Official: Extensive loss of rte digital in wexford & wicklow on welsh pointed aerials

Theres now a total loss of RTE in digital,regardless of whether you have a presely or arfon aerial in south wicklow and wexford.
If there was aso in the morning,RTE wouldn't be fulfilling coverage obligations.

Now Even People in south wicklow with arfon aerials have no reception of rte in digital on ch 45 from mt leinster.
This is despite the aerials being vertical and pointed away from presely which is the co channel problem with rte mt leinster.
Presely is strong enough to wipe out ch45 even on arfon set ups that have separate grids or group A's/B's combined for mt leinster.

Now I know they plan a low power tx for arklow but what are they going to do for people outside that town? Arklow is in a dip,a tx there isn't going to be useable outside the town.And for people in co wexford with welsh aerials??
Anyone with presely aerials have had RTE dtt wiped out because of RTE seemingly picking ch 45 out of the 4 muxes they tested from mt leinster.
Time for a rethink RTEnl.
The proper answer is to move to ch 39.
Reception on 39 when on test was perfect anywhere I saw it with no presely problems.
It would also negate the need for a tx in arklow saving money.

People aren't going to disconnect more that 20 digital channels currently being received free from wales just so they can receive rte and shouldn't have to anyway.

watty

Is there Co-channel interference anyplace in Wales?

Verso

Thanks Black Briar for this information. The other day I was trying out my Technomate receiver and my Preseli aerial was bringing in Welsh channels from all over the place including channel nos. 42, 43, 46 and 49 at 93% Quality but 6% on channel 45 (no reception). I also received reception on 54 at 36%.

I have a small aerial pointed at where I think Mt. Leinster is situated and whilst this brings in analogue RTE it does not bring in DTT to the Technomate.

As you rightly say I no longer have any RTE DTT reception despite being fairly near to Mt. Leinster and with a roof top aerial pointed at it.

Also I most certainly am not switching my Preseli aerial around as I do not wish to lose my DTT channels. For the moment I will do with RTE in analogue form.

As you mentioned when RTE DTT was on channel 39 my Preseli aerial was receiving this at 93/95% Quality without interfering with anything else.

By the way I am in Cahore.

yes ch 39 digital from mt leinster was coming in fine on presely aerials and arfon without any need for anything pointed at mt leinster.
Whats new I've noticed is now that arfon set ups are becoming more and more digital,they are also unable to receive ch45 from mt leinster whereas they were getting ch39 perfectly.


@ Watty-there have been sporadic reports of problems on digital spy with RTE over riding Freeview in wales in some coastal areas.

If RTE want to continue to use ch45,they will have to markedly increase power on it and they won't be able to null it to the East in the direction of wexford to avoid problems in Wales as in fact it's to the East that extra power is needed as wexford and wicklow are to the East of Mt Leinster.

The only answer is ch 39.

jabarrett35

Not sure what's wrong with Mt Leinster but the DTT reception is awful today pixilation and sound break up and then gone on both my receivers. Is a power thing or co-channel interference. I'm getting nothing from Presley at present.

Thats something to do with you I think down in Tramore.
Presely is normal strength today and yet still wiping mt leinster even on arfon aerials.
Mt leinster is working grand if no presely aerial is connected today but shur who'd disconnect that?
Lose over 20 good channels including BBC,ITV,Channel 4 and five??
No one would do that just to add 2 channels and itv ireland aka tv3

tlaavtech

jabarrett35 wrote: »

Not sure what's wrong with Mt Leinster but the DTT reception is awful today pixilation and sound break up and then gone on both my receivers. Is a power thing or co-channel interference. I'm getting nothing from Presley at present.

Sorry to go OT, but how were you ever getting Presely in Tramore - Where are you and how big/high an ariel do you have (PM me if you would rather not post here!) - I would love to get UK DTT in Clarinwood, but thought it was impossible because of a big hill in Wales :mad:

Just checked DTT and I have no break-up that I can see if that helps.

jabarrett35

I'm in Roselawn right at the top so quite high. I only get Presley if there is high pressure as my aerial is facing towards Mt Leinster. However someone posted on another thread that with the right aerial you would be able to get Presley. My Irish DTT is fine now just a lipsync problem at times.

I just remembered as child we always got Welsh TV most of the time. But that was before deflectors and then Sky so it should be possible.

SRB

There have been issued logged by BT Vision users in Northern Ireland, with channels being displaced, given the limited coverage RTE digital has in Northern Ireland and the small take up of BT Vision, I can't image it'll be that many though.

newleaf

In Arklow all my RTE digital TV and Radio gone for days - great timing - World Cup and Wimbeldon! Was getting them on VHF aerial. Would UHF aerial help? Where would I point it? Would it also bring in BBC free to air?

its gone for you because you were tuned to ch 39
Try 45

Yes with a uk aerial you will get up to 30 channels in digital there on an aerial free including bbc and itv.

PM me for a local installer.

newleaf

Was getting DTT on Ch 45, then it went, re-tuned and got it on Ch 39 for a day or two, then gone - not on Ch 45 or anywhere! I wonder if I was getting it from Greystones? I scan daily in hope but no luck yet!

I've replied to your pm.

No greystones reception in Arklow.

Kippure is possible though with an outdoor aerial in parts of the town but it's very weak at the moment.

You won't get Mt Leinster while they are on ch45.They must move to ch 39.

I suspect they may have lowered power on ch45 due to interference I've read about happening in Wales.
I don't know when they are going to learn to move to ch 39 if ever.

Antenna

Deleted User wrote: »

If there was aso in the morning

Maybe (after ASO) RTE might put on a duplicate transmission from Mt Leinster of the PSB MUX on VHF Band 3 (as well as UHF) directed at the coastal areas where this UHF cochannel would be a problem

mrdtv2010

Antenna wrote: »

Maybe (after ASO) RTE might put on a duplicate transmission from Mt Leinster of the PSB MUX on VHF Band 3 (as well as UHF) directed at the coastal areas where this UHF cochannel would be a problem

Do I detect a note of weary cynicism here in advocating VHF rather than Channel 39?

RTENL need to realise the game is up on three fronts: a) There will be no commercial DTT to cross subsidise the PSB muxes, apart from the obvious transfer pricing issues which the EU competition authorities would need to examine b) the frequency war across the Irish sea has been lost: its a King Canute strategy and c) T2 boxes will now be the norm in the UK and in Irish overspill areas and in tesco.ie. The game is up! Time for a collaborative rather than an isolationist strategy.

Sponge Bob

Modern TVs do not support VHF and neither do DTT Boxes. The Only TVs that can tune VHF Band 3 are analogue ones

Mr McBoatface

mrdtv2010 wrote: »

There will be no commercial DTT to cross subsidise the PSB muxes

This has been known for quiet some time now, RTE_NL/RTE are going launch Saorview in October of this year as a PSB as directed by Minister Ryan.

mrdtv2010 wrote: »

apart from the obvious transfer pricing issues which the EU competition authorities would need to examine

To what exactly are you referring to here ?

mrdtv2010 wrote: »

the frequency war across the Irish sea has been lost: its a King Canute strategy

I assume your referring to the Mount Leinster blocking of Presli. The extra muxes where turned off earlier this month, it was never going to continue once the commercial muxes idea failed. The problem now for many is RTENL kept the wrong channel broadcasting but I'm sure it will be rectified prior to PSB launch and RTENL move to ch39(I'm an optimist ).

mrdtv2010 wrote: »

T2 boxes will now be the norm in the UK and in Irish overspill areas and in tesco.ie. The game is up!

To what game are you referring to ? T2 will be backward compatiable with T1 and thus will be compatible with Saorview T1 which is great for those in overspill area's. I think for those who of us actually want non-sub TV who are not in those area's existing DVB-S2/DVB-T1 combo box are a better option.

If your suggesting we move to T2 broadcasts, well there is simple no need for us to, we don't have the problems the UK had which made it a requirement for them. I also happen to think and this is just an opinion that some if not all of Saorview boxes will be same as T2 freeview boxes with approved certification for Saorview. T1 is compatible with T2 so manufacturers won't go through the expense of making an Irish specific box.

Sponge Bob

There is no clearly identifable commercial DTT market in Ireland since large scale FTA satellite overspill, and particularly now the C4 family is FTA.

The Irish had cable on a large scale before the UK did because it was the only way to get UK Terrestrial in. That was during 3 then 4 channel UHF UK. Back in the 405 line VHF days half the country could pick up UK channels off air and Dublin was festooned with enormous antennae everywhere. Click on images Dublin 14 and Dublin 15 here on Vincent Brownes site to see some of these 405 line arrays from the early 1960s

Now the UK has 12 odd channels where before it had 4 , all available FTA and heading for FTA in HD the Commercial market is sated where people want their Beebs and C4 and ITV. Why should they pay for a few extra channels they can get free anyway.

I could imagine a documentary and kids topup to FTA model but not an FTA substituute, even then RTE will have to be prepared to licence per mux not all at once and a PAYG model will have to be countenanced.

jabarrett35

My Irish DTT on ch 45 is gone completely but I am getting Presely Ch43 and 46 loud and clear here in Tramore.

yeah presely is very strong today.
You should try ch 42 and 49

Sponge Bob

Deleted User wrote: »

yeah presely is very strong today.

Is this the end of the phoney war one asks and will Preseli Bate the tinkers out of Galway triumph over Mount Leinster ?????

Verso

I am in North Wexford and I am delighted now to be able to receive Channel Nos. 42 and 49 along with 43 and 46 due to RTE moving off these channels.

Llike others I was bothered about losing RTE DTT with RTE's transfer from 39 and Preseli blocking 45.

However I have found a walk around and sorry if this idea has appeared anywhere else on Boards.

On the same mast as my Group B Preseli aerial I have a smaller wideband inexpensive aerial pointed at Mount Leinster. Recently I only used this to receive analogue TV3. I have now introduced an isolation cable switch into my system. With the switch on to the Mt. Leinster cable (thus cutting off Preseli) I can receive RTE DTT at 93% quality. With the switch in the other position I can receive Preseli channels 42,43, 46 and 49 at 93% quality.

I know that this system involves two aerials but I have noticed that in South Wicklow and Wexford a good many people have two aerials anyway.

In any case this works for me and perhaps others might find this idea useful.

Gerry Wicklow

It would still be a lot simpler if RTE used ch39, which they are allowed to use, without interfering with anyone.
Why should thousands of customers have to re-jig things to suit RTENL's stubbornness? A simple flick of a switch on their end is all that's needed.

Verso

[QUOTE
Why should thousands of customers have to re-jig things to suit RTENL's stubbornness? A simple flick of a switch on their end is all that's needed.[/QUOTE]

I quite agree but does RTE?.

Verso

Verso wrote: »

I quite agree but does RTE?.

It's early days yet.
I'm sure they will be getting plenty irate calls in a year or 2 if they stubbornly stick to ch45.
Your workaround is cumbersome and costs money.
Why should people in Wexford who pay a licence fee that pays RTENL wages be forced to spend extra money unnecessarily to receive RTE channels after switch over ?
Should they do it because of some obsession RTE have with 45?
Should they be the only ones in the country that have to awkwardly flick a switch to receive RTE?

Those that do your work around probably won't bother flicking that switch too often anyway.

I know already in my house and others,the tv's need to be switched to analogue to receive RTE and people just aren't bothering.
Why would you when you can watch Eastenders on BBC one etc with epg information ?

I refuse to believe that comreg licenced that channel as a psb without RTENL suggesting it.
I also refuse to believe that Comreg wouldn't licence 30,34 or 39 for RTE PSB use at Mt Leinster if simply asked and told of the ch 45 problems in wexford.

lucernarian

If there are reception issues with receiving RTE channels due to co-channel interference, another group that can be informed is ComReg I think. There's no harm in telling RTÉNL of course but ComReg decide on allocations etc.

http://www.comreg.ie/contact_us/compliance.624.formcompliance.html

Of course, that can be a dangerous argument if Arquiva are convinced to lower ERP on Preseli instead. But the allocations and powers are fixed now, so I don't see why they'd be interested in lowering their ERP if it's not an analogue channel as analogue channels are still protected. And the DTT mux is still undergoing engineering tests!

I think people can call ComReg's bluff on this one.

I seriously doubt Arquiva would lower the erp on ch 45 just to protect mt Leinster which has no hope of ever carrying a commercial service other than RTE and TV3 and ergo needs just 1 mux at the moment.
It may require a 2nd for HD services in 2021 [My predicted timetable for that one :rolleyes:] but even at that they have 3 clear and internationally approved muxes to choose from.

Allied to that,Arquiva's ch 45 presely is only 10 kw.
When it was 2kw it still blocked mt leinster here on welsh set ups!

So lowering it altogether would not only cause severe reception difficulties in pembrokeshire,it wouldn't even solve the problem in wexford.
It's not even possible to tighten the beam from presely as it would defeat coverage in pembrokeshire and elsewhere in Wales.

JayDooling

At about 18:50, it is back on in Wexford.http://b-static.net/vbulletin/images/smilies/smile.gif

fat-tony

Hi Jay - see you are a new user (posts = 1), but you really shouldn't resurrect old threads like this (it's over a year old!) as it causes confusion. Start a new one - they are free!

Joe7

Black Briar closed account? First I've seen that, finally went nuts? . . . big effing loss etc., etc.

fat-tony

Joe7 wrote: »

Black Briar closed account? First I've seen that, finally went nuts? . . . big effing loss etc., etc.

get a grip!

icdg

5 day ban for Joe7 for personal abuse.

We don't drag up old threads.