Insurance for someone without licence.

CiniO

Is it possible at all in Ireland?

For example case as follows.

An old person, who doesn't have a driving licence, needs to travel sometimes to different places, so this person buys and car.
I assume there is nothing wrong about someone without licence to own a car.
Let's say now, that this person is sometimes going to ask friends, family, etc. to give him a lift with his own car.
I assume a policy with open driving option would be ideal for this case.
Only concers is, would a person without driving licence be issued with policy? (obviously this policy wouldn't allow him to drive). But would allow anyone with licence to drive his car.

Cookie_Monster

would a person without driving licence be issued with policy?

No.

Sure he'd say he won't drive it but how can the insurance company ever know that? None of them would touch it.

Gumbo

yep, they need a licence, full stop.

CiniO

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

No.

Sure he'd say he won't drive it but how can the insurance company ever know that? None of them would touch it.

What's the difference for them?
If he'd drive it, he wouldn't be covered anyway.

CiniO

kceire wrote: »

yep, they need a licence, full stop.

So what a person like this can do?

It sound's a bit strange, that someone without a licence can't have a car which could be legal on the road.

January

Open driving policies are very hard to get in Ireland these days and they are really only given to long time loyal customers of insurance companies these days.

Henry Ford III

The policyholder (owner) must have a license.

Eric Cartman

the only way would be if the other driver used 3rd party extension to drive this car, even then without an insurance policy how would they tax the car ?

Cookie_Monster

open drive would not apply anyway.

The holder of the policy must still have a licence for open drive

Random

generally the main user (as in driver) of the vehicle has to be the policy holder. in this case they wouldn't be.

if his friends / relatives have their own policys have them find out if they have "driving other cars" or "third party extension" which would allow them to drive his car with third party cover.

daveharnett

CiniO wrote: »

So what a person like this can do?

It sound's a bit strange, that someone without a licence can't have a car which could be legal on the road.

The solution is that the person driving the car must have an open policy in the other direction - one which insures them (usually 3rd party cover only) to drive other people's cars. AFAIK most insurers offer this to fully licensed customers at no extra charge.

vectra

Buy the car in a family members name that holds a full licence that you can trust,
Insure it in their name with open driving so as any full licenced driver ( over 25 I think ) would be covered to drive it.

Cookie_Monster

Random wrote: »

if his friends / relatives have their own policys have them find out if they have "driving other cars" or "third party extension" which would allow them to drive his car with third party cover.

only if the car is insured by the owner already, no? Maybe not all companies insist on this...

Random

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

only if the car is insured by the owner already, no? Maybe not all companies insist on this...

it varys depending on the policy you have. my policy with quinn does not require this. each person should check their own policy docs.

January

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

only if the car is insured by the owner already, no? Maybe not all companies insist on this...

They do insist that the other car must be insured and taxed, and to tax the car it must be insured.

CiniO

adrieanne__x wrote: »

Open driving policies are very hard to get in Ireland these days and they are really only given to long time loyal customers of insurance companies these days.

I was offered open driving policy for an 150 euro extra per year.
And I drive in Ireland for only 3 years so far, and I'm still under 30.
So it's not that hard.

CiniO

Eric Cartman wrote: »

the only way would be if the other driver used 3rd party extension to drive this car, even then without an insurance policy how would they tax the car ?

Impossible to tax a car, if there isn't any policy assigned to this car.

Random

CiniO wrote: »

Impossible to tax a car, if there isn't any policy assigned to this car.

if this is the case then there's the achilles heal of my plan.

++ edit
a car can be taxed for a year. it doesn't always match the insurance year. if i tax my car for 1yr and then sell it a month later then the insurance details for it won't need to be updated until the year is up for the tax. this let's you drive a car on your "driving other cars" option without needing a valid policy on the car itself, assuming your policy allows you to do it.

++ edit 2
this of course may not resolve your issue in the long term unless you buy a new car each year but important note re driving other cars / third party extension all the same.

CiniO

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

open drive would not apply anyway.

The holder of the policy must still have a licence for open drive

Is this a rule with all insurance companies.
It seems to be a bit stupid.

If a car is registered to the company, then they can easily buy insurance for it with open driving so anyone can drive a car.
Why not a private person could do the same?

SV

CiniO wrote: »

Impossible to tax a car, if there isn't any policy assigned to this car.

It isn't impossible.

Random

suggest contacting an insurance broker advising what you want to do op and see if any of them can suggest an option to suit you.

Anan1

CiniO wrote: »

Is this a rule with all insurance companies.
It seems to be a bit stupid.

If a car is registered to the company, then they can easily buy insurance for it with open driving so anyone can drive a car.
Why not a private person could do the same?

Because insurance companies aren't stupid - it'll be as obvious to them as it is to us what you're trying to do.;)

CiniO

adrieanne__x wrote: »

They do insist that the other car must be insured and taxed, and to tax the car it must be insured.

It all depends on the insurance company.
Most of them actually wouldn't insist that car is insured by the owner.
I don't know what about a tax - my policy doesn't say anything about it, so I assume, that tax had nothing to do with my policy. If I'm driving without tax, I'm putting myself on the risk to be caught and fined for not having tax, but my insurance would be the same good with or without tax.

CiniO

SV wrote: »

It isn't impossible.

How can you do it then?

CiniO

Anan1 wrote: »

Because insurance companies aren't stupid - it'll be as obvious to them as it is to us what you're trying to do.;)

I don't get what you mean?
If it's so obvious then please explain, because I don't know what you think I'm trying to do.

Anyway, I was asking about some older person without licence - not myself.

SV

CiniO wrote: »

How can you do it then?

Put in a fake policy number, it's not like they check them there and then!

CiniO

vectra wrote: »

Buy the car in a family members name that holds a full licence that you can trust,
Insure it in their name with open driving so as any full licenced driver ( over 25 I think ) would be covered to drive it.

That's acutally some kind of solution.
Still don't understand though, why could this person not be able to do it himself.

CiniO

SV wrote: »

Put in a fake policy number, it's not like they check them there and then!

You are signing there, that all data on the form is true.
I wouldn't chance it.

I think less risk is to drive without tax, instead of obtaining it by entering false data.

Anan1

CiniO wrote: »

I don't get what you mean?
If it's so obvious then please explain, because I don't know what you think I'm trying to do.

Anyway, I was asking about some older person without licence - not myself.

Old person without license insures car they can never drive on an open drive policy. Young male drives car. That's the first thing that came into my head, and i'm sure any ins co will think the same.

snowman707

well i know for definite up a few years ago it was quite easy for a non driver non license holder to own and insure a car ,

My late uncle had myself and his next door neighbour on the policy,

the policy would list the named drivers and state the owner was a non driver


reading the replies here it's obvious that this scenario has changed

CiniO

Anan1 wrote: »

Old person without license insures car they can never drive on an open drive policy. Young male drives car. That's the first thing that came into my head, and i'm sure any ins co will think the same.

Hmm.
If this was the case, then this young male driver could get a car in his name and insure it on his own name. I know it would be expensive, but I also assume that the case that I displayed also would be expensive.
It's obvious that if some insurance company would allow anyone to drive a car, then premium would be very high. That would be no problem here - as let's say that older person without licence could afford it.
Problem here is, that it seems to be imposible to be done.

SV

CiniO wrote: »

You are signing there, that all data on the form is true.
I wouldn't chance it.

I think less risk is to drive without tax, instead of obtaining it by entering false data.

I'd risk it rather than the fines for no tax tbh.
that said it's all null and void as no insurance is the most serious offence.

MagicMarker

CiniO wrote: »

So what a person like this can do?

Get a licence.

CoDy1

A person can buy as many cars as they want but if they want to insure them they definately need a licence. Best option, is to get the person that plans to drive this older person around to register and insure the car in their name, inform insurers where vehicle will be kept etc, and older person can pay the premium.