The Drogheda Campaign

positron

Saw this on one of the free news papers (probably DI) over the week.

GROUP BEGIN CAMPAIGN TO GAIN CITY STATUS FOR DROGHEDA. CIVIC-minded activists in Drogheda are beginning a campaign to have the town officially recognised as a city. If successful, the campaign would first have to persuade the Government to bestow city status on a town for the first time in the history of the State.

link to DI

There's more to that item on the paper, but the DI website is no longer free, so I can't copy any more.

Just wondering what is the general feeling about this idea? Also, what is the motivation to get City status? What are the benefits to being a city rather than a town? Surely it can't be just a vanity thing? And finally, what are the chances that something so radical (Irish government, since independence, has never granted a town a city status, ever) actually happening?

Some stats for the curious:

From this link: http://goireland.about.com/od/preparingyourtrip/qt/towns20large.htm

* Dublin City - 1,030,431 inhabitants
* Belfast - 274,678 inhabitants
* Cork City - 189,692 inhabitants
* Limerick City - 91,119 inhabitants
* Derry City - 85,126 inhabitants
* Lisburn - 79,246 inhabitants
* Galway City - 72,237 inhabitants
* Newtownabbey - 64,412 inhabitants
* Bangor - 60,957 inhabitants
* Craigavon - 59,713 inhabitants
* Castlereagh - 57,197 inhabitants
* Waterford City - 48,278 inhabitants
* Drogheda - 34,336 inhabitants
* Dundalk - 33,730 inhabitants
* Bray - 32,781 inhabitants
* Swords - 30,742 inhabitants
* Carrickfergus - 29,767 inhabitants
* Ballymena - 29,020 inhabitants
* Newry - 27,849 inhabitants
* Newtownards - 27,799 inhabitants

Proper source for this type of information should be cso.ie and statcentral.ie, but their figures are 2006 Census, so not sure how valid they are now.

southlouth type

This is surely something that all people in Drogheda should support imo .It brings great advantages being a city rather a town in securing business and attracting tourism etc . The figures in that census are also misleading as lots of the houses in the east meath area with there adresses in Drogheda arent counted . This brings up all the usual issues of houses and business people living , working and going to school etc in Drogheda that pay rates to meath county council for some strange reason ! and there not counted in the Drogheda area in the census . The whole system needs a rethink , Drogheda being made a city and all these areas being brought in under the one roof makes a lot of sense ..

positron

That's a good point alright. From Drogheda Chamber Of Commerce website: link

Within a 30 mile radius of the Drogheda, there is a population of over 1.1 million, with a growing pool of skilled workers based here.

event

do you not need a university and a cathedral to get city status?

Misterpphead

Yea your right i think you nead certain things like a Theatre, catherdral, train station and stuff like that, as far as i know if you tick all the boxes theres no reason why not........i could only presume people that own property in the town will be going mad for it as it would push the price of there property up being in a city rather than a town.......altho these days you wouldnt be sure.

event

well drogheda will be some way off then, Dundalk would be much closer, seeing as they already have a cathedral and DKIT, which may become a Uni at some point

positron

I didn't know a cathedral and/or a university was a criteria for City status?

Going by the other most important measure - population. I read somewhere that there is an EU directive / guideline saying a city should have at least 50,000 residents. In 2006, Drogheda had approximately 35,000 residents. I don't know what it would be if you were to include people who live and work in Drogheda, but have addresses in Meath. I am sure Drogheda's population went up since 2006 - but I don't know if it went down a bit again in last few years or not. Anyway, by 2006 figures Drogheda has slightly more people than Dundalk - not sure if that's still the case - it probably is.

With that EU directive in mind, Limmerick could actually lose it's city status as their population is declining fast and they are just 52,000 or there about now.

But that then opens up the question why Waterford is a city when their population has been less than 50,000 for a long time.

Too many questions..!

Don't see the point to be honest.

Drogheda's not a city. It's a street of shops and a bunch of urbanised neighbourhoods. Any worthwhile stores are a significant distance away from each other.

If I go to Dublin I can access bucket loads of different stores, shopping centres, types of shops, serivces, etc. all usually within a few minutes walk of each other and, more importantly, there is an actual "city" vibe to the place. There are lots of people and lots of businesses.


Drogheda has West St. which is filled with lots of closed down and empty stores. It has two shopping centres, both of which also have far too many closed down stalls and stores.

Argos, DID, Harvey, Smyths, Woodies, Homebase, Lidl, etc. are all driving distances away from the "heart" of the town.


New York is a city. Dublin is a City. There are many great cities around the globe. Drogheda is not, and should not, be considered a city, no matter how many "Droghedians" believe it should be.

(Note; I am from Drogheda!)

southlouth type

Deleted User wrote: »

Don't see the point to be honest.

Drogheda's not a city. It's a street of shops and a bunch of urbanised neighbourhoods. Any worthwhile stores are a significant distance away from each other.

If I go to Dublin I can access bucket loads of different stores, shopping centres, types of shops, serivces, etc. all usually within a few minutes walk of each other and, more importantly, there is an actual "city" vibe to the place. There are lots of people and lots of businesses.


Drogheda has West St. which is filled with lots of closed down and empty stores. It has two shopping centres, both of which also have far too many closed down stalls and stores.

Argos, DID, Harvey, Smyths, Woodies, Homebase, Lidl, etc. are all driving distances away from the "heart" of the town.


New York is a city. Dublin is a City. There are many great cities around the globe. Drogheda is not, and should not, be considered a city, no matter how many "Droghedians" believe it should be.

(Note; I am from Drogheda!)

Ok so according to your argument there is only one city in Ireland maybe 2 if you include Belfast ! Newry , waterford , kilkenny , galway , limerick etc are no different to Drogheda imo .They have developed nicer city centres over the years but alot of that has to do with them being a city in the first place . A campaign to make us a city would only be positive for Drogheda so i dont see the problem with it .


" well drogheda will be some way off then, Dundalk would be much closer, seeing as they already have a cathedral and DKIT, which may become a Uni at some point "

Im not gonna get into the drogheda v dundawk argument again so just let it go .This is about Drogheda becoming a city . Start a new thread about Dundawk if you like .

locum-motion

positron wrote: »

* Drogheda - 34,336 inhabitants
* Dundalk - 33,730 inhabitants

Proper source for this type of information should be cso.ie and statcentral.ie, but their figures are 2006 Census, so not sure how valid they are now.

If I recall correctly, the 2nd last census was the first in which Drogheda had a higher pop than Dundalk, and there was approx 500 of a difference, so I'd say those figures are from that one. In the last census, Dundalk passed out Drogheda again, with about 25 more people!
Of course in the case of both towns and both censuses, there's a large hinterland that's not included, like Blackrock for example isn't included in the Dundalk figures.

event

southlouth type wrote: »

" well drogheda will be some way off then, Dundalk would be much closer, seeing as they already have a cathedral and DKIT, which may become a Uni at some point "

Im not gonna get into the drogheda v dundawk argument again so just let it go .This is about Drogheda becoming a city . Start a new thread about Dundawk if you like .

im not trying to start an argument about either town

im just saying that if you need a Uni and a cathedral, Dundalk is closer in that respect. Neither should be a city imo, but best of luck with the campaign anyway

Mr Magnolia

southlouth type wrote: »

Im not gonna get into the drogheda v dundawk argument again so just let it go .This is about Drogheda becoming a city . Start a new thread about Dundawk if you like .

It's trollish comments like your 'Dundawk' remark that start the arguments so leave it out.

southlouth type

southlouth type wrote: »

Ok so according to your argument there is only one city in Ireland maybe 2 if you include Belfast ! Newry , waterford , kilkenny , galway , limerick etc are no different to Drogheda imo .They have developed nicer city centres over the years but alot of that has to do with them being a city in the first place . A campaign to make us a city would only be positive for Drogheda so i dont see the problem with it.

I don't see how it is a positive or a negative? Drogheda is Drogheda. Giving it a city status doesn't make the town any more vaulable, exciting, amazing or... well.. anything.

It's not like we only discovered the town a few months ago or something. It's been around for a long time. Long enough that it has had plenty of time to develop a nice inner city. It hasn't, though.

It doesn't matter if the town is officially classed as a travelling circus. It's not going to change anything in the town.

Im not gonna get into the drogheda v dundawk argument again so just let it go .This is about Drogheda becoming a city . Start a new thread about Dundawk if you like .

First off, he made a very valid point. I haven't been in Dundalk in a few years, but it is certainly seems has more of the prerequisites required to apply for City status than Drogheda.

If you can't argue his point, then ignore him. Don't ridicule the "campaign" and thread by being petty and childish with "dundawk" comments.

positron

Deleted User wrote: »

I don't see how it is a positive or a negative? Drogheda is Drogheda. Giving it a city status doesn't make the town any more vaulable, exciting, amazing or... well.. anything.

This is exactly what I am trying to understand. I am sure the group who is running the campaign has some impression that the City status would be good for business, tourism etc. I would like to know that, and drawbacks if any (like some new charges/rates/taxes) before I decide to support or reject this (not that my opinion makes any difference... )

positron

On Facebook too: http://www.facebook.com/#!/profile.php?id=100001027929058&ref=search&sid=600263646.2069378037..1

mydrogheda

Even if the push fails - it still will get people talking (look at thsi thread) and may get some airtime on the national stations which "may" reap some rewards via increased positive exposure for the town.

Its a worthwhile effort - odds do appear stacked against it (our population / so close to Dublin & Dundalk) but whats the harm in trying.

utyh2ikcq9z76b

The drogheda city status has launched their website


http://www.droghedacitystatus.com

ssmith6287

Deleted User wrote: »

I don't see how it is a positive or a negative? Drogheda is Drogheda. Giving it a city status doesn't make the town any more vaulable, exciting, amazing or... well.. anything.

It's not like we only discovered the town a few months ago or something. It's been around for a long time. Long enough that it has had plenty of time to develop a nice inner city. It hasn't, though.

It doesn't matter if the town is officially classed as a travelling circus. It's not going to change anything in the town.





First off, he made a very valid point. I haven't been in Dundalk in a few years, but it is certainly seems has more of the prerequisites required to apply for City status than Drogheda.

If you can't argue his point, then ignore him. Don't ridicule the "campaign" and thread by being petty and childish with "dundawk" comments.

If you were going to England for a weekend where would you go? London, Liverpool, Birmingham maybe Manchester

Scotland : Glasgow, Edinburgh

Wales: Cardiff maybe Swansea.

Why????

Because they are citys, If Liverpool wasnt a city it wouldn't get half the tourism it does. Its not all about local people. Becoming a city wouldn't change much for the average Drog but its people coming in.

Example.. I own a company in Belgium, I want to open in Ireland. Would like Dublin but god I heard the traffic is mental, prices are so high, theres a lot of crime.... mmm Waterford is just that bit too far, Newry is in the UK, Galway altough beautiful and with good transport systems is just a bit too far from the main business hub, oh how about Drogheda. Its on the main road and trainline between the 2 biggest citys, its 25 mins from an airport, it has its own sea merchant port, Prices arent massive .......

Altough I reaise that if it became a city we would get the usual sprawl but that would be gradual.

I just dont think its realistic though. We are too close to Dublin. Wouldnt make much sense for allocating resources e.g more hospitals, garda stations, bigger council.

In fairness Dundalk would be better suited, the layour of the town is even better. As KKV said, Drogheda is mainly West Street, a couple of retail parks and alot of housing estates.

Would be great for tourism and business but I just can't see it happening

Wolfe Tone

If this happens I pity the poor soul who comes on holiday to Drogheda thinking that he will be in a nice Irish/European city.

Drogheda is a really badly planned town. I find its buildings etc depressing. I hate it. That said, I love the people in Drogheda. I am one myself.

ssmith6287

Im the opposite I like the town and not the people, well not all the people but when i walk across the town i almost feel nervous now. Just hate the site of the gangs of lil scumbags and worse the gangs of older scumbags walking round the place.

Wolfe Tone

ssmith6287 wrote: »

Im the opposite I like the town and not the people, well not all the people but when i walk across the town i almost feel nervous now. Just hate the site of the gangs of lil scumbags and worse the gangs of older scumbags walking round the place.

You have them everywhere. Im mostly out during the way. Its nice the way people actually say hello and stuff, not like say in Dublin, were everyone is rushing everywhere.

ssmith6287

I just dont like how anglisized the east coast has come. Go over to the west or down to cork and kerry and everyone seems so nice and happy. Even in restaurants the waitresses have real hospitality skills

Wolfe Tone

Damn west Brits!

Drogheda is not that bad in fairness. Nor is Louth, thats mostly Dublin.

ssmith6287

Oh i dunno, its a different culture altogether

southlouth type

The city status is something that drogheda badly needs . It can only be a massive positve from all points of view . The town needs to control its own destiny i.e it needs a city council . At the moment its controled by drogheda borough council , LCC and the outskirts of the town that stretch into meath are under MCC control .Its a mess tbh .Whats the problem with it ? Drogheda people need to start being more proud of who they are and where there from and stop looking at the negative all the time . And what have other towns suitability got to do with the Drogheda campaign .If " they " want to become a city fair play but lets leave that up to them .

Scotty #

ssmith6287 wrote: »

If you were going to England for a weekend where would you go? London, Liverpool, Birmingham maybe Manchester

Scotland : Glasgow, Edinburgh

Wales: Cardiff maybe Swansea.

Why????

Because they are citys, If Liverpool wasnt a city it wouldn't get half the tourism it does.

You can't seriously be comparing Drogheda to any of those cites...? It's 1/5th the size of the smallest city you quoted.

London... pop. 7,172,091
Liverpool... pop. 469,017
Birmingham... pop. 970,892
Manchester... pop. 394,269
Glasgow... pop. 581,320
Swansea... pop. 169,880
Drogheda... pop. 37,000

Your argument is that if Drogheda were a 'city' it would bring tourism but by International standards Drogheda is a medium sized town. You can walk from one end of it to the other in 15 minutes. What are tourist supposed to do here? It doesn't have the attractions, hotels, nightlife, to bring in tourists in any kind of large scale. Plus the town is extremely shabby.

It's a good industrial location... but it's never going to be a tourist hot spot. The best thing that could happen to Drogheda is a port development but that's unlikely to ever happen.

Drogheda has a long long way to go to even be considered a city (like most other 'cities' in Ireland).

utyh2ikcq9z76b

Newry is a city ....population: 27,430, no close access to a major airport, no port, only recently has it got any kind of decent road network to it

Scotty #

Heavenly Tight Italic wrote: »

Newry is a city ....population: 27,430,

So is Kilkenny with 22,000... doesn't make it right though. :rolleyes:

southlouth type

The plan would be to bring in the town and its entire hinterland which would increase the population hugely and once this is done the development of the town could be done independanty of all the other county councils etc . You can walk around dublin city centre in jig time , same goes for manchester city centre , its tiny . Its about developing the town and area over time . Sligo are advertising themselves as a city and its smaller than Drogheda and has feck all going for it ?

Scotty #

southlouth type wrote: »

The plan would be to bring in the town and its entire hinterland which would increase the population hugely

No it wouldn't. It's just green fields.

People are going to have to stop comparing Drogheda to places like Dublin and Manchester. It just makes the argument comical by doing so.

ArtSmart

MUSSOLINI wrote: »

If this happens I pity the poor soul who comes on holiday to Drogheda thinking that he will be in a nice Irish/European city.

Drogheda is a really badly planned town. I find its buildings etc depressing. I hate it. That said, I love the people in Drogheda. I am one myself.

ssmith6287 wrote: »

Im the opposite I like the town and not the people, well not all the people but when i walk across the town i almost feel nervous now. Just hate the site of the gangs of lil scumbags and worse the gangs of older scumbags walking round the place.

Ye see, cities (real cities) can compensate for the scumbags / ugliness with beautiful architecture / parks etc, etc..

southlouth type

Scotty # wrote: »

No it wouldn't. It's just green fields.

People are going to have to stop comparing Drogheda to places like Dublin and Manchester. It just makes the argument comical by doing so.

Have you actually read the proposal or what ? My comparisons where made for good reason , If your against the idea then fine but the is no getting away from the fact that it would benefit Drogheda and the local area here massively and that for me as a proud Drogheda man is a good thing .

irjudge

We were changing flooring in my mothers house recently, found old copies of the DI from April 1976. Front page headline "Drogheda seeks city status".

IMO this is an awful lot of effort for something that is unlikely to happen and I think the perceived benefits aren't real.

People dont go to cities because they are cities. People go to Paris because of its attractions. Westport isnt a city and its local economy is built on tourism. We want tourists? We need to tell people about the place and put proper value for money packages together. There is huge history associated with the town and people are interested in that if its presented properly. I think we dont make it easy for people.

I think we have some fine architecture in the town its just a shame that so much of it is being let go to rack and ruin or covered with really poor signage.