Kids and Running

zico10

I'm training various teams, U-10 to U-131/2 for 4 X 100m relay races and just wanted to ask a few questions about what training I should be doing. Owing to breaks in the school day I only have them for half an hour and after a warm up and stretches I have them running short sprints of 60 to 80m, and get them to repeat these four to six times. Is this a good approach? Should distance be shorter/longer? And what recovery should I be giving them between sprints?
Also on the day of the race itself, what sort of warm up should they do? Obviously thery're only kids and won't have heart rate monitors, but on a perceived percentage scale of a person's max heart rate how high should their heart rates be? Don't know too much about what level of exertion kids should be able for.

Also there are a few indivduals who are doing a 500m event. I think this is supposed to be a middle distance event for children of this age. Is it the case that this would be considered middle distance for children? And what sort of preperation should children be doing for an event of this distance? Again in a half hour time frame.

RoyMcC

Good on you Zico, helping out with the young athletes. First of all, make it fun for both you and the kids so it is enjoyable. That way you get the best out of everybody.

I'd honestly say that - at that age for relays, you'll get most benefit out of baton practice. They probably run about all day as it is. If you can get them used to handing off smoothly and with confidence you'll be yards up on the other teams that haven't done that.

If you've time then a few short sprints per session - I mean short like 30-40, with maybe only one up to the full distance they'll be running. That way you keep it aerobic and fun.

On the day warm up as they should be doing in practice. A few drills and short sprints plus hand off practice again.

The 500m is probably being done by those more inclined to endurance - as far as can be told at that young age. I'd say give them a session of 600/400 with a rest in between, done at 75% effort, not raced. That way they get used to the distance but without the all-out effort until race day.

Above all else, treat them as children, not young adults.

donothoponpop

That's great advice RoyMcC, especially on the baton practice. Will be doing this with my group of kids tomorrow night.

Would agree 100% with you about keeping it fun and interesting. For my part I always end with a team "game"- usually just a few short relays that gets the excitement levels up, and ends on a high note.

The only "rule" I have as such- and offer it as advice in that I've found it extremely useful- is I insist all the kids run past the line, no matter if we're doing 50m sprints, 100m strides, or 400m laps. This helps keep the fast ones competitive, and stops the slower kids from walking with 10 meters to go. Always stand there encouraging the ones at the back to keep running to the line, gives them a goal, and I've noticed them getting faster (and getting a sense of achievement) from doing this.

meathcountysec

Was about to hop in here but can't think of anything extra to add to the very sound advice already offered here.

Brianderunner

I competed in relays from under 10 up to under 17's and i was relay manager at the community games in mosney more than once. For training we did lots of baton practising. Ensure the baton is placed from the right or left hand into the opposite hand of the outgoing runner, also if the outgoing runner is left handed, ensure he/she is standing on the outside half of the lane with the incoming runner on the inside and vice versa. Changovers are best done blind but this is a difficult skill. Ensure the outgoing runner has a check mark, usually about 5-6 metres away from the runner, which he/she starts running once the incoming runner reaches that point. The outgoing runner then speeds up to full speed then reaches back with their palm facing the sky for the changover, also he/she does not look backwards during the changover. As i said this is a difficult skill but it can make all the difference on race day, but it takes quite a bit of practice.

Apart from that we did starting drills for the leadoff runner only, assuming the team was well known. To develop speed we did high knees and heel flicks, as well as 30m pick ups where we jogged into them then accelerated. To end the night, we did a full 100m sprint to develop speed endurance, but also to establish the fastest runners.

ecoli

Great advice so far and i agree that baton practice is crucial. One drill would be have the kids jogging in straight line with person in last starting with the baton and passing it up through the line and when it gets to the front get them to drop it and have last pick it up again. This trains the hand coordination and helps them to get use to receiving the baton blind.

Also in terms of sprints with this age group why not have them do games which develop reaction times and speed like snatch the bacon. This way training is not a choir and it keeps the kids interested. Also have them sitting backwards until you blow a whistle starting a 30m race. This develops reaction times and speed while giving the kids a race and the best part is that with it only being 30 m no kid becomes dejected by being miles behind.

Most important thing is keep it fun

zico10

Thanks very much for all the replies and sorry for not getting back to ye sooner. Just have been mad busy in my school with Confirmation the last while. Haven't actually being doing much training with the kids as a result. Some very helpful hints as regards baton changeover.
Thanks for advice on training for 500m Rory, do you mean that the 400m/600m interval be repeated a number of times? And maybe I'm wrong but I'm not fully sure kids get the concept of a 75% effort. From what I see and despite me telling them to take it easy they still tend to go out hard and fade towards the end. What should I do to counter this?
Just two final questions, is 500m considered an enduarnce event for kids of this age? And for kids at what distance do events cease to be spirints?

thirtyfoot

Brianderunner wrote: »

also if the outgoing runner is left handed, ensure he/she is standing on the outside half of the lane with the incoming runner on the inside and vice versa.

The favoured hand of an athlete won't define what hand they use, the leg of the relay will.

1st Leg (on the bend) will always use right hand and they will run on the inside of their lane.

2nd leg (on the straight) will use their left hand and stand on the outside of the lane, taking it from the 1st leg runner who has hugged the inside line of the lane on the run.

3rd leg (on the bend) will use their right hand and will be on the inside of the lane and take it from the 2nd leg who will be coming in on the outside of the lane.

4th (on the straight) as per the 2nd leg.

Try and find some baton practice drills on the net. Kids of any age can learn to do it right. I started when I was 7 and at that age was able to use check marks, we all called hand and our fastest guys used acceleration zones.

Calling hand involves the outgoing runner moving off and the incoming runner shouting 'hand' when they are ready to deliver. The incoming runner only then will put their hand back. Its simple and the best way to pass a baton as the outgoer gets away quickly. With practice kids will always pick it up no matter what age. Acceleration zones are a little more complicated and most don't need them. Relays are great and there is nothing better than seeing a well drilled team of kids punching above their weight and winning due to slick changeovers. Our team when we were 7-12 were only beaten once and we didn't have the fastest guys on our team.

RoyMcC

zico10 wrote: »

Thanks very much for all the replies and sorry for not getting back to ye sooner. Just have been mad busy in my school with Confirmation the last while. Haven't actually being doing much training with the kids as a result. Some very helpful hints as regards baton changeover.
Thanks for advice on training for 500m Rory, do you mean that the 400m/600m interval be repeated a number of times? And maybe I'm wrong but I'm not fully sure kids get the concept of a 75% effort. From what I see and despite me telling them to take it easy they still tend to go out hard and fade towards the end. What should I do to counter this?
Just two final questions, is 500m considered an enduarnce event for kids of this age? And for kids at what distance do events cease to be spirints?

Zico, if you've only got 30-40 minutes or so then one rep of 600 + recover + one rep of 400 is plenty - certainly up to age 10/11 and for older ones unless they are the talented ones who can handle a bit more.

Good question about taking it easy, especially with boys! They will simply race if you start them together. A few will enjoy it, others will lose heart. Set them off in ones and twos and don't be timing them or anything like that. (OK you may need a time trial over race distance to select your teams.)

It's a tricky question about what constitutes a sprint. Until about age 11 the average youngster hasn't really got the aerobic ability to sprint hard beyond 60m or so (some faster developers can of course handle it.) At that age, certainly in the UK, you'll find that the sprints top out at 60m and the next distance up is 600m - a distance run steadily and not sprinted.

Beyond age 11 the sprints go up to 80/100/200 but there are still significant restrictions on 400m racing for both young boys, and girls until they are even older.

It's an area that is grey and you're better to err on the side of caution.

zico10

RoyMcC wrote: »

Zico, if you've only got 30-40 minutes or so then one rep of 600 + recover + one rep of 400 is plenty - certainly up to age 10/11 and for older ones unless they are the talented ones who can handle a bit more.

Good question about taking it easy, especially with boys! They will simply race if you start them together. A few will enjoy it, others will lose heart. Set them off in ones and twos and don't be timing them or anything like that. (OK you may need a time trial over race distance to select your teams.)

It's a tricky question about what constitutes a sprint. Until about age 11 the average youngster hasn't really got the aerobic ability to sprint hard beyond 60m or so (some faster developers can of course handle it.) At that age, certainly in the UK, you'll find that the sprints top out at 60m and the next distance up is 600m - a distance run steadily and not sprinted.

Beyond age 11 the sprints go up to 80/100/200 but there are still significant restrictions on 400m racing for both young boys, and girls until they are even older.

It's an area that is grey and you're better to err on the side of caution.

Thanks for reply. See that I called you Rory in my last post, sorry about that, should really have been paying more attention. Question about sprints was as much general curiosity as anything else. I see it myself that most of the kids are not able for a sustained effort over 100m, unfortunately the relays we're training for are all 4 x 100m. This is the case for under 10s as well as the older kids. Guess with it being on a running track, there's not much else the organisers can do.

RoyMcC

Hi Zico,
Strangely the individual sprints for the younger children seem to be over 60m in Ireland, yet the relays are (as you say) over 100m. To me (as a coach) this makes little sense. A track can be easily marked out in shorter sections even if only with cones.

Personally I don't think it's right asking your average 9/10/11 year old to sprint flat out over 100m, but I'm open to argument on that.

By contrast the English Schools Athletics Association (go to the Primary Schools' Athletics tab) stipulates shorter distances for both individual sprint events and sprint relays. There are also some useful training tools for youngsters on that site.

If the young ones are indeed running relays over 100m then it is the strongest and early developers that will win. This is not great for retaining others in the sport.

I'd be interested to hear other views which possibly contradict my own feelings on this.

downthemiddle

You are obviously preparing for the Cumann na mBunscol athletics event. One simple piece of advice is to ensure that they have lane discipline.Every year there are problems especially at changeovers in the relays when athletes who have finished their legs step out of lane and interfere with other athletes.

donothoponpop

RoyMcC wrote: »

If the young ones are indeed running relays over 100m then it is the strongest and early developers that will win. This is not great for retaining others in the sport.

I'd be interested to hear other views which possibly contradict my own feelings on this.

Surely the strongest (fastest) will always win over 60m too? We've started training a group for the under 8 200m- its a long distance event for them. Here's what I notice happening- the fast guys, who always win the 60m races, head out too fast, and bonk at half way. The kids who always come last in the 60m, manage to catch up at 100-180m, and overtake some of the speedsters. For a lot of them, its the first time they've not come last in a race, and the delight at this is a joy to behold. At that age, 200m is a slow and steady race, which suits some kids who don't have natural sprinting speed.

RoyMcC

donothoponpop wrote: »

Surely the strongest (fastest) will always win over 60m too? We've started training a group for the under 8 200m- its a long distance event for them. Here's what I notice happening- the fast guys, who always win the 60m races, head out too fast, and bonk at half way. The kids who always come last in the 60m, manage to catch up at 100-180m, and overtake some of the speedsters. For a lot of them, its the first time they've not come last in a race, and the delight at this is a joy to behold. At that age, 200m is a slow and steady race, which suits some kids who don't have natural sprinting speed.

I wish I could get youngsters to run slow and steady over 200m because that's the way to go. Then as they get older and stronger they can add speed. (Obviously we're talking 9-11 sort of age here.)

The received wisdom has always been that it can be harmful to stress the underdeveloped systems of the young ones by them running too fast too far. This is how that jump up from 60m to 600m for youngsters in the UK has come about. It's possible that this is an old-fashioned and over-protective view - what do you think?

One thing that I do like about the Irish setup is that relays are given prominence at a young age. They are enjoyable and the slightly less strong children are able to contribute within a team environment. That's important in getting them to stick with the sport as they get older.

donothoponpop

RoyMcC wrote: »

I wish I could get youngsters to run slow and steady over 200m because that's the way to go. Then as they get older and stronger they can add speed. (Obviously we're talking 9-11 sort of age here.)

The received wisdom has always been that it can be harmful to stress the underdeveloped systems of the young ones by them running too fast too far. This is how that jump up from 60m to 600m for youngsters in the UK has come about. It's possible that this is an old-fashioned and over-protective view - what do you think?

I think its over-protective. One thing that I do like about the Irish setup is that relays are given prominence at a young age. They are enjoyable and the slightly less strong children are able to contribute within a team environment. That's important in getting them to stick with the sport as they get older.

My uninformed opinion (based only on observance) is there is nothing wrong with under 8's running 200m (which is slow, steady, under a stride pace. Middle distance if you like). I tried it for the first time last week, they ran two hard (race) 200's, jogged (walk pace, jog movements) back, ran two (stride) 200's, which they raced anyway. Best result I ever got- as I said, the slow sprinters were beating the ones who took off like the clappers, and got a huge boost from this. Probably the first time they had come in the top half of a race in their lives. They were (all of the group) buzzing, and eager then to try new things (copied the older girls who were race walking). All the "good at 200m" kids were happier than I'd ever seen them.

donothoponpop

RoyMcC wrote: »

I wish I could get youngsters to run slow and steady over 200m because that's the way to go. Then as they get older and stronger they can add speed. (Obviously we're talking 9-11 sort of age here.)

The received wisdom has always been that it can be harmful to stress the underdeveloped systems of the young ones by them running too fast too far. This is how that jump up from 60m to 600m for youngsters in the UK has come about. It's possible that this is an old-fashioned and over-protective view - what do you think?

One thing that I do like about the Irish setup is that relays are given prominence at a young age. They are enjoyable and the slightly less strong children are able to contribute within a team environment. That's important in getting them to stick with the sport as they get older.

I think its over-protective. My uninformed opinion (based only on observance) is there is nothing wrong with under 8's running 200m (which is slow, steady, under a stride pace. Middle distance if you like). I tried it for the first time last week, they ran two hard (race) 200's, jogged (walk pace, jog movements) back, ran two (stride) 200's, which they raced anyway. Best result I ever got- as I said, the slow sprinters were beating the ones who took off like the clappers, and got a huge boost from this. Probably the first time they had come in the top half of a race in their lives. They were (all of the group) buzzing, and eager then to try new things (copied the older girls who were race walking). All the "good at 200m" kids were happier than I'd ever seen them.