advice for diy aerial setup

channelsurfer2 · 22-06-2010 11:29am #1

ok so i took the plunge and got rid of sky multi room but now need an rte aerial in the room without sky.

the signal is poor in the area coming from cairn hill (about 40% with trees in the way in the distance)....I want to put it in 3 rooms and need some advice as to whether to go for a mast head amp with a normal 10element group b aerial or the following without a mastheap amp and a 3 way passive splitter

http://www.triax.co.uk/Products/Aerials/UHF%20Aerials/Supergain%20-%20Yagi%20Aerials.aspx?productId={36D81A39-9DF4-4E6B-9B84-B143B8D2EDE0}&Tab=0

do you think i would get a good enough signal from this or should I go for a mast head amp and splitter in the attic? to complicate things more I dont have a chimney so would probably need a 10ft mast pole instead of the 6ft one.

thanks in advance

lucernarian · 23-06-2010 1:50pm

Are you receiving that 40% quality signal on an indoor 10 element aerial in the attic?

I wouldn't go with a passive splitter, any increased gain and reduced noise will be more than offset by the 5.5dB loss caused by the splitter. Get a decent quality distribution amp. I got an antiference 4-way amp with low noise specifications for about €20 over the net. It even had automatic 12V power if you wanted to use a masthead amp too.

channelsurfer2 · 23-06-2010 2:03pm

40% quality is with a borrowed 10element aerial at the roof gutter pointing to cairn hill.... i think i will go with the triax and the dist amp as recommended rather than a mast head amp...

lucernarian · 23-06-2010 2:55pm

Just be aware, having the aerial within an attic can make the signal much weaker compared to erecting it outdoors. But if worst comes to worst, you can put the aerial outside and use the distribution amp inside as before. A 6ft mast should be more than enough if you put it on the gable end of the house and if the house has a low gable end, you could just use a small mount (like for a satellite dish) on a north-facing side of the house.

channelsurfer2 · 23-06-2010 4:16pm

ok so 6ft mast on either back wall of house or gable end with the triax supergain 18b aerial..... and put the distrubtion amp in the attic to feed the 3 tv points with a power source? btw my sky dish is on the front of the house and its a terraced house.

lucernarian · 23-06-2010 5:40pm

I think you mentioned you were in Tullamore right? Sounds like the back of the house will have some sort of view to your north so. If there's no obstacles immediately to the north, you won't have to have the aerial up too high.

When you tried the aerial outside, was that with the aerial mounted on a pole or lying on top of the gutter? What was analogue reception like?

Well if you don't have an electric socket in the attic, you can use a masthead amp and just power the amp from one of the TVs being hooked up. That could be easier than fixing up an electric socket, especially if you can get an amp which gives you 4 outputs.

If you can't find an amp with multiple outputs, you could use the following:
http://tvtrade.ie/show/219,3-way-F-splitter--power-pass-1-Port-
http://tvtrade.ie/show/313,Proception-Screened-Masthead-Amp-UHF
http://tvtrade.ie/show/29,Proception-f-type-Power-Unit-1-output-

The above is just an example, I haven't any experience with this company. A splitter would work fine once there's a masthead amp used too.

channelsurfer2 · 23-06-2010 7:18pm

pole was just in my hand at gutter hight and reception was ok but not great with the 10 element contract aerial.
thanks for all the info. I looked at that site and its very good with the videos and all.

channelsurfer2 · 29-06-2010 3:32pm

something like this might be ideal??

http://www.optima-tv.com/assets/pdf/ma24-6.pdf

lucernarian · 29-06-2010 7:12pm

Yeah, that would work perfect. You could leave the masthead amp inside the attic so long as there isn't much more than 3 or 4 metres of cable between the aerial and amp. The 4-output amp looks like the best one for lower noise, aside from the fact that you only need 4 outputs anyway!

channelsurfer2 · 30-08-2010 9:51pm

ok finally got round to doing this. used the triax supergain with a combi mast head amp/psu. signal is perfect in the kitchen where the psu is located but second location signal is not as good with the amp powered up/ signal strenght on the first location says 81% but on the second location coming down from the masthead amp on the aerial it says 52%. i thought it should be more or less the same? could it be that i didnt connect the f connector for the second area good enough on the masthead amp? btw digital picture at 52% signal strenght is perfect so dont really want to mess about with second connection only using analogue reception for tv3 as the tv in second location has built in mpeg4 tuner.

channelsurfer2 · 01-09-2010 7:45am

anyone any help on this? seems tv3 is the worst affected in the second location. rte1, 2 very good. tg4 ok. but tv3 poor.. in the first location tv3 is okish where the mastamp power supply unit is located. could it be that tv3 reception from cairn hill is dreadful these days with the DTT tests?

01-09-2010 8:36am

With analogue in marginal conditions,yes the channels nearest the cd band are going to be worse than the ones down at 40 to 43.

So if tv3 is up at ch49 or something then thats your problem.
A long cable run will also weaken signal obviously and some amps fire more power on one of their distribution outlets than others.

A proper powered masthead amp would help a lot but I'd wait to be honest untill the october saorview launch to see if tv3 is on it.

channelsurfer2 · 01-09-2010 8:42am

thanks Black Briar

this is the amp and psu i am using btw so it is powered via the uplead to the unit.
http://www.labgear.co.uk/products.php?action=showprod&cid=2&cname=Masthead%20Products&plid=4&sc1name=Screened%20Mastheads&sc2name=Variable%20Gain%20Masthead%20Kits&pid=9&pname=PUH111%20and%20PSM114V.

I might try switching the psu to the tv in the second location and see if that makes a difference but as you say other than its wait and see till october. will tv3 in digital be clear if I am having this problem now?

01-09-2010 9:01am

yes as they will on be on the same mux-ch47 iirc at cairn hill.

If you are getting 50% signal now on dtt from there you will be grand.

Mind you TV3 mightn't be on dtt untill the end of 2012 but personally I doubt they will wait that long.
They were on the tests for a while but rumour is they aren't paying yet so hence the delay in getting them back on.
3E might be on it eventually also-at least RTE have asked 3 if they want to put it on there.

Thats labgear kit is fine for what you want.

Make sure you haven't kinked the cable too hard anywhere as you will lose signal aswell if you've perished it a bit.

Galway · 01-09-2010 9:24am

channelsurfer2 wrote: »

anyone any help on this? seems tv3 is the worst affected in the second location. rte1, 2 very good. tg4 ok. but tv3 poor.. in the first location tv3 is okish where the mastamp power supply unit is located. could it be that tv3 reception from cairn hill is dreadful these days with the DTT tests?

The analogue from CH has never been right since the DTT tests started. I used to have very good reception here 8km south of Tuam using a Triax UNIX 100 gr B aerial and a 35 db gain Johansson 39-69 masthead amp. Since DTT came on from CH, there has been a noticeable drop off in picture quality, esp on channel 50 (TG4). This has been confirmed to me by local installers, who are now having to use masthead amps in the east of the county , where previously these were not necessary. However, I get very good DTT from CH on ch. 47 using an unamplified Triax UNIX 52 gr B aerial not even at chimney height. I am not going to worry too much about analogue reception now with DTT imminent and hopefully TV 3 and 3e on the PS MUX.

channelsurfer2 · 01-09-2010 11:19am

Galway wrote: »

The analogue from CH has never been right since the DTT tests started. I used to have very good reception here 8km south of Tuam using a Triax UNIX 100 gr B aerial and a 35 db gain Johansson 39-69 masthead amp. Since DTT came on from CH, there has been a noticeable drop off in picture quality, esp on channel 50 (TG4). This has been confirmed to me by local installers, who are now having to use masthead amps in the east of the county , where previously these were not necessary. However, I get very good DTT from CH on ch. 47 using an unamplified Triax UNIX 52 gr B aerial not even at chimney height. I am not going to worry too much about analogue reception now with DTT imminent and hopefully TV 3 and 3e on the PS MUX.

yeah I noticed that too while i was assembling the aerial onto the pole before i put it up on the gable end. it was on an 8ft pole at ground level and dtt signal was good with all test channels clear.

channelsurfer2 · 10-09-2010 8:21am

notice the signal level drops from 75-80% to 50 to 55% with the rain and the analogue gets worse. wonder is it water getting in at the top of my new aerial or has anyone else experienced that level of signal drop out in the rain for dtt?

watty · 10-09-2010 10:38am

Depends on aerial design. Some higher gain aerials and aerials with load of plastic and spikes detune badly when wet.

channelsurfer2 · 10-09-2010 10:46am

thanks watty. there is plastic tips holding the front elements on the triax 18b aerial and I checked the masthead amp which is bone dry but the rain does hold to the aerial itself as you can see lots of water on the elements.

I will check the balun connection at the weekend to see if any water got in at the top of the aerial.

advice for diy aerial setup

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