hungarian or german (Schmidt and Bender Scopes)

cbrjohnthou

what is the difference between Hungarian and German Schmidt and Bender scopes, the price is def different can anyone explain why. I use German S+B 2.5 *10*56 zenith.

Tackleberrywho

shank1 wrote: »

what is the difference between Hungarian and German Schmidt and Bender scopes, the price is def different can anyone explain why. I use German S+B 2.5 *10*56 zenith.

A poor first cousin Hungarian one, quality not there.

See what happened Toyota getting parts made in Czech Republic, they cut corners!

It wasn't me!

The quality is exactly the same, with the same components being used. Only the fixed power variants are made in Hungary, keeps costs down, which keeps prices down.

Tackleberrywho

It wasn't me! wrote: »

The quality is exactly the same, with the same components being used. Only the fixed power variants are made in Hungary, keeps costs down, which keeps prices down.

I don't trust the Hungarians! But fixed power are simpler made as they have less parts.

I believe Nokia phones went down hill when they started been made in hungary!
ya can't beat the Fins!

cbrjohnthou

Tackleberrywho wrote: »

A poor first cousin Hungarian one, quality not there.

See what happened Toyota getting parts made in Czech Republic, they cut corners!

Surely they give the same result though don't they? Has anyone noticed even the slightest difference when using one or the other. I did hear they use different types of glass in both, but who's to know.

cbrjohnthou

It wasn't me! wrote: »

The quality is exactly the same, with the same components being used. Only the fixed power variants are made in Hungary, keeps costs down, which keeps prices down.

do you mind if I print this out and show a couple of the lads:D, I don't know how many arguments they've had about this.

Tackleberrywho

shank1 wrote: »

Surely they give the same result though don't they? Has anyone noticed even the slightest difference when using one or the other. I did hear they use different types of glass in both, but who's to know.

I could tell ya but I'd have to make ****tttte of two scopes to find out!

Reverse engineer the scope and put the glass under an KLA TENCOR and see what it looks like

http://www.kla-tencor.com/certified-used-equipment/surfscansp1.html

These lads are selling a second hand ones!!

It would cost a few beans though

bunny shooter

Tackleberrywho wrote: »

A poor first cousin Hungarian one, quality not there..........

I just can't resist Once again you are found to be talking ****e

It wasn't me! wrote: »

The quality is exactly the same, with the same components being used. Only the fixed power variants are made in Hungary, keeps costs down, which keeps prices down.

+ 1

Labour costs are most businesses biggest cost in producing any product.

Tackleberrywho wrote: »

I don't trust the Hungarians!

Would you care to enlighten us as to the reasons?

shank1 wrote: »

Surely they give the same result though don't they? Has anyone noticed even the slightest difference when using one or the other. I did hear they use different types of glass in both, but who's to know.

From what I've seen there is no difference in performance. Some people wouldn't buy Hungarian version in Celtic Tiger times. I reckon a lot more of them will be bought now though :eek:

Tackleberrywho

bunny shooter wrote: »

I just can't resist Once again you are found to be talking ****e



+ 1

Labour costs are most businesses biggest cost in producing any product. Not so Corporation TAX is higher locating factor based on a weighted scoring method plus energy costs. robotics eliminates labour costs as an issue, price of juice is more prevelant. Simple products can be mass produced easier due to the 4 V's rule of operations management.



Would you care to enlighten us as to the reasons?
I did, ref **** Nokia since moved to Hungary from Finland.
Also issues with Toyota getting parts made in Czech rep also another country witch makes cheap versions eg skoda Vs VW.



From what I've seen there is no difference in performance, TIME WILL TELL. Some people wouldn't buy Hungarian version in Celtic Tiger times. I reckon a lot more of them will be bought now though :eek:

I know a little about Engineering/Machining and processing.
Do you?:p

It wasn't me!

The glass is identical, and the fixed power models are brighter than the German variables, true to form with fixed versus variable scopes. The costs are lower because of the lower skill levels involved in making fixed power scopes, which is why they can be made in Hungary, while German fixed powers can demand prices the Hungarian ones can't, simply because of the badge. Think of it in car terms if you like. If I wanted a fixed power Schmidt, it would definitely be a Hungarian, as they're every bit as good.

Tackleberrywho

It wasn't me! wrote: »

The glass is identical, and the fixed power models are brighter than the German variables, true to form with fixed versus variable scopes. The costs are lower because of the lower skill levels involved in making fixed power scopes, which is why they can be made in Hungary, while German fixed powers can demand prices the Hungarian ones can't, simply because of the badge. Think of it in car terms if you like. If I wanted a fixed power Schmidt, it would definitely be a Hungarian, as they're every bit as good.

I'd prefer a nightforce, made in Japan lol

bunny shooter

Tackleberrywho wrote: »

I know a little about Engineering/Machining and processing.
Do you?:p

What next

My Daddy is bigger than yours :rolleyes:

bunny shooter

Tackleberrywho wrote: »

I'd prefer a nightforce, made in Japan lol

Not according to this link

http://nightforceoptics.com/nightforcescopes/SCOPES_OVERVIEW/scopes_overview.html

:eek:

Tackleberrywho

bunny shooter wrote: »

What next

My Daddy is bigger than yours :rolleyes:

My father would say what am I doing up @2:35am talking to strange men!
And he would be right.

Good night :rolleyes:

Tackleberrywho

bunny shooter wrote: »

Not according to this link

http://nightforceoptics.com/nightforcescopes/SCOPES_OVERVIEW/scopes_overview.html

:eek:

NXS RIFLESCOPES:
Technology to improve your shooting.

The philosophy of Nightforce is highly specialized and focused on building the ultimate instrument for the application. Our research and testing has developed new standards in manufacturing and quality control. Every Nightforce scope is assembled at our factory in North Central Idaho. All Nightforce scopes are 100% inspected and certified, passing vigorous testing prior to shipping. Our commitment to ultimate riflescope performance by using cutting edge technology and advanced mechanical designs is unparalleled in the industry. All NXS models share exceptional features, making them the finest riflescopes ever produced

made in japan stamped on the base of both of mine!
Parent company Lightforce Australia, Multinational, but scope is made in JAPAN
There again go the weighted scoring factors and Industrial operations.
lots of things are made in Ireland and assembled else where for that exact reason

bunny shooter

Dictionary definiation of "assemble"

1 : to bring together (as in a particular place or for a particular purpose)
2 : to fit together the parts of

I refer you to number 2 ............. same as "made" in this situation

Tackleberrywho

bunny shooter wrote: »

Dictionary definiation of "assemble"

1 : to bring together (as in a particular place or for a particular purpose)
2 : to fit together the parts of

I refer you to number 2 ............. same as "made" in this situation

Not so Bunny
Make 1. To bring into existence by shaping or changing material, combining parts, etc.: to make a dress; to make a channel; to make a work of art.
2.
to produce; cause to exist or happen; bring about: to make trouble; to make war.

Making and assembling are two related but different things Ikea make furniture you Try and assemble them!;)

large corporations assemble elsewhere because of that common misconception and tax loop hole. Anybody who works in manufacturing, knows this. Dell would be a prime example. Made in china, assembled in Poland, designed in America.
And just ask the people in Shannon about that!

Dell assemble in Poland so they can sell in Europe without tariffs for being MADE outside the EU.:D:D
It's where ever they get the sweetest deal!!
Formerly Ireland until Poland joined EU and could offer a better deal.

Nightforce assembled in US, MADE in Japan!

jwshooter

Tackleberrywho wrote: »

NXS RIFLESCOPES:
Technology to improve your shooting.

The philosophy of Nightforce is highly specialized and focused on building the ultimate instrument for the application. Our research and testing has developed new standards in manufacturing and quality control. Every Nightforce scope is assembled at our factory in North Central Idaho. All Nightforce scopes are 100% inspected and certified, passing vigorous testing prior to shipping. Our commitment to ultimate riflescope performance by using cutting edge technology and advanced mechanical designs is unparalleled in the industry. All NXS models share exceptional features, making them the finest riflescopes ever produced

made in japan stamped on the base of both of mine!
Parent company Lightforce Australia, Multinational, but scope is made in JAPAN
There again go the weighted scoring factors and Industrial operations.
lots of things are made in Ireland and assembled else where for that exact reason

do you not get bored looking up answers of the net , i much prefer to hear first hand experiences on such matters .

we all have google !.

Tackleberrywho

jwshooter wrote: »

do you not get bored looking up answers of the net , i much prefer to hear first hand experiences on such matters .

we all have google !.

I have worked in Manufacturing for many years now and have studied it for many years also (in dept and received qualifications in the subject, both in Ireland and the states)
I was commenting on Bunny's comment that HE had no experience of Nighforce and does not own. Both my scopes have MADE IN JAPAN stamped on their underbelly.

I've been using Nightforce since 2005 and would not change.
I have used the best of Austrian,German and American scopes down the years. From Swarofski Pecar, Zeiss, S&B Burris even Tasco!

One could go arounsd in rings on the quality gig.
I had a Suzuki built in Japon and one build in the Philippines. The Philopeano one was the biggest BALL of sh1te I ever owned.

Same experience with Nokia phones made in Hungry not Finland.

I use Nikon and leica optics in the everyday course of my job, so i have more experience than most with HIGH end optics.

That's my First hand experience.;)

ronboy

Tackleberrywho wrote: »

I have worked in Manufacturing for many years now and have studied it for many years also (in dept and received qualifications in the subject, both in Ireland and the states)
I was commenting on Bunny's comment that HE had no experience of Nighforce and does not own. Both my scopes have MADE IN JAPAN stamped on their underbelly.

I've been using Nightforce since 2005 and would not change.
I have used the best of Austrian,German and American scopes down the years. From Swarofski Pecar, Zeiss, S&B Burris even Tasco!

One could go arounsd in rings on the quality gig.
I had a Suzuki built in Japon and one build in the Philippines. The Philopeano one was the biggest BALL of sh1te I ever owned.

Same experience with Nokia phones made in Hungry not Finland.

I use Nikon and leica optics in the everyday course of my job, so i have more experience than most with HIGH end optics.

That's my First hand experience.;)

be jeasus tack is up for it boy....."go on the tack" :D

Don't know about scopes but ya can't beat a Hungarian Vizsla.

Half-cocked

I was in the S&B plant in Budapest a few years back and got a great tour of the facility. Both the Hungarian and German plants exchange glass regularly depending on demand, so when you buy a scope from one country, chances are it has optics from the other in it. The tubes and mechanical parts are all made in the same facility and the country it is claimed to be made in is simply the country where it is assembled. Both plants operate to the same high QC standards. I've squinted down both German and Hungarian scopes and the only difference I could see was a very slightly warmer colour cast to the Hungarian glass. The difference was so minor that I think only a professional photographer would give a damn about it in a piece of optical glass;)

cbrjohnthou

Well thats that then! Thanks for the info lads, I have heard so many people saying they are superior or inferior or whatever the case may be. From what I gather the only difference is cost, and I also reckon with the way things are at the moment in this country that there is going to be a lot more Hungarian S+B purchased.:)

Hibrion

I have a fixed power Hungarian klassic 8x56. Can't say if it is exactly the same as a German model as I've never had the opportunity to compare the two up close. As far as I can gather from websites etc. they are exactly the same scope; the price difference comes from the cheaper labour.

One thing I will say is that my Hungarian model is an excellent scope, as clear as anyone could hope for and holds zero perfectly. I had it previously on a savage .223 for three years and it never lost its zero. Its now going on my new .308 and the only change is the mounts; talley instead of warne.

So if I was faced with the decision of which one to buy again, it would be the Hungarian. I can't see any reason for the others to be honest besides a bit of shooting snobbery.

dCorbus

Frankly, lads, who cares where things are made / assembled / fabricated / put-together / etc.?

I don't really give too much of a c**p whether something's styled by an irishman, engineered by a german boffin, quality controlled by a swiss gnome, manufactured in a hermetically-sealed atmosphere-controlled bunker cunningly hidden under a pacific-ocean semi-dormant volcano, assembled by a nimble-fingered team of specialist crack-team of chimpanzees specially bred for the purpose, and then packed and shipped from an industrial estate somewhere near the M50......

As long as it is value for money, works, and, relative to the price paid, does what I want it to.

I have a Nightforce on my .308 - Don't care who or where it was made. Frankly, irrelevant.

I have used the best of Austrian,German and American scopes down the years. From Swarofski Pecar, Zeiss, S&B Burris even Tasco

I also have a Tasco on my .22 - It's got made in china written on it and whilst is not a patch on my nxs (obviously!), it does the job I want it to, but to include the name "tasco" in your list of "the best of Austrian,German and American scopes" is pushing it a tad!:D

Well, tack, let's all just be very thankful that the previously percieved attitudes to Irish manufacturing "skills", or the percieved lack-thereof, have died away somewhat - otherwise, we'd really be up the s**ts!:rolleyes:

But it's disappointing to see these attitudes applied, as a generalisation, against hungarians TBH. True, the Finn's are generally good at making stuff - But then again, Nokia does have a long and prestiguous pedigree in the industrial manufacture of wellies and agricultural rubber products!:D:rolleyes:

Wow, you must have owned and used an awful lot of Nokia phones over the years, to be able to quality-test and assess the difference in manufacturing standards coming from the various Finnish and Hungarian phone factories!:rolleyes:

Does anyone remember, back in the day, when "Made in Japan" was a joke and anything "made in japan" was thought of a being more than a little bit ****e?

Oh good god, we've gone waaaaayyyyy off topic - again!

Youse are making me have a pain in my a**e, assembling your irrelevant semantic arguments.:o

Semantics and pedantics, lads, it's embarrassing!:p

Tackleberrywho

dCorbus wrote: »

Frankly, lads, who cares where things are made / assembled / fabricated / put-together / etc.?

I don't really give too much of a c**p whether something's styled by an irishman, engineered by a german boffin, quality controlled by a swiss gnome, manufactured in a hermetically-sealed atmosphere-controlled bunker cunningly hidden under a pacific-ocean semi-dormant volcano, assembled by a nimble-fingered team of specialist crack-team of chimpanzees specially bred for the purpose, and then packed and shipped from an industrial estate somewhere near the M50......

As long as it is value for money, works, and, relative to the price paid, does what I want it to.

I have a Nightforce on my .308 - Don't care who or where it was made. Frankly, irrelevant.



I also have a Tasco on my .22 - It's got made in china written on it and whilst is not a patch on my nxs (obviously!), it does the job I want it to, but to include the name "tasco" in your list of "the best of Austrian,German and American scopes" is pushing it a tad!:D

Well, tack, let's all just be very thankful that the previously percieved attitudes to Irish manufacturing "skills", or the percieved lack-thereof, have died away somewhat - otherwise, we'd really be up the s**ts!:rolleyes:

But it's disappointing to see these attitudes applied, as a generalisation, against hungarians TBH. True, the Finn's are generally good at making stuff - But then again, Nokia does have a long and prestiguous pedigree in the industrial manufacture of wellies and agricultural rubber products!:D:rolleyes:

Wow, you must have owned and used an awful lot of Nokia phones over the years, to be able to quality-test and assess the difference in manufacturing standards coming from the various Finnish and Hungarian phone factories!:rolleyes:

Does anyone remember, back in the day, when "Made in Japan" was a joke and anything "made in japan" was thought of a being more than a little bit ****e?

Oh good god, we've gone waaaaayyyyy off topic - again!

Youse are making me have a pain in my a**e, assembling your irrelevant semantic arguments.:o

Semantics and pedantics, lads, it's embarrassing!:p

I have gone through a lot of Nokia's 12 I think.
The company I work for prints Made in Ireland on it but it is assembled in Asia so it's exported tax free.
I put in Tasco to show my reference point, ya can't know what is sweet until you have tasted something sour! But i still hit a bunny @170 with the Tasco and a few deer before I got a job and could afford a better set up.

Although my Da's Atlas scope although circa 1964 is poor it worked for him!

Moral of story, Lads buy what ever scope you can afford!:D
The thread got very off topic.

I should not have made a geralisation that was wrong of me.

I just speak out if there is something i feel strongly about.

So Buy Hungarian S&B!! If you want one!

cbrjohnthou

Tackleberrywho wrote: »

I have gone through a lot of Nokia's 12 I think.
The company I work for prints Made in Ireland on it but it is assembled in Asia so it's exported tax free.
I put in Tasco to show my reference point, ya can't know what is sweet until you have tasted something sour! But i still hit a bunny @170 with the Tasco and a few deer before I got a job and could afford a better set up.

Although my Da's Atlas scope although circa 1964 is poor it worked for him!

Moral of story, Lads buy what ever scope you can afford!:D
The thread got very off topic.

I should not have made a geralisation that was wrong of me.

I just speak out if there is something i feel strongly about.

So Buy Hungarian S&B!! If you want one!

well to be fair now Tac I don,t see why you should have to apologise for explaining the topic (Hungarian or German) in the way you knew best to do. before I posted that thread I didn,t know the difference between either and now I do,.......... 'there is none':).

dCorbus

i still hit a bunny @170 with the Tasco

That's some throw!
Personally, I would have used my rifle to shoot him rather than try to clobber the poor bunnyrabbit with my scope!:D:D:D:rolleyes:

Tackleberrywho

dCorbus wrote: »

That's some throw!
Personally, I would have used my rifle to shoot him rather than try to clobber the poor bunnyrabbit with my scope!:D:D:D:rolleyes:

Your some hoor as they say down home
Only that I know you are a better shot than me i'd peg it at ya ;)

Now figure out them spakes Gosúin!

bunny shooter

dCorbus wrote: »

That's some throw!
Personally, I would have used my rifle to shoot him rather than try to clobber the poor bunnyrabbit with my scope!:D:D:D:rolleyes:

Brilliant !!!!! :D

Tackleberrywho

bunny shooter wrote: »

Brilliant !!!!! :D

I agree :D:D:D:D:D:D

dCorbus

Only that I know you are a better shot than me i'd peg it at ya

You, Sir, have me at a disadvantage.;)

Tackleberrywho

dCorbus wrote: »

You, Sir, have me at a disadvantage.;)

Never

bunny shooter

Tackleberrywho wrote: »

Never

**cough, cough** dCorbus I'll point him out to ya then it'll be deuce

Tackleberrywho

bunny shooter wrote: »

**cough, cough** dCorbus I'll point him out to ya then it'll be deuce

Don't worry, i'll introduce myself.

jwshooter

Tackleberrywho wrote: »

Don't worry, i'll introduce myself.

pleased to meet you hope you guess my name .

Tackleberrywho

jwshooter wrote: »

pleased to meet you hope you guess my name .

Pleased to meet you too, I'll be in Wexy over the summer I'll call in for tay or a pint, which ever you prefer!