Politicians opposed to reforming Dublin Bus

dynamick

First sighting: Dundrum councillor, Pat Hand (FG)
Dun Laoghaire Gazette, relentlessly negative coverage of changes under the heading: "Politicians vow to act"

Cookie_Monster

*sigh*

this was always going to happen, hopefully that Dept of Transport will see sense and overrule them.

Was the 48a not originally withdrawan / severly reduced when the luas came on stream as it ran parallel to it most of it before similar protest?

dynamick

90% of the 48A route is parallel to the green line luas.

I am going to post photos of these people here so you can focus your love on their beautiful faces.
First up:
Pat Hand

His dad, Tom Hand, worked for CIE.
http://www.rte.ie/news/2006/0308/mahon.html
http://www.rte.ie/news/2008/0311/mahon.html?rss

Cookie_Monster

dynamick wrote: »

:eek:
Ahhhh!

hes a bit scary looking!

Tarabuses

dynamick wrote: »

90% of the 48A route is parallel to the green line luas.

I am going to post photos of these people here so you can focus your love on their beautiful faces.
First up:
Pat Hand

His dad, Tom Hand, worked for CIE.
http://www.rte.ie/news/2006/0308/mahon.html
http://www.rte.ie/news/2008/0311/mahon.html?rss

I suppose it depends on how you define parallel?

DWCommuter

dynamick wrote: »

90% of the 48A route is parallel to the green line luas.

I am going to post photos of these people here so you can focus your love on their beautiful faces.
First up:
Pat Hand

His dad, Tom Hand, worked for CIE.
http://www.rte.ie/news/2006/0308/mahon.html
http://www.rte.ie/news/2008/0311/mahon.html?rss

Enough said.:rolleyes:

KD345

It really is astonishing that FG Cllr Pat Hand is stating that passengers will not be able to travel from Ballinteer to Dundrum, or Windy Arbour to Dundrum. Perhaps if he took a look at the proposals further and also at what transport is currently in the area he would see that:

Ballinteer to Dundrum will be served by the new 14/20B service and also by the new 75/174 service.

Windy Arbour is linked to Dundrum by Luas every 7 minutes.

The 48A is no longer the main route for people in Dundrum/Ballinteer. Passenger numbers are way down because of Luas, and the 14/14A routing gives a perfect link between Broadford/Ballinteer and Dundrum.

I really hope Dublin Bus don't give in to this sort of pressure. It's the likes of Cllr Pat Hand which had/has routes like the 8, 48A, 172, 206 etc. operating around Dublin carrying nothing but air. This is the one chance to reform the bus service and make it work. For once, Dublin Bus have a decent plan in place. The fact that the 48A has been running for 40 years means nothing. So long as there is a bus/luas service in it's place, which there will be, it should not matter what number is on the front of the bus.

FlameoftheWest

dynamick wrote: »

90% of the 48A route is parallel to the green line luas.

I am going to post photos of these people here so you can focus your love on their beautiful faces.
First up:
Pat Hand

His dad, Tom Hand, worked for CIE.
http://www.rte.ie/news/2006/0308/mahon.html
http://www.rte.ie/news/2008/0311/mahon.html?rss

Just look at him. He couldn't be anything else other than a politician who'll do anything to get a vote.

dynamick

So, the 84 frequency will be halved and will terminate at UCD rather than Cherrywood. Perhaps we can thank Simon Harris, tireless advocate for the people.

Simon Harris wrote:

Speaking about the issue, Councillor Harris said, "It has come to my attention that Dublin Bus intends to effectively remove 85 direct buses to Dublin from Newcastle. The current bus route starts in Newcastle and then proceeds to Kilcoole, Delgany, Greystones, Bray and on into South Dublin terminating at Eden Gate in Dublin City. I have been informed that this bus route will now start in Newcastle but will terminate in Cherrywood."
there is more...

KC61

dynamick wrote: »

So, the 84 frequency will be halved and will terminate at UCD rather than Cherrywood. Perhaps we can thank Simon Harris, tireless advocate for the people.

You have to love these guys....

Without public consultation, a company charged with providing a public service has decided the 84 bus service will terminate at Cherrywood and not go directly to Dublin

Heroditas

Am I being really stupid here or can users of the 84 not just get the 45 at Cherrywood .... or get the DART to Dublin City centre instead?

Wouldn't it make more sense to have the 84 as a more frequent service and have it serve the Greystones/Bray/Cherrywood area only or am I missing something?

KC61

Heroditas wrote: »

Am I being really stupid here or can users of the 84 not just get the 45 at Cherrywood .... or get the DART to Dublin City centre instead?

Wouldn't it make more sense to have the 84 as a more frequent service and have it serve the Greystones/Bray/Cherrywood area only or am I missing something?

You are spot on - the 145 will operate every 10 minutes and that would be the connecting service.

The problem that people had would be that they would have to pay twice unless they have a commuter ticket. Others had a problem with not being able to buy Travel 90 transfer tickets except in packs of 10.

paulm17781

KC61 wrote: »

The problem that people had would be that they would have to pay twice unless they have a commuter ticket. Others had a problem with not being able to buy Travel 90 transfer tickets except in packs of 10.

Dublin bus could alleviate this by making their default tickets a travel 90.

Is anyone writing to these politicians to ask them to stop meddling? I plan on it, so far there is only two listed here but these people need to realise that knee jerk reactions are what is going to kill this whole project.

schemingbohemia

paulm17781 wrote: »

Dublin bus could alleviate this by making their default tickets a travel 90.

I think that's the perfect solution, beautiful in it's simplicity.

The only problem is how does the second bus "read" the ticket, having to show the current paper ticket to the bus driver could slow access to the bus a bit I would think. Maybe having the font size a lot bigger or something would help.

KC61

paulm17781 wrote: »

Dublin bus could alleviate this by making their default tickets a travel 90

Ah but that would require approval from the DoT and they don't seem to be too keen on changing the structure.

Cookie_Monster

schemingbohemia wrote: »

The only problem is how does the second bus "read" the ticket, having to show the current paper ticket to the bus driver could slow access to the bus a bit I would think. Maybe having the font size a lot bigger or something would help.

Do you not just put it in the reader?

Heroditas

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

Do you not just put it in the reader?

Exactly!

schemingbohemia

But the ticket machines on the buses don't issue tickets that can be read by the reader they only issue the flimsy paper tickets not the Travel 90's.

What I'm talking about and what I understood paulm to be talking about was the cash ticket you purchased on the bus would automatically be regarded as a Travel90 allowing you to get another bus once it was within the 90 minute window.

schemingbohemia

KC61 wrote: »

Ah but that would require approval from the DoT and they don't seem to be too keen on changing the structure.

Have they been asked?

KC61

schemingbohemia wrote: »

Have they been asked?

That would mean changing the basic fares structure from the current staged fares. This has come up numerous times (going back to the EURO changeover when a flat fare structure was proposed by Dublin Bus) and every time there has been a refusal from the DoT.

schemingbohemia

When were they last asked? And why not ask them again?

antoinolachtnai

Local representatives are quite rightly voicing the concerns of the people they represent.

It is completely understandable when the information about these changes is being leaked out rather than being presented in full detail and in context.

loyatemu

antoinolachtnai wrote: »

Local representatives are quite rightly voicing the concerns of the people they represent.

this is true - anyone who is happy with the changes is unlikely to go to their local TD or ring Doe Juffy. Its the disgruntled commuters who'll make the most noise.

lord lucan

paulm17781 wrote: »

Dublin bus could alleviate this by making their default tickets a travel 90.

Is anyone writing to these politicians to ask them to stop meddling? I plan on it, so far there is only two listed here but these people need to realise that knee jerk reactions are what is going to kill this whole project.

It's typical politicians trying to get their name in the paper and appear to be fighting for their constituents. Most of them probably couldn't have told you what bus routes served their area last week. Their feckin' meddling could end up undoing a potentially good plan for most areas of the city.:mad:

KC61

antoinolachtnai wrote: »

Local representatives are quite rightly voicing the concerns of the people they represent.

It is completely understandable when the information about these changes is being leaked out rather than being presented in full detail and in context.

Antoin with respect - removing the 48a as per the first piece here is not going to disenfranchise Ballinteer. The 14 will continue to link Ballinteer with the city and Dundrum, and the LUAS and 44 will link Windy Arbour with Dundrum.

In fact you yourself have questioned its continued existence on this very site.

edellc

dynamick wrote: »

First sighting: Dundrum councillor, Pat Hand (FG)
Dun Laoghaire Gazette, relentlessly negative coverage of changes under the heading: "Politicians vow to act"

they cant abolish the 16a bus it goes a totally different end route than the 16 i dont drive and the 16a is vital to me as it gets me from harolds cross up to my mams at nutgrove if the 16a is abolished i will be left with no choice than to get a bus to rathmines and the the 14a oh no they are getting rid of that too grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr what the hell
think i'll just have to tell my terminally ill mam to fend for herself as dublin bus will no longer provide a bus

KC61

I would wait and see what happens - this isn't going to happen until either later this year or even into 2011. The 14 and 14a are probably going to merge together following the 14 route so there shouldn't be any real hardship as usage on the 14a between Churchtown and Dartry is minimal.

We don't know what the other plans for the area are, but there may well be other routes operating along Nutgrove Avenue other than the 16a.

stop

KC61 can you clarify for me the current route of the 14a (if ya know it!) from Dartry to Rathmines? The DB Bus Stop locations map seems a bit... wrong.

edellc

as above
the 14a goes a completely different way than the 14 if they merge the two and leave it as a 14 then what happens when it gets to dartry??? its just not good enough for them to change a route that has been going since i was born which is now over 30 years is a necessity
although i need it to go to nutgrove area which both buses do go i know plenty of ppl that have to just go on the one route

Ham'nd'egger

stop wrote: »

KC61 can you clarify for me the current route of the 14a (if ya know it!) from Dartry to Rathmines? The DB Bus Stop locations map seems a bit... wrong.

14A literally runs from Dartry via Upper and Lower Rathmines Road towards Richmond Street and Kelly's Corner. The 14 runs via Rathgar Road; is it the map that is up?

Victor

I think losing Rathgar Road (14a) would be better than losing Upper Rathmines Road (14a) and merge the two routes south of Orwell Road.

48a is only really needed from Milltown to Ranelagh where the access to Luas is almost non-existant.

Should the 44 routes operate from Dundrum to Enniskerry and avoid the city centre leg?

stop wrote: »

KC61 can you clarify for me the current route of the 14a (if ya know it!) from Dartry to Rathmines? The DB Bus Stop locations map seems a bit... wrong.

http://www.dublinbus.ie/en/Your-Journey1/Timetables/All-Timetables/14a/

I'm not sure if it goes via Palmerston Road any more.

the 14 is included here, but not the 14a http://www.mkmap.com/dublin

antoinolachtnai

KC61 wrote: »

Antoin with respect - removing the 48a as per the first piece here is not going to disenfranchise Ballinteer. The 14 will continue to link Ballinteer with the city and Dundrum, and the LUAS and 44 will link Windy Arbour with Dundrum.

In fact you yourself have questioned its continued existence on this very site.

I didn't say anything about the merits or demerits of taking off the particular bus.

Taking the 48A off is all very well, but you have to have a comprehensive plan for serving the people who depend upon it, and there is no plan that I can see. There is certainly no clearly articulated plan.

SerialComplaint

Victor wrote: »

48a is only really needed from Milltown to Ranelagh where the access to Luas is almost non-existant.

Not true - One of the big benefits of the 48A is the ability to beyond the Green. If I'm heading over to the north side city, the 48A is much handing than taking the Luas, and then having to wait for a connecting bus and buy a bus ticket.

KC61

stop wrote: »

KC61 can you clarify for me the current route of the 14a (if ya know it!) from Dartry to Rathmines? The DB Bus Stop locations map seems a bit... wrong.

The 14a operates along Dartry Road and Upper Rathmines Road.

There was a route variation that operated via Palmerston Road, but that ceased last year.

KC61

edellc wrote: »

as above
the 14a goes a completely different way than the 14 if they merge the two and leave it as a 14 then what happens when it gets to dartry??? its just not good enough for them to change a route that has been going since i was born which is now over 30 years is a necessity
although i need it to go to nutgrove area which both buses do go i know plenty of ppl that have to just go on the one route

With respect the numbers of people getting on/off the 14a between Churchtown and Dartry is normally nil in my experience since the LUAS started.

Perhaps it could route via Highfield Road and then operate via the 14 route?

Just becasue it has been there for 30 years doesn't mean that it should stay exactly as it is if next to no one is using it on that section.

Victor wrote: »

I think losing Rathgar Road (14a) would be better than losing Upper Rathmines Road (14a) and merge the two routes south of Orwell Road.

48a is only really needed from Milltown to Ranelagh where the access to Luas is almost non-existant.

Should the 44 routes operate from Dundrum to Enniskerry and avoid the city centre leg?

As above I would agree regarding the Upper Rathmines Road, especially if the 15 and 128 are to merge as was hinted earlier here. The loadings to/from Upper Rathmines are very good with lots of students from Trinity Hall.

I would certainly not shorten the 44. Through loadings have remained reasonable from my observations even despite the LUAS. There is a need to retain the bus as you observe to provide a link through Milltown.

SerialComplaint wrote: »

Not true - One of the big benefits of the 48A is the ability to beyond the Green. If I'm heading over to the north side city, the 48A is much handing than taking the Luas, and then having to wait for a connecting bus and buy a bus ticket.

But how many people are doing that?

I have never seen a 48a with anything close to a decent loading, other than one morning inbound service. It gets bogged down in traffic, and takes a longer route via Westland Row, that means you would almost be quicker walking at times if going north of the river. Evening peak services outbound generally have single figure numbers. You can't sustain a bus service with those sort of numbers.

antoinolachtnai wrote: »

I didn't say anything about the merits or demerits of taking off the particular bus.

Taking the 48A off is all very well, but you have to have a comprehensive plan for serving the people who depend upon it, and there is no plan that I can see. There is certainly no clearly articulated plan.

No but that politician was stating that there would be no link between Ballinteer and Dundrum - there is a link between the two in the form of the 14. I would counter that he is just trying to be seen to be doing something that really is not needed. I would also say that you obviously aren't aware of the loadings on the 48a - plenty of thin air.

antoinolachtnai

I have a fair idea of the loadings on the 48A. But that isn't the point. The point is that the communication of proposed changes and alternative services is very bad.

Plans for the combined single-trip luas ticket which seem to underlie this proposal are yet to be revealed.

dynamick

People before Prophet

Keep bus service crap for make benefit glorious socialist revolution in South County Dublin.

Cookie_Monster

dynamick wrote: »

People before Prophet

Keep bus service crap for make benefit glorious socialist revolution in South County Dublin.

Poisonous ****ers. Everything they go near turns to ****. I hate the PBPA with every ounce of my being :mad:

Milan Cobian

If the service was being withdrawn through strike action, how concerned then would RBB and his fellow travellers be about the sick, weak, old etc?
It's the typical communist tactic of being all things to everyone so everything just ends up being ****e.

Aard

Milan Cobian wrote: »

... being all things to everyone so everything just ends up being ****e.

Exactly. In fact, I believe this ethos is what is fundamentally wrong with the running of the country: trying to please everybody and ending up pleasing nobody.

Milan Cobian

And the irony is that "free-marketeers" like such nobodies as McCreevy and Harney were of the same ethos and managed, eventually via NAMA, to leave us with enough state-owned "assets" to make any communist green with envy.