Irish apparition was light trick by two boys, controversial book claims

umpirestrike

Irish apparition was light trick by two boys, controversial book claims

Old man brought secret to his grave but Canadian great grandson to reveal all


(BANFF, BC)AN Irish-Canadian author is set to stir massive controversy for the beleaguered Irish Church by publishing a book which claims that the apparition of Our Lady at Knock, County Mayo, Ireland in 1879 was a simple hoax carried out by his great grandfather and a friend using paraffin lamps and glass pieces.
The details of the light trick which the two boys carried out on their neighbours in the Irish village of Knock in the summer of 1979 has remained concealed in Thomas Mulliry's diaries which have been passed down through his family with the stipulation that they not be made public until at least 50 years after his death.
Now his great grandson Craig Mulliry is to publish a book which states that bearing the secret haunted his great-grandfather all his life.
Knock Shrine is one of the premier Marian Shrines in the world and was visited by Pope John Paul II during his trip to Ireland in 1979. However the new book entitled The Flickering Light claims that the apparition which was witnessed by more than a dozen people was a light trick carried out using a paraffin oil light and small panes of coloured glass.
Mr Mulliry died in a mountaineering accident near the Canadian city of Kamloops in November 1959, but the store owner who left Ireland around the turn of the century when he emigrated to Canada kept meticulous diaries which form the basis of the controversial book.
The 50th anniversary of his death passed last winter and the diaries were passed onto Craig Mulliry's family, but it was the freelance writer who realised the scope of the revelations.
Throughout his life, Thomas Mulliry made hundreds of entries relating to the alleged trick that he and a friend Stephen Casey played on their neighbours in the rural Mayo village in 1879.
The secret has remained in the Mulliry family for three generations as they were afraid of the backlash that would erupt if it emerged that they were doubting the apparition in any way. Now Craig Mulliry is hoping to publish the book before the end of this year, and is hoping to launch it in Mayo, Ireland.
"The publishers have said that this could be the Irish church's Da VInci Code in that it shatters a myth, but that is not what I am about. This book A Flickering Light is just the final revelation in an old man's diary. I know that people will be skeptical of the contents but the books contains a recognised authentication of the diaries and their dates.
"There is no way that I can be sure that he did what he did, but those who were his contemporaries spoke of his overbearing sadness throughout his life and his strong devotion to the church. There is also no logical explanation why he would claim such an act in his diaries and then insist that nobody see these until he was dead for half a century.
"We can see that he anguished over what he had done and often considered coming clean about it. He says in one diary entry in 1948 that he confessed to a priest in Vancouver about the trick, but the priest must not have believed him and didn't even advise him to tell the truth," said Mr Mulliry this week.
Craig Mulliry, who has penned the book said that the secret of the diary had been in the family for two generations.
"We were told as children that our great grandfather had done something of which he was very ashamed, but we were told not to ask or enquire about it. However, imagine our surprise when we discovered that what he was ashamed of was just a boyhood trick. However, it is important that we reveal his diaries now and allow people to make up their own minds," he said. He said that he hoped that a reconstruction of the alleged trick using the light conditions in Ireland in August would be possible. However, he is unsure about the reception his book will get in County Mayo where pilgrimages to Knock are worth millions to the local economy.

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MrPudding

Even if it is true and it was a hoax, I doubt very much it will have any impact on the faithful. The standard of proof required to contradict belief is far greater than that required to confirm it.

MrP

antiskeptic

MrPudding wrote: »

Even if it is true and it was a hoax, I doubt very much it will have any impact on the faithful. The standard of proof required to contradict belief is far greater than that required to confirm it.

MrP

It has a fair old ring of truth to it though doesn't it..

Hallelujah!

MrPudding

antiskeptic wrote: »

It has a fair old ring of truth to it though doesn't it..

Hallelujah!

I think it will be an interesting read alright.

MrP

kelly1

So are we to believe that someone was able in 1879 to project an image of Our Lady, St. Joseph, a Lamb and St. John the Baptist using parafin lamps and pieces of glass!? How likely is that?

iUseVi

kelly1 wrote: »

So are we to believe that someone was able in 1879 to project an image of Our Lady, St. Joseph, a Lamb and St. John the Baptist using parafin lamps and pieces of glass!? How likely is that?

Very? Doesn't seem like a complex setup, it's your basic slide projector setup.

kelly1

iUseVi wrote: »

Very? Doesn't seem like a complex setup, it's your basic slide projector setup.

Even indoor projectors need powerful bulbs and this happened outdoors. Parafin lamps hardly fits the bill. And I doubt they had slide film in those days!

dlofnep

kelly1 wrote: »

Even indoor projectors need powerful bulbs and this happened outdoors. Parafin lamps hardly fits the bill. And I doubt they had slide film in those days!

Sounds like a job for myth-busters. Theres no point in speculating if it is possible or not, without actually trying it under the exact same conditions yourself.

iUseVi

dlofnep wrote: »

Sounds like a job for myth-busters. Theres no point in speculating if it is possible or not, without actually trying it under the exact same conditions yourself.

Indeed. Besides, and I hesitate to say it, it's more likely than an actual appearance. But we need the mythbusters on it.

MrPudding

kelly1 wrote: »

So are we to believe that someone was able in 1879 to project an image of Our Lady, St. Joseph, a Lamb and St. John the Baptist using parafin lamps and pieces of glass!? How likely is that?

Realistically? Order of magnitude more likely than it was an apparition of a Caucasian woman born in the middle east 2000 years ago, a lamb and a Caucasian man born in the middle east 200 years ago.

MrP

krudler

kelly1 wrote: »

So are we to believe that someone was able in 1879 to project an image of Our Lady, St. Joseph, a Lamb and St. John the Baptist using parafin lamps and pieces of glass!? How likely is that?

About as likely as Our Lady, St. Joseph, a lamb and St. John the Baptist actually appearing in Mayo.

Cabaal

kelly1 wrote: »

So are we to believe that someone was able in 1879 to project an image of Our Lady, St. Joseph, a Lamb and St. John the Baptist using parafin lamps and pieces of glass!? How likely is that?

About as likely as man being able to fly in a heavier then air machine...oh **** wai....


What they used may not have projected a perfect image but you have to remember even if it looked like a person that likely would have done it alone as people will make out the features after that...we've seen that countless times....face of jesus in a wallk, toast, etc

old_aussie

kelly1 wrote: »

So are we to believe that someone was able in 1879 to project an image of Our Lady, St. Joseph, a Lamb and St. John the Baptist using parafin lamps and pieces of glass!? How likely is that?

No harder to believe than believing humans built the pyramids thousands of years ago

Michaelrsh

Finally people are starting to accept logic.

Michaelrsh

patrickk wrote: »

http://knockapparitions.com/divine-messages/61-april-18-2010

OMG!! They're just brainwashing people.

Fanny Cradock

It might be helpful if you read the charter, stuck by it and contributed something of substance in your posts.

Michaelrsh

Fanny Cradock wrote: »

It might be helpful if you read the charter, stuck by it and contributed something of substance in your posts.

Sorry, where you replying to me? If so, please realise that Joe Coleman's ideas and beliefs have been rejected by the Catholic church and mainstream Christianity.

Owen

Lets not forget Ireland was in a technical infancy in 1879, even in the big cities having modern luxuries couldn't be fathomed by people with 'good' educations. Bring a bit of plate glass, and a powerful lamp into the sticks of Mayo and a person's imagination would immediately think it _is_ Mary, especially seeing as Ireland was so devoutly Catholic at the time.

Fanny Cradock

Michaelrsh wrote: »

Sorry, where you replying to me? If so, please realise that Joe Coleman's ideas and beliefs have been rejected by the Catholic church and mainstream Christianity.

Yes, I was replying to you. If you have a point, make it.

Michaelrsh

Fanny Cradock wrote: »

Yes, I was replying to you. If you have a point, make it.

I made it in my last post on this thread.

santing

patrickk wrote: »

http://knockapparitions.com/divine-messages/61-april-18-2010

Many of my priests

Mary's Priests .... as opposed to priests of God?

I have told you I will guide and look after you always

Isn't that a bit strong for someone whose power is supposed to be intercessary only?

If my people ...

My people or people of God?

the foundations of the Church will be rocked

What again is the foundation of the Church? Is it not Christ Himself?

my Church

Does Mary have a Church, or is it the Church of God?

I will shine like never before. My people will witness me and they will honour me and respect me. So many of my priests...

Great to see that RCism is about Mary ... not about Christ I fear.

there will be signs in the skies in the heaven above Knock and all over Ireland north and south east and west leading up to the day of my visit on the 11th May 2010.

Well, that's something that can easily be verified... unless we take the various starsigns to be signs in its own kind. Will the person who posted this message be stoned if his/her predictions do not come through?

Fanny Cradock

Michaelrsh wrote: »

I made it in my last post on this thread.

And I thank you for expanding on your post.

Manach

Offhand, I'd be dubious about this.
AFAIK, The average Irish peasant at the time whilst having a minimum education would still have enough natural-intelligence to be suspicious that a ruse was being pull (it is in our nature )
As well, the English authorities would probably have investigated this, given the high level of land agitation of this time period. No one could accuse them of being credulous.

Owen

Manach wrote: »

AFAIK, The average Irish peasant at the time whilst having a minimum education would still have enough natural-intelligence to be suspicious that a ruse was being pull (it is in our nature )

This was a time in Ireland, when people seriously believed in Banshees and Fairy Rings, especially in Rural Ireland. I remember going to my familys farm in the Wicklow Mountains as a teenager, and my Grandmother being adamant that there was such a thing as a Banshee.

People back then were very superstitious - and I don't mean that as a slur against Catholicism.

Graces7

Interesting point made by a Monsignor about Knock; that is has been wrongly named a Marian shrine.

If you look at the apparition; all points to the Lamb. Mary is simply a bystander.

So why a Marian shrine?

It is Jesus, the Lamb

And if Joe Coleman is not approved, why is he being allowed to take over the place in this manner? It was all but wrecked last time.

kelly1

patrickk wrote: »

http://knockapparitions.com/divine-messages/61-april-18-2010

Please don't tell me you believe this charlatan?

lmaopml

Hi,

I believe Santing is quite right in pointing out those extracts from Joe's 'visions'. These are, I would imagine, some of the more obvious reasons why Joe Coleman is seen as a charlatan. Catholics don't worship Our Lady as our saviour and never have. We honour her as the mother of God, but not as our saviour....

Interesting take on the Knock apparitions...Great timing too for a book :rolleyes:

I guess whether one believes or no in 'knock', it doesn't really make all that much difference to our relationship with God....At the end of the day, what happened there to those people - whether one believes it was miraculous or not - certainly hasn't done any harm, unless lots and lots of prayers said in the one spot are a bad thing.

fryup

in a country where people worship tree stumps.......i doubt if this book will have any impact

wonderwoman

Where was this article published?!

Graces7

lmaopml wrote: »

Hi,

I believe Santing is quite right in pointing out those extracts from Joe's 'visions'. These are, I would imagine, some of the more obvious reasons why Joe Coleman is seen as a charlatan. Catholics don't worship Our Lady as our saviour and never have. We honour her as the mother of God, but not as our saviour....

Interesting take on the Knock apparitions...Great timing too for a book :rolleyes:

I guess whether one believes or no in 'knock', it doesn't really make all that much difference to our relationship with God....At the end of the day, what happened there to those people - whether one believes it was miraculous or not - certainly hasn't done any harm, unless lots and lots of prayers said in the one spot are a bad thing.

Thank you for this calm sense.

And the church does leave it open to everyone whether they believe in even the approved apparitions.

More worrying is a move by some to try to make Mary a co-mediatrix equal with Jesus.

If that happens many will leave the church.

But again, the catechism does speak of a 'soft Marian approach"

I don't know anyone who takes Joe Coleman seriously; he is into tarot readings and many other forbidden areas

But so many find peace at Knock; as you say a place where prayer is.

Graces7

fryup wrote: »

in a country where people worship tree stumps.......i doubt if this book will have any impact

Isn't it desperate!!:rolleyes: