Pessimistic Posters - Have you moved your money abroad

BeeDI

There are a few posters on here, who are very, very pessimistic about the economic future of Ireland, including some who agree with Morgan Kelly's prediction of a run on the banks, post September!

How many of you have taken the precaution of moving wealth off shore, into non Irish / even non Euro assets?
Are you just doomsayers for the sake of it, or do you follow your convictions with logical personal actions?

B

silverharp

I moved a high 5 digit sum to Canada last year. I also have UK based accounts and have a Rabo account (backed by the Dutch central bank/gov.).
If CDS spreads here looked like they were going Greek, I'd move the rest abroad in a heartbeat. I understand that Ireland being small might find it easier to get bailed out but still better safe then sorry

BeeDI

Seems Khazakstan is a good place to put money :cool:

RichardAnd

I keep only a small amount of cash in my bank account, the rest of my money is in the Post Office.

seamus

What money?

BeeDI

RichardAnd wrote: »

I keep only a small amount of cash in my bank account, the rest of my money is in the Post Office.

If Ireland Inc, is as insolvent as Morgan Kelly and some on here think, the Post Office, will be as safe as the rest of the system

Permabear

This post has been deleted.

RichardAnd

BeeDI wrote: »

If Ireland Inc, is as insolvent as Morgan Kelly and some on here think, the Post Office, will be as safe as the rest of the system

I thought about that but I don't think Ireland will become insolvent. Besides, you can't eat money.

BeeDI

BeeDI wrote: »

There are a few posters on here, who are very, very pessimistic about the economic future of Ireland, including some who agree with Morgan Kelly's prediction of a run on the banks, post September!

How many of you have taken the precaution of moving wealth off shore, into non Irish / even non Euro assets?
Are you just doomsayers for the sake of it, or do you follow your convictions with logical personal actions?

B

The real smart ones saw the banking problem before Sept 08 and moved money prior to that. Some recommended gold before the price increased dramatically (some say its a bubble). A brief use of the search function on some Irish forums will show you this.

Tora Bora

RichardAnd wrote: »

I thought about that but I don't think Ireland will become insolvent. Besides, you can't eat money.

Many is the man who can drink it, so why not be able to eat it :eek:

ei.sdraob

BeeDI wrote:

Pessimistic Posters

raises hand
im optimistic for myself, but pessimistic for the country and people which I still care alot for (tho that's starting to change), best case scenario seems long period of high taxes and little services, worst case scenario > ala Greece and bank runs

Have you moved your money abroad

in my case its a question of will I continue bringing in money from abroad :P and paying extortionate taxes on it that will only be pissed away

and the answer is no

extensively researching offshore company formation for many months now and intend on moving most profitable parts asap hopefully be done by year end

as for any savings i had here, I ploughed alot into the company buying up assets and hardware while others are closing shop, most of the hardware is already either in US or continent where electricity and networks are cheaper and better (to say the least!)
the rest I put into buying land and currently completing a home in a nice quiet location

I honestly hope things don't get worse,
But if things get bad (high inflation down the road) then I be ok

Permabear

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ei.sdraob

donegalfella wrote: »

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Congrats too

tho I honestly dont have the stomach to go into gold etc which I think is in a bubble, or maybe its not :P and its the money supply thats becoming worthless ...

i think ill stick to what i know best, linux and networks

anyone with serious savings in Ireland must be ****ting their pants now, despite the guarantee it feels worse than 2008

someone mentioned Rabo earlier, while they are a good bank it seems, keep in mind that if Ireland were ever to get ejected out of euro (hopefully that never happens) your money might get converted to whatever toilet paper its replaced by... their phone operators will confirm this

seamus

ei.sdraob wrote: »

tho I honestly dont have the stomach to go into gold etc which I think is in a bubble, or maybe its not :P and its the money supply thats becoming worthless ...

The whole death of the property bubble has me constantly reminded of a quote from the great depression where one pundit said knew it was time to get out of the stock market when he was getting stock tips from the shoe-shine boys.

That was requoted (here on boards I think), except "stock market" was replaced with "property" and shoe-shine boys became taxi drivers.

Looking at gold, I'm once again reminded of these quotes. When it's being advertised on TV like a Harvey Norman ad, when cash4gold have high street shops and when gold is being sold in vending machines as an investment, I think it's time to be worried about it.

Nothing, not even gold, can rise in price unendingly. But I don't know enough about trading or stocks to make any declarations beyond that

ei.sdraob

seamus wrote: »

The whole death of the property bubble has me constantly reminded of a quote from the great depression where one pundit said knew it was time to get out of the stock market when he was getting stock tips from the shoe-shine boys.

That was requoted (here on boards I think), except "stock market" was replaced with "property" and shoe-shine boys became taxi drivers.

Looking at gold, I'm once again reminded of these quotes. When it's being advertised on TV like a Harvey Norman ad, when cash4gold have high street shops and when gold is being sold in vending machines as an investment, I think it's time to be worried about it.

Nothing, not even gold, can rise in price unendingly. But I don't know enough about trading or stocks to make any declarations beyond that

yeh

I think for alot of people it has become not a case of getting a return on savings with little risk, but a case of ensuring the savings are not eroded too much

as i said before i never thought i would loose confidence in the euro, a lot of people must be scratching their heads in confusion at recent events (well the ones who care about their savings at least)

theres a topic on similar subject as this thread over at the pin
some of the comments are interesting

Permabear

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Daftendirekt

Slightly OT here, but how unsafe is it to have money in a credit union at the moment?

I have a relatively small amount of savings tucked away, but I'm wondering if it's time to put them elsewhere.

Like under the mattress on my bed or something

ei.sdraob

Daftendirekt wrote: »

Slightly OT here, but how unsafe is it to have money in a credit union at the moment?

I have a relatively small amount of savings tucked away, but I'm wondering if it's time to put them elsewhere.

Like under the mattress on my bed or something

dont credit unions keep/invest theiryour money with the banks?

isnt that one of the excuses given for saving Anglo?

Eliot Rosewater

As far as I know, some Credit Unions have insurance on deposits. I think my local one does. Do inquire about it though (ie: don't base your savings policy on the advise of an Internet poster!).

Daftendirekt

ei.sdraob wrote: »

dont credit unions keep/invest theiryour money with the banks?

isnt that one of the excuses given for saving Anglo?

Don't know, I wasn't aware of that if it's true though.

Daftendirekt

Eliot Rosewater wrote: »

As far as I know, some Credit Unions have insurance on deposits. I think my local one does. Do inquire about it though (ie: don't base your savings policy on the advise of an Internet poster!).

That's what I'd read too. I'll have to look into it some more.

Permabear

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Tipp Man

donegalfella wrote: »

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Is the scheme only as good as the governments word or is it insured independently to private parties?

If Irish government goes broke is this scheme null and void??

dunsandin

I have moved all of my money into the hands of my debtors, so that they can mind it for me for at least 90-120 days. Or at least it feels that way at the moment.
If and or when I finally do get paid for some of the many, many,many, many jobs we seem to have completed in the last 4 months, I am going to lodge it with my creditors, thus avoiding any bad implications for me of a run on the banks. While many may not feel this is a good strategy(myself included) it appears to be the only one available to me at the moment.:) The sooner I can achieve this transfer the better.

Poly

silverharp wrote: »

I moved a high 5 digit sum to Canada last year. I also have UK based accounts and have a Rabo account (backed by the Dutch central bank/gov.).
If CDS spreads here looked like they were going Greek, I'd move the rest abroad in a heartbeat. I understand that Ireland being small might find it easier to get bailed out but still better safe then sorry

Can a non-resident (me) open a Canadian Bank account "remotely"?

Spudmonkey

Poly wrote: »

Can a non-resident (me) open a Canadian Bank account "remotely"?

Or any sort of non european bank ac?

The_Thing

I recently opened an account with NAMA.

silverharp

donegalfella wrote: »

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I still like the fact that the TV ads are trying to get people to sell their junk gold. The ultimate top will be when the dumb money is buying gold hand over fist , coinciding with Ben Bernanke publishing a Fed reseach paper on the necessity of gold as a reserve asset

irishh_bob

forgive my ignorance but how does one go about moving savings ( euro ) into swiss francs , canadian dollars etc , is it merley a case of buying them in your local bank ??

ei.sdraob

irishh_bob wrote: »

forgive my ignorance but how does one go about moving savings ( euro ) into swiss francs , canadian dollars etc , is it merley a case of buying them in your local bank ??

alot of banks have the facility of having accounts in other currencies, even (gasp ) Bank of Ireland

check hsbc out

some like PayPal do it for free, but of course there are exchange rate fees when changing

i dont think speculating in currencies is a good idea unless you are big fish, but businesses sometime need accounts in different currencies for trading

MaceFace

I don't buy the hype of moving money offshore anytime soon to reduce risk of the local institute defaulting.

The bank guarantee scheme is here until at least the end of the year. BOI and AIB will be fully nationalised before they collapse and you lose you money, so money in these institutions are as safe as the State is.

If the State does go bankrupt (Dan O'Brien reckons it is 25% likely), it won't happen for a number of years, so plenty of time to sort out the mess before then.

As for where to put your money now, that is the big problem. Gold could very well be a bubble that could burst at any time. Foreign currency runs the risk of also losing value due to normal conditions. Recently on CNBC there was a Japanese house that is predicting the Euro to drop to $1.18 but within two years to climb to $3 (due to the problems in the US rather than anything in Europe).
German bunds probably seem safest to me but the problem there is locking away your money for a period of time.

What I will do is keep my money in the usual places (domestic banks/Rabo) and any sign of trouble, take out my money and put the cash under the bed.

Banned Account

Would it not make more sense to just move your debt to a greek bank;)

North_West_Art

Poly wrote: »

Can a non-resident (me) open a Canadian Bank account "remotely"?

as far as I know, you cant. I moved to Toronto in 2003 for a year, and I was able to open a bank account only because I was using my girlfriend's parent's address in Toronto, and they thought that this was my permenant full time address. She also had to accompany me and verify everything, plus the bank staff knew her family well. It was the CIBC bank. I was then told by her folks that it must have been an over-sight by the bank, but I was able to use it for transactions anyway.
The rules may have changed now though, you could do worse than to enquire by email to any of these banks... CIBC, RBC, Bank of Montreal, TD Canada Trust, Scotiabank.

*I have just looked at CIBC website, and non Canadian residents have to visit a branch to apply to open a bank account

Poly

The_Thing wrote: »

I recently opened an account with NAMA.

It can be a hoor to close though

Liam Byrne

If FF and their cronies screw up any more, I won't need what I have left, because as a pessimist realist, I'll be considering following Ahern's advice.

A world where you can't survive and have a life without being well-connected or having zero ethics ? Ye can keep it.

irishh_bob

ei.sdraob wrote: »

alot of banks have the facility of having accounts in other currencies, even (gasp ) Bank of Ireland

check hsbc out

some like PayPal do it for free, but of course there are exchange rate fees when changing

i dont think speculating in currencies is a good idea unless you are big fish, but businesses sometime need accounts in different currencies for trading

not planning to speculate on anything , just want my savings in a stable currency if the euro zone project falls apart , the last 24 months have shown us that what can go wrong , will go wrong

MaceFace

irishh_bob wrote: »

not planning to speculate on anything , just want my savings in a stable currency if the euro zone project falls apart , the last 24 months have shown us that what can go wrong , will go wrong

Surely an oxymoron in the times we live.

Poly

A currency with a stable government.

ei.sdraob

irishh_bob wrote: »

not planning to speculate on anything , just want my savings in a stable currency if the euro zone project falls apart , the last 24 months have shown us that what can go wrong , will go wrong

Yeh I understand

what's interesting for anyone saving to buy a house or something

while the prices in euro dont seem to be moving downwards much lately, the REAL prices measured in other currencies or even (gasp) gold is still falling fast

hinault

I am a realist/pessimist.

Since early 2000's, I said that what this country was experiencing was an economic illusion.
I was berated at the time and subsequently for being a harbinger of doom.
I take zero pleasure in being proven correct.

I am old enough to remember and to have lived through the 1980's here and I had hoped in the late 1990's that we had finally put an end to boom and bust.
But as we progressed through the 2000's I became convinced that bust was approaching.

I have a sizable amoutn of capital set aside.
I am in negative equity though.

If people off shore want to accept my negative equity, I'd be happy to let them have it.:D

My prognosis for the future of this country economically is not good.
I think we're in the perfect economic storm.

pumpkinsoup

hinault wrote: »

I am a realist/pessimist.

Since early 2000's, I said that what this country was experiencing was an economic illusion.
I was berated at the time and subsequently for being a harbinger of doom.
I take zero pleasure in being proven correct.

I am old enough to remember and to have lived through the 1980's here and I had hoped in the late 1990's that we had finally put an end to boom and bust.
But as we progressed through the 2000's I became convinced that bust was approaching.


I am in negative equity though.

If you've known for years that the bust was coming, then how the hell did you end up in negative equity? Seems pretty dumb?

Banned Account

hinault wrote: »

I am a realist/pessimist.

Since early 2000's, I said that what this country was experiencing was an economic illusion.
I was berated at the time and subsequently for being a harbinger of doom.
I take zero pleasure in being proven correct.

I am old enough to remember and to have lived through the 1980's here and I had hoped in the late 1990's that we had finally put an end to boom and bust.
But as we progressed through the 2000's I became convinced that bust was approaching.

I have a sizable amoutn of capital set aside.
I am in negative equity though.

If people off shore want to accept my negative equity, I'd be happy to let them have it.:D

My prognosis for the future of this country economically is not good.
I think we're in the perfect economic storm.

Did Miriam O'Callaghan really try to hit on you, and how much garlic did Lenihan take?

hinault

Fitz/Pump.


How did I end up in negative equity?

Simple answer : my wife (don't ask):mad:

pumpkinsoup

hinault wrote: »

Fitz/Pump.


How did I end up in negative equity?

Simple answer : my wife (don't ask):mad:

Ah yes. I have one of those too

johnnyskeleton

ei.sdraob wrote: »

theres a topic on similar subject as this thread over at the pin
some of the comments are interesting

There are about 20 of those on the pin, and also on the topic of how to protect savings if the euro collapses / ireland is kicked out. Most end with TUG shouting.

As he said in that topic:

The Unwelcome Guest wrote:

Jaysus... 2008 phoned... It wants its topic back...

ei.sdraob

johnnyskeleton wrote: »

There are about 20 of those on the pin, and also on the topic of how to protect savings if the euro collapses / ireland is kicked out. Most end with TUG shouting.

As he said in that topic:

If TUG was smart he'll let people discuss these more

more google money for him then....