Unfurnished house for rent

g.quagmire

Hi all,
I'm viewing a house for rent tomorrow. Brand new house never lived in unfurnished no blinds or curtains. Just wondering before I ask the estate agent what should be provided legally as in cooker,washer/dryer or anything is it take it or leave it? Thanks in advance.

RATM

Not sure what youre legally entitled to but if the agent says the landlord will supply XYZ then Id be asking for that in writing before you sign any kind of lease agreement.

Xiney

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/categories/housing/renting-a-home/repairs-maintenance-and-minimum-physical-standards/#rules

From 1 February 2009, a landlord must:

* Ensure that the house is in a proper state of structural repair. This means that it must be essentially sound with roof, floors, ceilings, walls and stairs in good repair and not subject to serious dampness or rotting. The new Regulations strengthen this requirement with effect from 1 December 2009 (see below)
* Provide a sink with hot and cold water
* Provide a separate ventilated room with a bath or shower and toilet
* Provide heating appliances for every room lived in
* Provide facilities for cooking and for the hygienic storage of food, for example, a 4 ring hob with oven and grill, fridge-freezer and microwave oven
* Provide clothes washing facilities
* Provide clothes drying facilities if there isn’t a garden or a yard
* Ensure that electricity or gas supplies are in good repair and safe
* Ensure that every room has adequate ventilation and both natural and artificial lighting
* Provide a fire blanket and fire alarms
* Provide access to vermin-proof and pest-proof refuse storage facilities.

Note: you are entitled to either a fridge freezer or a seperate fridge and freezer. A mini fridge with an ice box is no longer sufficient.

The_Conductor

It depends on whether the accommodation you are proposing to rent is classified as a private rented accommodation (in which case the 2 housing acts enacted last year apply) or whether its a property under the auspices of a housing association- in which case the 2 2009 acts do not apply.

In Ireland its rare (but not unheard of) for property to be let unfurnished. We're a little out of touch with what is the norm in the US/Canada and on the continent- normally tenants would have their own furnishings and put anything not in use in storage.

If its a private rented accommodation- the EA should specify when cooking, cleaning, food storage and clothes cleaning/drying facilities will be installed.

A contract specifying non-provision of these basic facilities is null and void- the property would be subject to a local authority enforcement order- if the landlord tried to get away with this.

ricman

he must supply dryer ,if there s no acess to a back garden.

g.quagmire

Thanks for all the inputs, to be honest the thing im most concerned about is the blinds its a detached bungalow with 11 single opening windows. I dont think this would be cheap even using curtains and poles. Can the house be let like this.Thanks.

ricman

just say i,,ll rent it AFTER curtains are fitted ,dark curtains for the bedrooms, unless you want to wake up at 6am everday.

The_Conductor

g.quagmire wrote: »

Thanks for all the inputs, to be honest the thing im most concerned about is the blinds its a detached bungalow with 11 single opening windows. I dont think this would be cheap even using curtains and poles. Can the house be let like this.Thanks.

The house cannot legally be let like this, no. It is a new house that has not been let previously- this means it must comply with both the February and November Acts from last year- which specify minimal levels of furnishings and standards of accommodation.

goat2

Xiney wrote: »

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/categories/housing/renting-a-home/repairs-maintenance-and-minimum-physical-standards/#rules




Note: you are entitled to either a fridge freezer or a seperate fridge and freezer. A mini fridge with an ice box is no longer sufficient.

that is not the case, landloards can say no, and they will find tenants that are not so demanding as to have to provide a freezer

The_Conductor

goat2 wrote: »

that is not the case, landloards can say no, and they will find tenants that are not so demanding as to have to provide a freezer

Landlords do not need to supply a seperate freezer- simply a fridge freezer unit.

An icebox is not acceptable- correct. But you also don't have the right to demand an elaborate seperate unit.

goat2

smccarrick wrote: »

Landlords do not need to supply a seperate freezer- simply a fridge freezer unit.

An icebox is not acceptable- correct. But you also don't have the right to demand an elaborate seperate unit.

an ice box is acceptable,

The_Conductor

goat2 wrote: »

an ice box is acceptable,

Perhaps you and I have different ideas of what constitutes an icebox?

MistyCheese

Does that mean that fridges such as this one are no longer sufficient?

The_Conductor

No- I think its fridges like this one- with an icebox that are no longer acceptable.

Note- the US/Canadian understanding of an icebox- is entirely different from the industry understanding of an icebox in Ire/UK/AU

In the US- an Irish fridge-freezer would be called a fridge with an icebox.
There are a range of fridges for bars in the States- called 'Icebox' that don't even have a freezer compartment at all.....

Cultural thing I think......?

goat2

MistyCheese wrote: »

Does that mean that fridges such as this one are no longer sufficient?

nothing wrong with that in a rent out, it keep food fresh, and the ice box for ice cream and ice, perfect

Xiney

I don't know smccarrick, on argos.ie this is a fridge freezer:

http://www.argos.ie/static/Browse/ID73/14418636/c_1/1|category_root|Kitchen+and+laundry|14418476/c_2/2|cat_14418476|Fridges+and+freezers|14418615/c_3/3|cat_14418615|Fridge+freezers|14418636.htm

they seem to have seperate doors.

the ones inside the mini fridges seem to be referred to as freezer compartments.



Now, our rental only has a mini fridge with a freezer compartment and to be honest I'm not 100% happy with that but I like our landlady a lot and the rent is good so I'm not going to make a fuss. Still, if I didn't like her so much I might try to get a fridge freezer out of her.

Sir Oxman

goat2 wrote: »

nothing wrong with that in a rent out, it keep food fresh, and the ice box for ice cream and ice, perfect

That's not a fridge freezer.
And no, it's not good enough.

RATM

goat2 wrote: »

nothing wrong with that in a rent out, it keep food fresh, and the ice box for ice cream and ice, perfect

Ive been using those bar fridges with the small freezer box for nearly 10 years of renting now. The freezer in it is tiny- Ive bought half legs of lamb before and gotten them home only to find they don't fit in the freezer. Theres also a limit to the amount of stuff you can fit in there so stocking up on meat when its on offer isnt really an option. Finally I once lived in a place with two other people and one of these fridges and we had absolute hell trying to fit all our food in.

With the glut of rental property now available I certainly wont be accepting a fridge freezer of this type on my next lease.

Kimia

goat2 wrote: »

nothing wrong with that in a rent out, it keep food fresh, and the ice box for ice cream and ice, perfect

Using the term 'rent out' shows how little you care for the rights of tenants and their comfort. Rented property is still someone's home and as such the person renting is entitled to a certain standard, and this 'freezer' or 'icebox' or whatever you want to call it is insufficient.

Also you clearly have no idea about cooking. Do you know you can freeze food not just icecream and ice?

ricman

if you are renting a house there should be a fridge freezer with a large freezer unit at least 2x 3ft so you can buy 2 weeks worth of meat at least .IF theres not one there ,walk away.
OF course some people put up with stuff cos the rent is low ,i cant complain, the landlord will raise the rent.
The landlord gets a tax credit when he buys a new fridge,cooker etc so it really costs him nothing.

goat2

Xiney wrote: »

I don't know smccarrick, on argos.ie this is a fridge freezer:

http://www.argos.ie/static/Browse/ID73/14418636/c_1/1|category_root|Kitchen+and+laundry|14418476/c_2/2|cat_14418476|Fridges+and+freezers|14418615/c_3/3|cat_14418615|Fridge+freezers|14418636.htm

they seem to have seperate doors.

the ones inside the mini fridges seem to be referred to as freezer compartments.



Now, our rental only has a mini fridge with a freezer compartment and to be honest I'm not 100% happy with that but I like our landlady a lot and the rent is good so I'm not going to make a fuss. Still, if I didn't like her so much I might try to get a fridge freezer out of her.

be careful what you wish for
if the landlady is ok and the rent is within what you needed, you could always buy a small freezer second hand for under 100 euro,

goat2

Kimia wrote: »

Using the term 'rent out' shows how little you care for the rights of tenants and their comfort. Rented property is still someone's home and as such the person renting is entitled to a certain standard, and this 'freezer' or 'icebox' or whatever you want to call it is insufficient.

Also you clearly have no idea about cooking. Do you know you can freeze food not just icecream and ice?

i do know you can freeze all, but if that is the only gripe, they could get themselves a freezer i can assure landloards make little or nothing out of renting property, the amount of fixing and replacing and painting also gardening is huge in a rental, which is not always taken into account by tax man,
every one deserve comfort, but when a person rent out property long term they can make it their own, and when leaving they can take it with them, as the more there is in a rented acommodation adds to the price per week to the tenant

Kimia

goat2 wrote: »

i do know you can freeze all, but if that is the only gripe, they could get themselves a freezer i can assure landloards make little or nothing out of renting property, the amount of fixing and replacing and painting also gardening is huge in a rental, which is not always taken into account by tax man,
every one deserve comfort, but when a person rent out property long term they can make it their own, and when leaving they can take it with them, as the more there is in a rented acommodation adds to the price per week to the tenant

Firstly, it's not the renter's problem if the landlord makes money or not so that is irrelevant.

Secondly, this is (per Irish law if I have read correctly) a basic standard of living - and it should not add to the price per week.

If you are a landlord you sound like the type that I would avoid at all costs.

goat2

Kimia wrote: »

Firstly, it's not the renter's problem if the landlord makes money or not so that is irrelevant.

Secondly, this is (per Irish law if I have read correctly) a basic standard of living - and it should not add to the price per week.

If you are a landlord you sound like the type that I would avoid at all costs.

i have never ever seen freezers in houses for rent, as my children rent out houses, and i go with them, they are satisfied if it has a nice bathroom shower, kitchen bedroom and sitting room, and if all of what they need is not there, they just buy these things, once landloard is fair and good to them, and price is right

Xiney

actually this is the first place I've ever rented that didn't have a freezer or a fridge freezer.

but it's the first one to have a seperate tumble dryer, so go figure.

Graces7

goat2 wrote: »

be careful what you wish for
if the landlady is ok and the rent is within what you needed, you could always buy a small freezer second hand for under 100 euro,

Exactly so; that is what we did three houses ago. I think it was around E50.

Graces7

goat2 wrote: »

i do know you can freeze all, but if that is the only gripe, they could get themselves a freezer i can assure landloards make little or nothing out of renting property, the amount of fixing and replacing and painting also gardening is huge in a rental, which is not always taken into account by tax man,
every one deserve comfort, but when a person rent out property long term they can make it their own, and when leaving they can take it with them, as the more there is in a rented acommodation adds to the price per week to the tenant

never met a landlord like this.... Fixing, replacing, painting: Gardening? One house where the landlord said in the contract he would cut the grass, it was done twice in 18 months.

goat2

Graces7 wrote: »

Exactly so; that is what we did three houses ago. I think it was around E50.

that is the option i would go for and have done so, you can always take it with you when leaving , also tvs they last yrs along with dvd players they are yours always, also your rent would be cheaper, and these things would pay for themselves in a matter of months, microwaves, toasters, hoovers at least when you buy you only do it once, and you will have it for next place.

Kimia

goat2 wrote: »

that is the option i would go for and have done so, you can always take it with you when leaving , also tvs they last yrs along with dvd players they are yours always, also your rent would be cheaper, and these things would pay for themselves in a matter of months, microwaves, toasters, hoovers at least when you buy you only do it once, and you will have it for next place.

Goat, all the things you're talking about are basic appliances that should be included in any furnished rental which is the norm in Ireland. If it's advertised as 'furnished' it should have all these things already.

However if the house/apt is advertised as 'unfurnished' and is cheaper as a result, I see your point.

goat2

furnished to means
curtains, beds, wardrobes, kitchen, washing machine, fridge, cooker, sitting room coffee table, sofa and fireplace, thats it really, needs must

ricman

Why would you rent a house with out a proper fridge freezer?
Unless the rent was very low.
IN most place its a renters market,there s lots of empty flats out there.

goat2

ricman wrote: »

Why would you rent a house with out a proper fridge freezer?
Unless the rent was very low.
IN most place its a renters market,there s lots of empty flats out there.

i still see people paying big for these places, so if a few non essential items are missing and the price is very reasonable, i would say go for it, you can purchase alot second hand or at a decent price new

The_Conductor

goat2 wrote: »

i still see people paying big for these places, so if a few non essential items are missing and the price is very reasonable, i would say go for it, you can purchase alot second hand or at a decent price new

And there is always the likes of Freecycle etc. too

Graces7

goat2 wrote: »

i still see people paying big for these places, so if a few non essential items are missing and the price is very reasonable, i would say go for it, you can purchase alot second hand or at a decent price new

The attitude to rentals is ....

The question to landlords should be; would YOU live like that?

goat2

Graces7 wrote: »

The attitude to rentals is ....

The question to landlords should be; would YOU live like that?

i do also see houses that are rented out, the grounds around are full of weeds and rushes, never getting cared for not even once a year, the houses are not painted on the outside in yrs looking very shabby, a lawn a clothes line a place to sit out on a fine day, are all important also,

ricman

i,d be happy to mow the lawn if i was getting a very low rent ,ie not 900 euro per month.say average rent minus 30 per cent.

goat2

ricman wrote: »

i,d be happy to mow the lawn if i was getting a very low rent ,ie not 900 euro per month.say average rent minus 30 per cent.

i would do same, after all it is for oneself one would be doing it, but not where they charge enormous prices

The_Conductor

ricman wrote: »

i,d be happy to mow the lawn if i was getting a very low rent ,ie not 900 euro per month.say average rent minus 30 per cent.

30% discount to mow the lawn?
I remember mowing lawns for 35p a go when I was a teenager- ye gods, I should have charged more!

Seriously though- under the 2009 Act- a landlord is now legally obliged to organise the upkeep of the exterior of a rental property- including but not limited to, mowing lawns, cleaning windows, painting etc. Its perfectly acceptable for the landlord to offload these duties on the tenant by means of lease article, however it is not acceptable to allow the exteriors of properties go to ruin, as often was the case in the past.

S.

goat2

i do think cleaning windows is going a bit far, as they should be done rather often, it does show how dirty a tenant is if he/she does not want to look out clean windows, shudder to think how they keep interior, if they are just too lazy to clean window outside

Xiney

fact is though that exterior windows often require a ladder to clean them - it's easier to make the landlord responsible for making sure they're clean than saying the landlord needs to provide a ladder to clean them... which would mean he'd need a place to store this ladder which would mean he'd need to provide a garden shed of some kind and in apartments.... etc etc.

goat2

Xiney wrote: »

fact is though that exterior windows often require a ladder to clean them - it's easier to make the landlord responsible for making sure they're clean than saying the landlord needs to provide a ladder to clean them... which would mean he'd need a place to store this ladder which would mean he'd need to provide a garden shed of some kind and in apartments.... etc etc.

sorry
i had forgotten about upstairs windows, but ground floor windows, i would expect tenants to clean those

Xiney

I think part of the problem is the outlook people in Ireland have towards renting: that it is simply a stepping stone until one can buy, rather than a viable choice, an alternative to buying.

In other countries, people choose to rent so that they don't have to deal with maintenance issues, and they can move on relatively easily if they wish to do so.

So in that case, the landlord should be in charge of maintenence, which in my opinion would include all fixed aspects of the property such as windows, exterior plantings, interior walls etc. Obviously cleaning the interior is up to the tenant because it is the tenant that messes it up - but the exterior is up to the elements and it makes more sense for it to be the landlord's responsibility.