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Mink protected or vermin

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  • 17-05-2010 8:08pm
    #1
    bogtreader
    Registered Users Posts: 350 ✭✭


    My friend and i were at our local haunt on saturday morning.
    We spotted a Mink along the bank jumping in and out of the
    water.It managed to catch a fish so i just wondering if it is protected or just vermin or escapees from fur farms Thanks
    Tagged:


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    #2
    Feargal as Luimneach
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,139 ✭✭✭Feargal as Luimneach


    vermin...
    Major threat to ground nesting birds like critical endangered irish bird the Corncrake........


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    #3
    johngalway
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,271 ✭✭✭✭johngalway


    Non native species which do a huge amount of damage to ground nesting birds in particular. They're efficient vicious and brazen killing machines. NPWS put out a tender earlier in the year looking for operatives to cull mainly mink, but also hooded crow and fox in specific areas of the West.


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    #4
    Valmont
    Registered Users Posts: 5,856 ✭✭✭Valmont


    I'm curious, is the hooded crow more of a threat than the regular crow? If so, why?


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    #5
    johngalway
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,271 ✭✭✭✭johngalway


    Valmont wrote: »
    I'm curious, is the hooded crow more of a threat than the regular crow? If so, why?

    My Dad often tells the story, I think it was about grouse :confused:

    Anyway... Years ago, he was walking home from the bog and spotted a grouse (let's say it's a grouse) and her young walking through the bog. She had a few of them, until two greycrows arrived at the scene, they kept after them until all that was left by the time she got to the road was the adult grouse and one young one.

    I've seen greycrows actively hunt smaller birds, one flies a little higher, the other chases the smaller bird. Didn't see the end result but I imagine it wasn't an intended tickle fight at the end.

    NPWS or your local ranger would likely be the best source of info on their effect on ... whatever it is the NPWS were looking to protect!


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    #6
    Feargal as Luimneach
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,139 ✭✭✭Feargal as Luimneach


    johngalway wrote: »
    My Dad often tells the story, I think it was about grouse :confused:

    Anyway... Years ago, he was walking home from the bog and spotted a grouse (let's say it's a grouse) and her young walking through the bog. She had a few of them, until two greycrows arrived at the scene, they kept after them until all that was left by the time she got to the road was the adult grouse and one young one.

    I've seen greycrows actively hunt smaller birds, one flies a little higher, the other chases the smaller bird. Didn't see the end result but I imagine it wasn't an intended tickle fight at the end.

    NPWS or your local ranger would likely be the best source of info on their effect on ... whatever it is the NPWS were looking to protect!
    Main threat to Red Grouse is habitat loss (bog destruction, overgrazing by sheep). Hooded crows would be way down the list.


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    #7
    johngalway
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,271 ✭✭✭✭johngalway


    Feargal as Luimneach wrote: »
    Main threat to Red Grouse is habitat loss (bog destruction, overgrazing by sheep). Hooded crows would be way down the list.

    Take it up with NPWS then.


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    #8
    Feargal as Luimneach
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,139 ✭✭✭Feargal as Luimneach


    johngalway wrote: »
    Take it up with NPWS then.
    They already know that:cool:


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    #9
    johngalway
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,271 ✭✭✭✭johngalway


    Feargal as Luimneach wrote: »
    They already know that:cool:

    In that case, perhaps they know something you don't :cool:


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    #10
    Birdnuts
    Registered Users Posts: 9,660 ✭✭✭Birdnuts


    Mink are probably the most destructive of the introduced mammals we have in this country and should be shot and trapped whenever possible!!


    PS: Could Otter hounds be retrained to take out this species:confused:


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    #11
    johngalway
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,271 ✭✭✭✭johngalway


    Birdnuts wrote: »
    Mink are probably the most destructive of the introduced mammals we have in this country and should be shot and trapped whenever possible!!


    PS: Could Otter hounds be retrained to take out this species:confused:

    There are "mink hounds".


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    #12
    LostCovey
    Registered Users Posts: 1,717 ✭✭✭LostCovey


    Feargal as Luimneach wrote: »
    vermin...
    Major threat to ground nesting birds like critical endangered irish bird the Corncrake........

    Major?

    I think you may be confusing mink and forage harvesters.

    Mink are a secondary threat.

    LostCovey


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    #13
    Birdnuts
    Registered Users Posts: 9,660 ✭✭✭Birdnuts


    johngalway wrote: »
    There are "mink hounds".

    Really - I'd love to see one, are there any pictures out there?:)


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    #14
    ytpe2r5bxkn0c1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 32,688 ✭✭✭✭ytpe2r5bxkn0c1


    LostCovey wrote: »
    Major?

    I think you may be confusing mink and forage harvesters.

    Mink are a secondary threat.

    LostCovey

    Absolute poppycock! Mink are certainly the major threat to many bird species. They take eggs, young, and adult birds.


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    #15
    johngalway
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,271 ✭✭✭✭johngalway


    Birdnuts wrote: »
    Really - I'd love to see one, are there any pictures out there?:)

    Yeah, plenty on Google. I knew I had heard of them before so that's how I confirmed it last night.

    By the by, what sort of reaction did you get with those fox photos?


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    #16
    cfitz
    Registered Users Posts: 1,691 ✭✭✭cfitz


    johngalway wrote: »
    They're efficient vicious and brazen killing machines.

    The emotive language used when describing species on this forum is ridiculous. A Mink is regularly described as above while Pine Martens and Otters are 'beautiful creatures' etc. These 3 species are actually somewhat similar. The difference in Ireland is that one has been introduced to a habitat where he is able to thrive at the expense of the native wildlife. This doesn't make the creature any less beautiful or any more vicious than the native species. So please, give up on the rants and gushing and if you want mink removed or pine marten preserved just say so rather than trying to brainwash people.


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    #17
    johngalway
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,271 ✭✭✭✭johngalway


    cfitz wrote: »
    The emotive language used when describing species on this forum is ridiculous. A Mink is regularly described as above while Pine Martens and Otters are 'beautiful creatures' etc. These 3 species are actually somewhat similar. The difference in Ireland is that one has been introduced to a habitat where he is able to thrive at the expense of the native wildlife. This doesn't make the creature any less beautiful or any more vicious than the native species. So please, give up on the rants and gushing and if you want mink removed or pine marten preserved just say so rather than trying to brainwash people.

    It's an accurate description, so don't try to make me out to be something I'm not. Ask any ecologist who's seen the results of mink finding a colony of ground nesting birds. They're efficient in their ability to kill, and vicious in they will wipe out many more birds than they need.

    I have personal knowledge of two local men seeing a mink go through a hen house killing hens, looking at the two lads and not being in the least perturbed by them while still killing hens. If that's not brazen what is.

    I am not trying to brainwash anyone. I never compared the mink to any other species so where you are finding ammunition to accuse me of saying they're more or less vicious than any other animal baffles me.

    My position on mink is well known, they should be completely removed from this entire island by any legal means available.


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    #18
    ytpe2r5bxkn0c1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 32,688 ✭✭✭✭ytpe2r5bxkn0c1


    cfitz wrote: »
    The emotive language used when describing species on this forum is ridiculous...if you want mink removed or pine marten preserved just say so rather than trying to brainwash people.

    Now hold on a minute. Nobody who gives even a slight damn about Irish Wildlife can describe the Mink in any other terms than have been used here. I don't demonise animals but I state facts. The Mink is a vicous killer and has no place in the Irish countryside. You may think it an attractive animal but physical appearance is no criteria for choosing an animal either. The Mink is totally alien and deserves no pity whatsoever. Have you seen large local populations of birds wiped out by mink? I have. I could get all melodramatic and equate the Mink to many other vile creatures we could let loose on an unsuspecting Irish countryside but I'll resisit the tempation.
    Yes, I want Mink removed. Yes, I want Pine Martens preserved (not my no.1 prioroty but as you brought it up) but to believe these things, or to call the Mink what anybody who knows or cares about Irish Wildlife would call it, is not brainwashing anybody. When did stating facts become brainwashing for Petes sake!


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    #19
    CJhaughey
    Registered Users Posts: 14,906 ✭✭✭✭CJhaughey


    Hard to describe an Otter as a vicious killer. They are fairly shy creatures.
    Pine Marten are probably as capable as a Mink in the killing stakes but they tend not to overlap with human habitation much here.
    Mink are stone cold killers, no question about it.


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    #20
    cfitz
    Registered Users Posts: 1,691 ✭✭✭cfitz


    Greyson Fluffy Smartness wrote: »
    The Mink is totally alien and deserves no pity whatsoever.

    This is more of it. The mink is what he is. I have no problem with the argument that they perhaps they should be culled for environmental and/or economic reasons. But he is as deserving or undeserving of pity as any other animal. Your statement makes it sound as if mink are a mortal enemy to man - their only crime is being put to farm on this island.


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    #21
    ytpe2r5bxkn0c1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 32,688 ✭✭✭✭ytpe2r5bxkn0c1


    cfitz wrote: »
    Your statement makes it sound as if mink are a mortal enemy to man.

    I want to be perfectly clear on this. I made no reference whatsoever regarding Mink and Man. Attacks on Hens etc are none of my concern. I only commented in relation to Irish Wildlife. In that respect the Mink is a mortal enemy. It is a mortal enemy to our very bio-diversity: to the balance within the Irish eco-system. You cannot understate the impact Mink has on our wildlife. Man? Another question altogether!


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    #22
    cfitz
    Registered Users Posts: 1,691 ✭✭✭cfitz


    Greyson Fluffy Smartness wrote: »
    I want to be perfectly clear on this. I made no reference whatsoever regarding Mink and Man. Attacks on Hens etc are none of my concern. I only commented in relation to Irish Wildlife. In that respect the Mink is a mortal enemy. It is a mortal enemy to our very bio-diversity: to the balance within the Irish eco-system. You cannot understate the impact Mink has on our wildlife. Man? Another question altogether!

    As an unwitting enemy to our biodiversity, if it is to be culled then surely it is the animal most deserving of our pity.


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    #23
    ytpe2r5bxkn0c1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 32,688 ✭✭✭✭ytpe2r5bxkn0c1


    cfitz wrote: »
    As an unwitting enemy to our biodiversity, if it is to be culled then surely it is the animal most deserving of our pity.

    Where did pity creep into the discussion? The OP asked if the Mink was vermin or protecetd. They got an answer and now you want us to agree to cull all the little blighters but to have pity on them. Pity is a human emotion certainly but unknown to most animals. Having pity for the Mink doesn't alter it's fate. It might make you feel less bad about things but changes nothing. It doesn't stop the poor Mink being a pest and it doesn't stop us having to eradicate it in Ireland. Next thing you'll ask that we pity Rats killed when clearing Rat infected flat complexes.
    You cannot deny the facts that Mink are vermin, that they have a massive detrimental impact on out native wildlife, and that they must be not only culled but (although unlikely) totally eradicated. You can have pity on them but, like the Mink itself, your pity will be misplaced. What about pity for the many species who will loose a full years young to Mink - pity them too. What about the loss of the Corncrake - will you pity it when we have it no more because of predation from Mink? (I know the situation with Corncrakes was not brought about by Mink but they are hindering the recovery plans big time).
    I agree the Mink didn't come here deliberately and is just in the wrong place but that does not make it right and should not induce sentiment that would prevent us righting the wrong.


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    #24
    cfitz
    Registered Users Posts: 1,691 ✭✭✭cfitz


    Greyson Fluffy Smartness wrote: »
    Where did pity creep into the discussion?

    This is where pity came into the discussion:
    Greyson Fluffy Smartness wrote: »
    The Mink is totally alien and deserves no pity whatsoever.

    It was me who called for people to stop using emotive terms (such as vicious and pity). I am not trying to promote a cull at all - just pointing out that even if one is in favour of a cull there is no need to portray the animal to have some sort of nastiness or evil. Which is certainly what is done regarding Mink on this forum regularly.


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    #25
    LostCovey
    Registered Users Posts: 1,717 ✭✭✭LostCovey


    Greyson Fluffy Smartness wrote: »
    Absolute poppycock! Mink are certainly the major threat to many bird species. They take eggs, young, and adult birds.

    I would agree for many bird species esp breeding waders. I wouldn't agree on Corncrakes.

    LostCovey


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    #26
    Feargal as Luimneach
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,139 ✭✭✭Feargal as Luimneach


    LostCovey wrote: »
    Major?

    I think you may be confusing mink and forage harvesters.

    Mink are a secondary threat.

    LostCovey
    I never said that the main threat to Corncrakes were mink ( early cut silage, lack of early cover, overgrazing and summer floods on callows are the main threats) but they are a major threat especially on offshore island eg Gola and Inishmeane. Considering only 129 calling males were in the core areas last years even the loss of a handfull of corncrakes to mink or feral cats is a problem.


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    #27
    LostCovey
    Registered Users Posts: 1,717 ✭✭✭LostCovey


    Feargal as Luimneach wrote: »
    I never said that the main threat to Corncrakes were mink ( early cut silage, lack of early cover, overgrazing and summer floods on callows are the main threats) but they are a major threat especially on offshore island eg Gola and Inishmeane. Considering only 129 calling males were in the core areas last years even the loss of a handfull of corncrakes to mink or feral cats is a problem.


    Are there mink on those islands?

    LostCovey


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    #28
    Feargal as Luimneach
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,139 ✭✭✭Feargal as Luimneach


    LostCovey wrote: »
    Are there mink on those islands?

    LostCovey
    On Inishmeane in 2007 nine adult mink were removed. Last year mink were again seen. A few Corncrakes were reported calling early in the season but nothing was heard after that and birds were assumed to have fallen prey to mink.
    Mink were remove from Gola in 2004 due to their predation of Corncrakes.


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    #29
    LostCovey
    Registered Users Posts: 1,717 ✭✭✭LostCovey


    Amazing they got out there that far. I wasn't really quibbling with mink as a menace, I agree they are.

    LostCovey


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    #30
    Valmont
    Registered Users Posts: 5,856 ✭✭✭Valmont


    Can anyone trap mink or is a license needed? Do they live near the coast?


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    #31
    johngalway
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,271 ✭✭✭✭johngalway


    Valmont wrote: »
    Can anyone trap mink or is a license needed? Do they live near the coast?

    You don't need a license. Just permission from who ever owns the land to be there. There are different kinds of traps available for the job, none of which should be set where water might cover it or sweep the trap away, and all traps should be checked minimum of once per 24 hour period. And your other question I answered elsewhere ;)


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