3 part Derren Brown Series, Monday C4

Giselle

http://www.channel4.com/programmes/derren-brown-investigates

Derren Brown looks at some extraordinary claims from around the world, documenting a medium, a ghost hunter and a psychic expert who claims to make the blind see.

Its always interesting to watch Brown deconstruct the 'psychic industry'.

I'll be watching this one with interest.:)

kylith

I too am looking forward to this.

vampire of kilmainham

I cant stand darren brown and like most of the ghost hunters and so called psychics he is just out there to make money minipulating peoples brains into beliving what he wants people to belive. there's an old saying that i learned when i used to go to martil arts classes the instructer was Japanese and he used to say to us "BELIVE ONLY YOUR OWN EYES AND NOT THE VOICES OF OTHERS".

vampire of kilmainham

I cant stand darren brown and like most of the ghost hunters and so called psychics he is just out there to make money minipulating peoples brains into beliving what he wants people to belive. there's an old saying that i learned when i used to go to martil arts classes the instructer was Japanese and he used to say to us "BELIVE ONLY YOUR OWN EYES AND NOT THE VOICES OF OTHERS".

event

vampire of kilmainham wrote: »

I cant stand darren brown and like most of the ghost hunters and so called psychics he is just out there to make money minipulating peoples brains into beliving what he wants people to belive. there's an old saying that i learned when i used to go to martil arts classes the instructer was Japanese and he used to say to us "BELIVE ONLY YOUR OWN EYES AND NOT THE VOICES OF OTHERS".

except he doesnt claim to be a psychic or medium, he usually explains how and exactly what he has done

az2wp0sye65487

vampire of kilmainham wrote: »

I cant stand darren brown and like most of the ghost hunters and so called psychics he is just out there to make money minipulating peoples brains into beliving what he wants people to belive. there's an old saying that i learned when i used to go to martil arts classes the instructer was Japanese and he used to say to us "BELIVE ONLY YOUR OWN EYES AND NOT THE VOICES OF OTHERS".

Maybe you should have read the OP before jumping in feet first?

Anyway, just watched this, and it was very interesting. That bloke from Liverpool was such a chancer!!! The 'cold-reading' method is very interesting.

And Derren confirmed something that I'd always been saying about these con artists.... their audience want to believe what they're being told. So they'll come up with any connections to make sense of the vague and/or generic information that's being thrown at them!

Either way, it looks like a lucrative business. There's one of these Mediums performing in the Helix this Friday: Link - It would be interesting to go and watch from a completely neutral position.

kylith

I very much enjoyed this last night. I think that Joe Power showed himself for what he really is; a con man. His rejection of Derren's scientific test and his habit of blaming everyone else when he got something wrong spoke volumes.

And he's done a lot of readings for his mum's neighbours, I see. I bet she's a lovely woman, his mum; very chatty, lots of time for everyone.

Giselle

I can't express how much I despise these guys, and Brown was quite recitent in tackling Powers claims to his face.

Overall his assesment of Powers skills was bordering on charitable, but I suppose the positive reinforcement that Powers gets from his audience of believers makes it easy for the man to believe his own hype and makes it easier for him to sleep at night. Even conmen need their kip.

Giselle

Carla Fancy Rakish wrote: »

Either way, it looks like a lucrative business. There's one of these Mediums performing in the Helix this Friday: Link - It would be interesting to go and watch from a completely neutral position.

I did this with a friend once. The surprise of the evening was the 'psychic' was the very same middle aged woman who sat on a sofa in the hotel reception, watching and listening to the people who arrived early having a drink.

Even with whatever gems she overheard, she was distinctly underwhelming, but that didn't stop the seasoned psychic groupies from declaring the night 'amazing'.

It was amazing, but not in the way the rest of the audience seemed to think.

billybigunz

Carla Fancy Rakish wrote: »

Maybe you should have read the OP before jumping in feet first?

Anyway, just watched this, and it was very interesting. That bloke from Liverpool was such a chancer!!! The 'cold-reading' method is very interesting.

And Derren confirmed something that I'd always been saying about these con artists.... their audience want to believe what they're being told. So they'll come up with any connections to make sense of the vague and/or generic information that's being thrown at them!

Either way, it looks like a lucrative business. There's one of these Mediums performing in the Helix this Friday: Link - It would be interesting to go and watch from a completely neutral position.

Why are these disgusting creeps allowed to scam the more naive innoncent types out of money.

Paparazzo

You can read a bit about Joe Power here: http://www.merseysideskeptics.org.uk/category/psychics/joe-power/

He sounds nuts!

“The thing about you sceptics,” he said, standing on the step of a plus-size lingerie shop to raise himself to my eye-level, “is that you sit there, festering in front of your computers at 3am, thinking up ways to get at people. What if I were to sit in front of your house and tell people you’re a paedophile?”

“Well,” I say, “that’s for you to decide to do if you want to but it’s not really the same thing – I’m raising questions over what you do and the service you claim to provide; insinuating I was a paedophile would be just a personal attack, and wildly baseless. It’s not really the same thing. At all.”

“Oh I think they’re very similar,” he answers, “because you’re there festering, at 3am, plotting to get at me, in the same way that paedophiles fester and plot to interfere with children – you both have to be sick in the head to do what you do.”

http://www.merseysideskeptics.org.uk/2009/06/psychic-joe-power-and-the-two-man-mob/

Stupid made for TV show . Derren in the end proved nothing. Why did the show even go to air ??

The "psychic" was not that great also .

I was hoping that he was going to bring somthing new to light other then cold reading cold reading cold reading. How long is he going to ride that surf board.

maccored

when i eventually got to watch the one from the other night, i have to say it was all a bit weak. So a medium is fake .. big deal. Not exactly ground breaking. Next week its ghosthunter joe - I know nothing of this episode but if they pick a 'ghosthunter' who believes all spirits/orbs exist etc then its not really looking at a decently skeptical paranormal investigator (like many are) and alas, it will be one more easy target for the cynics to pick at.

I want to see a show like this where they dont go for the easy pickings. Never happen though.

kylith

maccored wrote: »

when i eventually got to watch the one from the other night, i have to say it was all a bit weak. So a medium is fake .. big deal. Not exactly ground breaking. Next week its ghosthunter joe - I know nothing of this episode but if they pick a 'ghosthunter' who believes all spirits/orbs exist etc then its not really looking at a decently skeptical paranormal investigator (like many are) and alas, it will be one more easy target for the cynics to pick at.

I want to see a show like this where they dont go for the easy pickings. Never happen though.

I'd say a large part of why this series seems so 'gently, gently' is that you can't just straight out call someone a fraud because you'll quickly find yourself in very hot water, legally speaking. Derren's going to have to find people who will agree to be on his show, knowing what his agenda is, and then set them up so that they show themselves to be frauds. This means that they're not going to get the big fish, because they're too savvy to put themselves in that position, and we're not going to get to see the grand debunking which we crave.

maccored

as far as commercial mediums are concerned, you have a point. Im interested now the mediums are out of the way, what kind of people will show up in the other 3 parts. I hope the 'ghosthunter' in the next one isnt an idiot who thinks everywhere is haunted

kylith

If you've not seen it I highly recommend Penn & Teller's series Bull****. They take psychics, healers, et al to pieces.

There's also swearing and boobies.

Dave!

Pretty good show, nothing too illuminating though of course

But maybe viewers who aren't familiar with cold reading techniques will see this and be a bit more skeptical in future

Of course this doesn't mean that every psychic is a fake, etc etc etc, blah blah blah :rolleyes:

Giselle

kylith wrote: »

If you've not seen it I highly recommend Penn & Teller's series Bull****. They take psychics, healers, et al to pieces.

There's also swearing and boobies.

Thanks for the recommendation.

Although swearing and boobies aren't much of a bonus for me personally.:)

murrayp4

kylith wrote: »

I'd say a large part of why this series seems so 'gently, gently' is that you can't just straight out call someone a fraud because you'll quickly find yourself in very hot water, legally speaking.

Wouldn't be an issue because a psychic would have to go to court, which would decide on the balance of probabilities whether he was a fraud or not. I'd buy tickets to that. :pac:

Dave!

murrayp4 wrote: »

Wouldn't be an issue because a psychic would have to go to court, which would decide on the balance of probabilities whether he was a fraud or not. I'd buy tickets to that. :pac:

It costs money to defend yourself though! Especially in the UK

(See: Simon Singh case)

murrayp4

Dave! wrote: »

It costs money to defend yourself though! Especially in the UK

(See: Simon Singh case)

I'd hazard a guess that Derren Brown and Channel 4 have a few quid

kylith

murrayp4 wrote: »

Wouldn't be an issue because a psychic would have to go to court, which would decide on the balance of probabilities whether he was a fraud or not. I'd buy tickets to that. :pac:

That would probably involve having to prove that he can't contact the dead, which is impossible.

murrayp4

kylith wrote: »

That would probably involve having to prove that he can't contact the dead, which is impossible.

Nope- proving he can't means proving a negative. It would mean deciding on the balance of probabilities whether he is contacting the dead- i.e. proving a positive- that he's actually doing it.

kylith

murrayp4 wrote: »

Nope- proving he can't means proving a negative. It would mean deciding on the balance of probabilities whether he is contacting the dead- i.e. proving a positive- that he's actually doing it.

Exactly, you can't prove that he can't contact the dead. And if you try to get him to prove that he can you'll run into all the usual road blocks; Spirits don't want to talk now, negative energy in the room, 'the message is unclear', 'you're all being mean to me' etc. All that will be provable is that in a court room, at that time of day, wearing that shirt, the spirits 'don't want' to communicate.

IANALawyer, but I'd say it'd be impossible to prove that he didn't talk to spirits last Wednesday, and that's the really annoying bit. And that's why Penn & Teller call them a$$holes rather than liars; it saves a lot of time in court.

kylith

kylith wrote: »

Exactly, you can't prove that he can't contact the dead. And if you try to get him to prove that he can you'll run into all the usual road blocks; Spirits don't want to talk now, negative energy in the room, 'the message is unclear', 'you're all being mean to me' etc. All that will be provable is that in a court room, at that time of day, wearing that shirt, the spirits 'don't want' to communicate.

IANALawyer, but I'd say it'd be impossible to prove that he didn't talk to spirits last Wednesday, and that's the really annoying bit. And that's why Penn & Teller call them a$$holes rather than liars; it saves a lot of time in court.

How many mediums have you spoken to ? and tested ? Or have you only watched TV shows on mediums ?

maccored

i am quite disappointed in this series. the first was the usual medium story, the second was some looney trying to con people into beleving a load of tripe and Im still wondering - wheres the paranormal debunking? What's paranormal about conmen? Answer, nothing. It should be a three part series in not getting hoodwinked - nothing to do with the paranormal at all at all.

maccored

and dont even talk to me about penn and teller. those two are very unfunny people who generally stick around the same medium/psychic debunking. My cat could do that (and would probably be much funnier).

Richard tea

I find the Penn & Teller bull**** show very good and honest. It really does cut away the bull****. The episode on Organic Food & the one about PETA were excellent:)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Bull****!_episodes

organic food http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fhBKtjDtTVk

maccored

i cant stand them. maybe thats either because I just cant stand them, because they arent very funny and constantly try to be, or they state the obvious most of the time.

pH

I was wondering why the hate for Derren from certain posters, then I saw what he's doing in episode 3 - Ghost Hunties!

Excellent to see Derren taking up the mantle that Scooby left off, I wonder will Derren figure out it's the janitor in a mask ... if it hadn't been for those pesky kids!

maccored

i'd say 'hate' is too strong a word. Maybe 'a bit pissed off derren has gone for easy to slag off stuff rather than something substantial' would fit better. Its not about the paranormal - its about general public entertainment.