to apostrophe or not to apostrophe

chughes

When writing about a pub with a family name in a fictional town, which of these is gramatically correct -

a - Kelly's of Ballygobackward
b - Kellys of Ballygobackward.

Is the family name possessive singular which would include the apostrophe because we are talking about a pub belonging to the Kelly family, or is the family name nominative plural which excludes the apostrophe ?

MathsManiac

I would use "Kelly's", which I believe is traditionally regarded as the more correct version.

If you look around at signs on shops and pubs, particularly older ones, you'll be surprised to see how often that the name simply appears on its own, without any "s", even though you think of it with an "s".

In your fictional Irish town, I would expect to see something like "M. Kelly" on the sign, or "M. Kelly and sons" or some such. Then everybody would call this place Kelly's (even though in the case with the sons involved you could argue a case for putting the apostrophe after the "s"). This often seems to be the case even when there is more than one owner in the family - the premises is often named after one individual. If it just said "Kelly" on the sign, you'd still call it Kelly's , I would say, since there's no clue that there's more than one owner.

More recently, a lot of businesses that traditionally had this format have "rebranded" themselves - adding the "s" and dropping the apostrophe. For example, the business that used to be "Eason and sons", and always called "Eason's" is now officially called "Easons".

I think I recall hearing that Barclays bank (sic) in the UK took a bit of flak a couple of years ago for dropping their apostrophe in this way.

So, I guess your pub-owners could follow this modern trend and put a sign saying "Kellys" over their pub, thereby annoying all the traditional grammarians in the town, but leaving everybody else - who'll forget the apostrophe anyway - fortuitously correct!

chughes

Thanks MM. I am in favour of the proper use of the apostrophe and I hate to see it being used when it shouldn't be. In my example about the pub, I wasn't quite sure which it should be.

Permabear

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Permabear

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MathsManiac

Sincere apologies. I must have mixed it up with another crowd.

Perhaps it was "Clerys" I was thinking of. I think their business is registered as "Clery and Co. plc" but the shops are now called "Clerys". Am I correct on this one?

FlutterinBantam

donegalfella wrote: »

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That's the reason I shop at Eason;)

Donkey Oaty

You could to to Reads of Nassau Street (official name: "Reads without an apostrophe, Nassau Street, Dublin 2").

FlutterinBantam

Is that 'Reads' a company name or a family name?

I know that they sell books as in 'read' so then the apostrophe would not be there.

I genuinely don't know.

MathsManiac

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

Is that 'Reads' a company name or a family name?

I know that they sell books as in 'read' so then the apostrophe would not be there.

I genuinely don't know.

Don't know, but their website has heading on the side panel called "Womens mini marathon", so they're evidently not big on apostrophes!

www.reads.ie