Plaster falling off celing where its nailed up??

paddy147

Wonder can anyone help me out here.

recently got my ceiling taken down and a new 1 put up.Skimmed and then painted.

Now the plaster/filler is falling off just around where the plaster board nails are holding up the ceiling to the joists.

The builder/plasterer has filled them in with some sort of skim several times over now,but after about 3-4 days,same thing happens again,the bit of skim or filler cracks at the nail and it eventually falls off.

Whats is going?
Whats wrong and whats the permanent fix to this.

This is now wrecking my head big time.:mad:

Help.:(

mickdw

Using plasterboard screws instead of nails will prevent this in 95% of cases. If it recurring, I would sink those nails a fair bit more and put some screws in instead nearby then fill all the holes again.
The nails probably are not holding the slab perfectly tight in the problem area perhaps due to uneven joists or simply not hammered in enough or too much leading to the slab being smashed up around the nail head.
Is the troublesome area underneath a frequently used floor area? Sometimes the movemnt on top can cause this too.
Use some screws I would say. TBH, any builder now using nails is probably a bit of a cowboy. Dont know when Ive last seen nailed slabs

Poor Uncle Tom

If it is an older house and the floor area above is corridor space I would say there is a bit of springing in the joists causing the nail heads to pop. As Mick said the screws should fix it, failing that the floor above could be 'drummed' but this would be a last resort.

paddy147

House is a mid 1950s house,floor area above is the landing,and the bedrooms.

The whole ceiling was nailed up,and its happening in various places around the house.Same thing is happening in the kitchen ceiling too.

The plasterer said to me at 1st,that someone must be jumping around upstairs.I knew that this was his way of trying to get out of it.

How do I get the nails out where the plaster is falling off??

Or do I just get them hammered in deeper?

And do i use the likes of pollyfilla or do I get the plasterer or someone to put is some sort of special skim or filler??

This really is wrecking my head now.:mad:

paddy147

Pic of the nails used,some of them are barely hammered in while others seem to be in fairly deep,going by the bits of skim and plaster than keep falling off.


The pic shows a nail holding the plasterboard,before the skimcoat/plastering was done.

Is that the right nail for plasterboard???

Poor Uncle Tom

It is likely that the section sizes of the joist timber is not what it would be if the floor were put in today, or there may not be adequate noggins or bracing in the joisting. To screw fix a plywood layer on top of the joists and put the finish on top of that would be the way to ensure it does not happen again. But that is a serious amount of work. I would try the srews as Mick suggested.

paddy147

Poor Uncle Tom wrote: »

I would try the srews as Mick suggested.

This is how it was when the old ceiling was taken down.

The bits of plaster are comming off around the nails,but only over in 1 corner of the ceiling area.Also is 1 small corner of the kitchen ceiling too.

With regards the screws....How do I do this exactly then?

Do I somehow remove the nail and replace with a screw,or do I hammer in the nail deeper and then screw in a a plasterboard screw right beside the nail??

Thanks.:)

CarrickMcJoe

I would screw it up in a different area, what sometimes happens is the plasterer hammers the nails in too far, penetrating the slab and leaving it sagging . Then fill the nail holes in with Red Devil Onetime (this is a fine filler very popular with decorators) and touch up with paint.

Poor Uncle Tom

paddy147 wrote: »

.. hammer in the nail deeper and then screw in a plasterboard screw beside the nail??

Use a punch (a backwards facing 4" nail) to hammer home the slab nail, put the screws about 15mm from the nail hole. Fill the nail hole with bonding and let it dry, skim fresh over and paint.

paddy147

Poor Uncle Tom wrote: »

Use a punch (a backwards facing 4" nail) to hammer home the slab nail, put the screws about 15mm from the nail hole. Fill the nail hole with bonding and let it dry, skim fresh over and paint.

Thanks,Im gonna say this to the builder/plasterer,and if he is not prepared to do it,then I will get someone who will do it and fix it propperly.

Thanks.:)

paddy147

took some close up pics

It looks like that the nails are not really hammered in enough,and theres barely a skim of plaster/filler over them too.

So maybe it is just a case of hammering them a bit deeper?

Should the nail be just level with the surface of the plaster board itself,or should be sunk into the plasterboard a bit??

Thanks.:)

rayjdav

I have had a similar problem in spots, not as much, but what has happened in my house is that, in certain rooms, the screws used are visible through the skim, and paint, as a "rust" type spots.?

I have emailed the screw company even an they cannot explain it. Standard slab screws used.

Plasterer claims the fact that the house was skimmed thru the last winter, ie. Freezing, that it is the cold reacting with the screw heads and skim????? wtf?

On spots I put oiled based primer, over the finished painted ceiling/wall, but this only appears to works in spots. Still visible "rust" spots.

Anyone got any experience of this before?

Poor Uncle Tom

paddy147 wrote: »

took some close up pics

It looks like that the nails are not really hammered in enough,and theres barely a skim of plaster/filler over them too.

So maybe it is just a case of hammering them a bit deeper?

Should the nail be just level with the surface of the plaster board itself,or should be sunk into the plasterboard a bit??

Thanks.:)

The outside of the nail head should be flush with the outside of the plaster slab leaving an even surface to skim over.

rayjdav wrote: »

I have had a similar problem in spots, not as much, but what has happened in my house is that, in certain rooms, the screws used are visible through the skim, and paint, as a "rust" type spots.?

I have emailed the screw company even an they cannot explain it. Standard slab screws used.

Plasterer claims the fact that the house was skimmed thru the last winter, ie. Freezing, that it is the cold reacting with the screw heads and skim????? wtf?

On spots I put oiled based primer, over the finished painted ceiling/wall, but this only appears to works in spots. Still visible "rust" spots.

Anyone got any experience of this before?

Bad batch of screws, no contest. (or an old, badly stored set being used up) Even the old slab nails were galvanised to stop rust spots. Your plasterer is talking through his rear end, unless the cold can somehow remove the supposed rust proof coating from the screws.

rayjdav

Poor Uncle Tom wrote: »

Bad batch of screws, no contest. (or an old, badly stored set being used up) Even the old slab nails were galvanised to stop rust spots. Your plasterer is talking through his rear end, unless the cold can somehow remove the supposed rust proof coating from the screws.

Bad batch is what I put it down to too, as I didnt really take Plasterers explanation. All screws new, fresh out of box.
Screw company wouldnt take this as an explaination though, surprise there. Not a case now of taking down now though...:(

mrgaa1

plasterboard should really be screwed up - not nailed. Screws should be flush with plasterboard.

However if plaster is coming of all over the place then I'd look at how the plastering is being done.
If an old bag of skim it will go off very quickly. Some plasterers put dirty water into the mix and put these two together then a bad mix will happen.

Also if they are patching the area they should be putting unibond on first and then applying the new skim.

check the skim - it should be powdery - not lumpy.