Clamping on private grounds

wellermod1966

Hi there. As per the moderator, Im not looking for legal advice, just to know whether anyone has had a similar experience and been able to recover their fine in the past.

I live in a rented apartment in a complex, which is governed by a management company, who in turn employ a clamper to perform clamping on illegally parked cars. A few weeks back, after noticing my car door was being knocked by people parking too close to me, I parked across 2 spaces. Ive checked their 'house rules' sheet in retrospect, and it does state not to park across two spaces, but does not state that this is a clampable offence. There are no signs in the car park stating that parking across two spaces is a clampable offence.

Basically the management company put a sticker on my car, stating that they were now clamping those who parked across two spaces, and that if I didnt move my car within 24hrs I would be clamped. Not being a regular car user, I didnt visit my car within 24hrs and was clamped. It cost me 100EUR to have this removed. Surely, Id have thought, there has to be a permanent sign notifying drivers of what and what is not clampable. They did put the sticker there, but if a driver doesnt visit his / her car within the 24hrs, then they arent being informed of this rule.

Ive put in a claim against this, but heard nothing back yet. Anyone had similar experiences? It seems a little much for me; yes, double parking may be selfish, but surely not fineable, given i'm entitled to park there?

Reloc8

You have no grounds for complaint whatsoever.

Formally it will be governed by your lease, management company rules, lease of easements etc. that provide for your tenancy/

You will likely find that they are entitled to do this under those documents.

You are not entitled to occupy two spaces.

When you say you've put in a claim I presume you mean you've complained to the management company ? You don't have any legal recourse here.

I have managed to say all that while gritting my teeth about your parking and muttering unpleasant thoughts to myself.

socio

I agree entirely with reloc8. You completely deserve to be clamped for parking across two spaces. I lived in complex with a similar set up and spaces were always limited. Selfish parking can be a major headache for other people!

That said there was some stuff a while back about illegal clamping, http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055041472. This may not apply as you've presumably signed a lease.

wellermod1966

There is always plenty of spare parking in our building. Yes I shouldnt have done it, but the Management House Rules do not state clamping is in place for double parking, and if Id have been asked to move it, Id have moved it and not made the same mistake again. The ease with which 100EUR fines are dished out in this country worries me, particularly during a recession, and for such a petty mistake. Looks like a quick buck operation to me, devoid of any human empathy. Im a reasonable person; if theres a sign up saying not to do it, I dont do it.

Reloc8

wellermod1966 wrote: »

Ive checked their 'house rules' sheet in retrospect, and it does state not to park across two spaces, but does not state that this is a clampable offence.

wellermod1966 wrote: »

There is always plenty of spare parking in our building. Yes I shouldnt have done it, but the Management House Rules do not state clamping is in place for double parking, and if Id have been asked to move it, Id have moved it and not made the same mistake again. The ease with which 100EUR fines are dished out in this country worries me, particularly during a recession, and for such a petty mistake. Looks like a quick buck operation to me, devoid of any human empathy. Im a reasonable person; if theres a sign up saying not to do it, I dont do it.

Mmmm.

Thing is...it wasn't actually a mistake was it - it was deliberate. Wouldn't everyone much prefer to create a double space to stick their car into ? Apparently a dis-incentive is indeed required.

And in fairness...you didn't seriously think you were entitled to do it did you ? Equallly, what tends to happen if you park where you shouldn't ? (

Anyway, at least you know where you stand now.

dublinclamper

Hi. I am a Clamper in Dublin and feel this guy was hard done by. If you park illegally or in un designated places then you should be clamped. This guy sounds like parked in between spots and should have maybe thought more before doing it. But people jumping in and slating him is highly un fair and un just. Those who have not sinned cast the first stone.

Kanye

dublinclamper wrote: »

Hi. I am a Clamper in Dublin and feel this guy was hard done by. If you park illegally or in un designated places then you should be clamped. This guy sounds like parked in between spots and should have maybe thought more before doing it. But people jumping in and slating him is highly un fair and un just. Those who have not sinned cast the first stone.

You are not a clamper.

Reloc8

dublinclamper wrote: »

Hi. I am a Clamper in Dublin and feel this guy was hard done by. If you park illegally or in un designated places then you should be clamped. This guy sounds like parked in between spots and should have maybe thought more before doing it. But people jumping in and slating him is highly un fair and un just. Those who have not sinned cast the first stone.

Heheh. So what ?

Anyway, no one is slating him - he (how do you know its a he and not a she) asked for advice and got it - and since then we've just been having a conversation about it. Words on screen don't convey tone very well - there's no need to assume the tone is angry/hostile.

MagicSean

dublinclamper wrote: »

Hi. I am a Clamper in Dublin and feel this guy was hard done by. If you park illegally or in un designated places then you should be clamped. This guy sounds like parked in between spots and should have maybe thought more before doing it. But people jumping in and slating him is highly un fair and un just. Those who have not sinned cast the first stone.

Hellp clamper with only one post to your name. This guy occupied two parking spots which is the equivalent to having an extra car in the car park so he got what he deserved.

Op your excuse that there was no specific statement that double parking is clampable is ridiculous. You said yourself that doubleparking isnt allowed. Thats like appealing against a shoplifting conviction by saying "The law says I can't steal but it doesn't specifically say I cant put something in my pocket and leave a shop"

wellermod1966

You are missing the point entirely. Regarding your example, it is more like saying that I go into a shop, knowing stealing is wrong and punishable by a maximum by 2 years imprisonment. When I get caught and tried, they decide to bump the sentence up to 10 years. This is why we have law -
to make certain actions illegal, and define a maximum sentence that you will face if you break the law. You cannot then try someone and decide to throw in and extra 10 years, or 100EUR fine, for good measure.

This is what happened here - they made myself and anyone else aware of the punishment AFTER the event. No matter how bad a man you may think I am for trying to look after and maintain my car, that is not a just action.
Furthermore, the other guy states that I came on here 'asking for advice'. If you re-read my initial post, you'll find I was asking had anyone had a similar experience, and what was the outcome. So if you havent had a similar experience, in this instance, Im not interested in your views, or how you had to 'grit your teeth' over the thought of my actions.

MagicSean

wellermod1966 wrote: »

So if you havent had a similar experience, in this instance, Im not interested in your views, or how you had to 'grit your teeth' over the thought of my actions.

Then you are posting in the wrong place really. This is a public forum and everyone is entitled to post their views. I don't consider you to be a bad man. I think you are fooling yourself if you think that a rule or law should state every possible situation that might arise. You knew double parking was not allowed and you also knew that clamping was in operation. What exactly did you think the punishment was for it?

Mr. Presentable

Occupying two spaces with one car is effectively the same as parking two cars when you are only entitled to one.

If they were going to be unreasonable the would have clamped you in both spaces and had €200.00 out of you

wellermod1966

Well, this will be my last post on the matter. I can see you and I are worlds apart on our interpretation of the world and wouldnt agree on much. However:

It is not sufficient to say 'what did you think would happen'? What I expect is that, if double parking is to be clamped, then I am to be made aware of this. I pay for the priveledge of parking there; there are
many more spaces than cars, and so I assumed, foolishly it seems, that in a mature and caring society, I would be ok to park across 2 small spaces to avoid any further damage to my car. These spaces are tiny; barely bigger than the width of most modern cars.

There are rules in the building house rules stating that trailers are not allowed and will be clamped, vans are not allowed and will be clamped, and so on.
So, I dont bring a trailer in, and I dont bring a van in, and I dont get clamped. I would have read the law / rule book, assessed the punishment, and decided I didnt want to get involved in it.

I parked in the corner, out of the way of other cars, in an area surrounded by other spare spaces 24/7.

What I expected the punishment to be is a sticker warning me not to occupy two spaces, maybe even warning that my registration had been taken, and if I repeat offended, I would be clamped and fined 100EUR. THAT is reasonable behaviour. And if I had one of those, and had been allowed to read it before I was clamped, I wouldnt have parked in two spaces again.

Del2005

wellermod1966 wrote: »

Basically the management company put a sticker on my car, stating that they were now clamping those who parked across two spaces, and that if I didnt move my car within 24hrs I would be clamped. Not being a regular car user, I didnt visit my car within 24hrs and was clamped. It cost me 100EUR to have this removed. Surely, Id have thought, there has to be a permanent sign notifying drivers of what and what is not clampable. They did put the sticker there, but if a driver doesnt visit his / her car within the 24hrs, then they arent being informed of this rule.

wellermod1966 wrote: »

What I expected the punishment to be is a sticker warning me not to occupy two spaces, maybe even warning that my registration had been taken, and if I repeat offended, I would be clamped and fined 100EUR. THAT is reasonable behaviour. And if I had one of those, and had been allowed to read it before I was clamped, I wouldnt have parked in two spaces again.

They did exactly what you asked. It's not their fault that you didn't check or look at your car for longer then 24hrs.

If you search the site there was a thread recently about someone who was genuinely clamped incorrectly, they had a pay and display ticket that folded up so couldn't be read. They found out that the private clampers remove the clamp after 5 days if you don't pay, they loose money on it;)