to the Indo or Irish Times,??
I think it would send out a powerful message to the bigots out there ..
I wish you well ..
PS I would contact the Gards as well or if you wanted to contact the gay liasion officer in your local station .

wattlendaub

I don't think any good would come from going to the Guards. I've been feeling a little better now after reading these replies (which I appreciate a lot!), we're just going to put this incident behind us.
Next time something like this happens I won't take it sitting down, if there is a next time.

spurious

Going to the guards makes a record of it, so that the next time (and there will be a next time) some gay person is kicked to death, the guards cannot say 'oh we've never had any reports of homophobic incidents'.
If you report it, it becomes a statistic.

wattlendaub

Which Garda branch/station would I go to about this? I've never really delt with them before, if you guys think it might be worthwhile making a record of it I might look into doing that.

SugarHigh

I think you did the right thing by ignoring them. People say to stand your ground but in this situation where you were outnumbered you really don't know how things could pan out so it's best just to ignore them until you have a chance to get off.

My guess would be just look up the closest station to EITHER where you got off the train or even better where they got on. Chances are people like that are known to the police, and a quick look at CCTV will confirm to them "Yea, we know these guys"

SugarHigh

Deleted User wrote: »

My guess would be just look up the closest station to EITHER where you got off the train or even better where they got on. Chances are people like that are known to the police, and a quick look at CCTV will confirm to them "Yea, we know these guys"

Then what happens?

I don't want to be negative but nothing will happen.

wattlendaub

I hate to be a pessimist but I doubt anything will happen either. Might as well notify the authorities and all that though, just in case!

SugarHigh

SugarHigh wrote: »

Then what happens?

I don't want to be negative but nothing will happen.

You’re probably right of course.

However if two gays get beaten later in the same area and go in to give a description of the guys, and the cops go…

“This description sounds familiar, can we just show you some CCTV from a previous complaint we had….” and the same guys are positively identified by the usual methods, then some good has come of it has it not?

The only thing we know for 100% is if they do NOT make a complaint then nothing WILL happen. At least if they do, it might.

Goodshape

I agree with spurious. Regardless of whether anything "happens" as a result, it will at least be on record.


"Do we need to put any resources into combating homophobic crime and abuse?"
"Ah no, sure there's never any reports of that!"

Chuchoter

wattlendaub wrote: »

So my boyfriend and I were on the DART yesterday, minding our own business and playing our respective Nintendo DS and Sony PSP when two lads boarded the same carriage we were on.

lol how cute :P
Aside from that what happened to you was completely **** and you should completely make a statement to the gardai. In all likelihood, ok maybe nothing will happen, but if someone gets severely beaten up on a DART on the future, by reporting what happened to you you can make sure they don't say it was a freak occurrence that never usually happens

wattlendaub

crayolastereo wrote: »

lol how cute :P

Thanks :pac:

I tried phoning one of the Garda LGBT Liaison officers in Dublin but apparently he doesn't undertake that role any more. I suppose I'll look for another one to contact.

me_right_one

Eh, can I just say something here. I'm a straight male BTW. I am sorry to hear this happened to you and your boyfriend OP, and I agree these lads were just scum.

BUT, just for future reference:

1) Most straight people can spot gays a mile away. Homophobes especially so.
2) That doesn't mean all straight people or gay spotters are homophobes. It does mean however, that your sexual orientation is not anonymous. Be wary of that.
3) When yerman said, "are you bent?" he knew well. There's no way he'd say that unless he felt safe to do so. The reaction he was expecting was either "FCUK YOU" or a punch if you were straight. He knew he'd get neither, but then, you lads laughed!!!!! Worst reaction you could have given. That was what prompted the further harassment.
4) You should have just went with the fcuk you option. Display a bit of killer aggression if this happens in future. Backbone is tougher than braun.

I hope this helps. Nobody should have to put up with crap like that.

Annasopra

SugarHigh wrote: »

Then what happens?

I don't want to be negative but nothing will happen.

How do you know?

Goodshape

me_right_one wrote: »

1) Most straight people can spot gays a mile away. Homophobes especially so.

I really don't think that's necessarily true. "Gays" come in all shapes and sizes, but that discussion isn't really relevant to this one.

4) You should have just went with the fcuk you option. Display a bit of killer aggression if this happens in future. Backbone is tougher than braun.

Do you mean to pretend you're straight? That just seems so wrong to me.


Considering the OP got away with only verbal abuse would have me think he did more or less the right thing. I'd say my reaction would be very similar. Laugh it off (what else are you supposed to do? Deny it? Punch someone?) and then move away if **** continues.

scientific1982

wattlendaub wrote: »

So my boyfriend and I were on the DART yesterday, minding our own business and playing our respective Nintendo DS and Sony PSP when two lads boarded the same carriage we were on.

After a brief while, one of them asked us did we have any smokes, to which we replied no, we didn't. The more aggressive of the two asked my friend was he "bent", which we laughed off and ignored.

A few minutes later, they began to tearing up a nearby copy of the Sun, rolling the paper into balls and throwing them at the two of us. Their aim was fairly shoddy, but it was pretty clear they were trying to antagonise us. Shortly after that, they began heckling us, so I had enough. We got up and moved to leave the carriage, and one of them got up and followed us to the door, went to push at me, giving rather hateful stares, pretty much shunning us as if we didn't belong on the same DART as them.

I was pretty shaken and disgusted, I felt like tearing into the two of them but I didn't want to give them the satisfaction of getting mad. We told the fellow manning the DART station we got off at and he notified the security, but I'm sure the scumbags more or less got away.

It was pretty upsetting to have to deal with that, I don't understand how someone can be so hateful. I'm not used to being discriminated against like that, which is why it shook me up so much.
Should we have acted any other way? In retrospect I feel like I should have stood my ground, but I suppose avoiding violence was the best option to take.

Anyway, I just felt like venting!

You should have stood your ground with those scumbags. Ignoring them and running away means that they know there wont be any repercussions next time they bother a gay couple. Im really sorry what happened to you its horrible. However, gay people need to get out of this victim mentallity if we are to get any respect at all. Enough is enough.

Caught

I know a few guys who were homosexual and I hate the idea that people could be so mean towards them. I actually fancied one of them. :L He's so nice and stuff, just like "ahh."

I hate people being like mean towards yis and stuff. Its terrible. I feel so bad. In schools they teach us not to be racist, but not once have they talked about "gay" people.

I hate the word gay. Its quicker to type and say though to homosexual.

@me_right_one Ehm, what do you mean "Most straight people can spot gays a mile away". I think thats a terribly ignorant thing to say, no offence. You cant say something like that. Its very stereotypical. I only found out two people I know are gay, I would of never have thought it. Course, two other people I knew I thought "he isn't talking as many other boys would" by saying stuff like "I'd do him" about Russell Brand [but also loada girls]. :L He proudly had that he's gay on his Twitter bio though. :L Bless, so nice, so nice.