Is it too late to snag?

giardiniera

We moved in 2 months ago to a newly built house. It was a friend who built it, he said he'd snag it. We are now having major problems, is it too late to snag it now and ask him to fix the problems?

Poor Uncle Tom

What kind of problems, please elabourate.

rayjdav

If it was done, mate or not, as a contract agreement??, surely you insisted on a defects liability period? This is usually 6-12 months, depending on type of build/agreement. If included, your grand, if not, did you hold any monies on him (bond)? I have just finished a build - direct labour, used a few mates for certain aspects (trades). Lesson learned, mates and work dont go.:(

Carpenter

Hi
What is major problems

giardiniera

floor and wall tiles cracking, (3 lines from floor to ceiling and two floor tiles)
plaster skim and paint falling off plaster board,
sockets not working,
wooden floorboards rising up.
I know a certain amount of settling is to be expected but we tried to drill a hole on one of the floor tiles to put in a door stopper and it broke two drill bits so the tiles arent easily broken.

Poor Uncle Tom

floor and wall tiles cracking, plaster skim and paint falling off plaster board, sockets not working, wooden floorboards rising up,

You need to speak to your solicitor and Engineer about these problems. It should be possible to get the builder back to finish these works properly, but you need to have them documented with your solicitor and engineer. I hope anyone doing a specialised job like the electrics was qualified to do it. These works are not snags they are defects.

giardiniera

can i get a snag company with an engineer to go over the house for me. the elec was a professional but he was fired before the job was finished (not by me) and a second one was brought in to finish up.
we had an architect overseeing the job so after the plans were drawn up there was no engineer involved. do i need to hire one now or will any eng touch a job like this now.
Any advice would be good right now.
Thanks.

Paulyh

the architect should have snagged the house before you moved in, did he not???
i would contact the architect first and make sure he deals with the defects, as another poster asked, was there a contract in place with a main contractor?? and is there any retention money?

giardiniera

we had a basic contract it didnt say anything about snagging. i'll read it again when i get home but i'm pretty sure it says something vague about problems arising but not sure of the time frame.
No the architect didnt snag he made 4 site visits before the cheques were drawn down thats all he did.
it was in the contract to retain 5k but he asked us not to and because he was a friend we gave him the full amount. i know that was a mistake now but at the time we just wanted to move in and none of these problems were visible.

rayjdav

"Snag Company" as you say IS an Architect/Engineer. At this stage I would imagine any Arch/Eng would only do a superficial survey of the build. An Eng may open elements for complete structural report if requested.
On the socket issue, surely the Electrican had to submit a cert to the ESB regards connection. With this he would have had to do a complete test on all points. Very simple for him to do and find faults/non connections as the system is looped.
What you describe appears to more than the allowable norm for plaster cracking and bits n bobs.
Did you have contract or hand shake agreement. As said, liable under defects liability if signed....

giardiniera

we do have a written contract i'll just have to read it to see what it says. i'll find a snag company and see what they say. At least i know where to start now.

Paulyh

and what sort of contract was it, was it a yellow/ blue RIAI contract? or possible a photocopy of one?
It is the Architect who is responible as he inspected and signed off on the build at the interm payment stages, presumably at the 4 occasions he was on site you mentioned.
legally it depends on what contract was in place. i would contact the Architect before getting any other inspection done and request him/her to inspect the defects and propose a course of action.
At this stage, as you havent held money back, you may find it very difficult to get anyone back on site to make good the work.
Personally i would hound the architect to resolve this, as an architects reputation as very important especially these days and would be very surprised if he/she just walks away from it.
was the house designed by this Architect?

giardiniera

i have a contract with the builder. the architect that designed the house wasnt the one working with us. the contracter has his own people who he usually works with as he knows them so he brought his architect with him to the build.
The builder is going to try to make it to look at the house this week. i'll see what he says and then i'll contact the architect to see what to do then.
I didnt really think of the architect as i had very little to do with him. I know for the legal side all his paperwork was in order but i dont have any form of written contract with him.

sinnerboy

So its just you and the builder . He does not sound like a friend judging by your posts . Your next call must be to a solicitor . S/he will advise what to do which most likely will include appointing an architect/engineer/surveyor - that YOU pay for and who is responsible to YOU .

When I see that

giardiniera wrote: »

The builder is going to try to make it to look at the house this week?

and

giardiniera wrote: »

it was in the contract to retain 5k but he asked us not to and because he was a friend we gave him the full amount.

It looks like you are not being treated fairly by your "friend" . He's taking advantage of you in my opinion .

giardiniera

i know he's not behaving like a friend. Hasnt been for a long time.
Builder stopped talking to me months ago when i brought up a valid complaint that he didnt fix and he just lost the head with my partner.
I dont have any problem asking my solicitor to deal with him but partner still thinks of him as a friend and wants to give him a chance to put it right.
I'd like a second opinion on whats wrong before he starts taking up floors and pulling tiles off walls. His work to date has let us down i dont want him to make things any worse.

sinnerboy

giardiniera wrote: »

he just lost the head with my partner.
I dont have any problem asking my solicitor to deal with him but partner still thinks of him as a friend and wants to give him a chance to put it right.

I fear that he is a bully and is abusing ye're good natures - you have to "grow some" - sorry .

This worries me too loud noises

Taking these two threads together I suspect that your structural timbers ( to your first floor and/or roof ) were allowed to become too wet during the build . Or maybe he bought a job lot of improperly stored lumber ( exposed to rain ) - cheaply . So the drying out of these timbers will cause movements that will lead to significant cosmetic damage .

This IS speculation on my part and I stress the need for an expert eye to act on your behalf .

giardiniera

Yes we think the noises are some how linked to the bathroom problems. cosmetic changes we could live with but the wall tiles are cracking now and some seem to be coming away from the wall instead of cracking.

I'd just like to know who to get a second opinion off, a structural eng, the architect or a snagger (with eng background). i'd like to have something solid before i let builder back in to take up a floor.

Any reports i get are going to the solicitor too.

RKQ

Paulyh wrote: »

It is the Architect who is responible as he inspected and signed off on the build at the interm payment stages, presumably at the 4 occasions he was on site you mentioned.

The Architects opinion is based on "visual inspection". The Builder is responsible for his own work. Unfortunately many people confuse "Mortgage Stage Payment" inspections with "Construction Supervision".

I think you should have retained your own Architect, a person completely independent of the Builder. A person who would look after your interests.

Seek professional advise. Its worth discussing this with your Solicitor, if the Builder continues to delay doing the repairs.

sinnerboy

OP don't misunderstand "cosmetic damage" . This is significant meaning damage to finishes as opposed to "structural damage" . "Cosmetic" does not mean "trivial"

I can't say this more explicitly - the person you call NEXT is you solicitor . No one else . Take direction from them - the " second opinion off, a structural eng, the architect or a snagger (with eng background) " is to be instructed by you - as advised by your solicitor

dan_d

Take sinnerboy's advice as the first step OP. And bear in mind that sometimes "cosmetic" problems are caused by structural problems. Tiles coming off the wall of a bathroom could be caused by any number of things, some of them structural.
The architect knows feck all about structural elements. Often an engineer will have limited knowledge about cosmetic finishes. What they both oversee is the quality of the builder's work...the engineer, that the builder is using the corect blocks/mortar/concrete specified that trusses are installed correctly, fixings used correctly, the structural elements installed correctly etc. The architect checks that the builder finishes the structure correctly - quality of work at windows, doors, tiles, often plumbing and sockets - internal and external finishes, in other words. Where the 2 (architect/engineer) cross over is if a structural element is impacting on a finished item, ie a beam running across a stairwell, or a room, or vice versa. Then they will have to liase to work out the solution most acceptable to both.
There seems to be a lot of confusion out there about that. In construction, that's how it works.

giardiniera

i've called my solicitor he said to hire an engineer and get him to have a look and if needs be deal directly with the builder as once there is an engineer involved the builder is less likely to mess about.
hopefully that will be the case.

Poor Uncle Tom

Paulyh wrote: »

It is the Architect who is responible as he inspected and signed off on the build at the interm payment stages, presumably at the 4 occasions he was on site you mentioned.

This is wrong.

The OP has stated there was not any ongoing construction supervision, that the architect's role was to sign-off stages for a financial institution.

mad m

Can you post up any pictures of the defects you are having in the house.

bbam

It's a tough one... Get on to your solicitor ASAP and have an independant person look at the defects. It sounds like this fella could just bodge over the problems even if they are more serious..

If it were me I'd get it hard to let him touch anything in the house again but I'm not sure if that is an option..

People pay good money for their homes and to then discover shoddy workmanshhip is heartbreaking..

muffler

Id prefer not to see any photos of the "defects" posted up here on a public discussion forum when there is the likelihood of litigation in the near future. It may not come to that and I sincerely hope that it doesn't but we are not going to be the jury in this instance.

Some posts here have more than explained as to where the OP stands and what to do from here. I think we can pretty much leave it at that now.

@ giardiniera, maybe you would update us please when all is done and and dusted. Thanks