private parties can the garda interfere

undergroundvibe

HI, just seeing has anyone here got any knowledge on this subject

if you were to arrange a private party in a warehouse in the middle of nowhere where you have the owners permission, where you have djs, sound system, security, no beer being sold but people bring there own beer, and nobody paying in,

people pay for membership for this private party in advance thus covering the costs of the party

can the garda come up and shut it down, if so on what grounds

ill be going to the local garda station anyway to here their side of it but just thought id check here for peoples who may have done something similar in the past

Zascar

If its on private land and you're not going to disturb anyone or get complaints etc - I'd say you'd be grand if you were proactive etc and let them know.

undergroundvibe

Zascar wrote: »

If its on private land and you're not going to disturb anyone or get complaints etc - I'd say you'd be grand if you were proactive etc and let them know.

thats the plan man, was going to ask my local garda opinion first then approach the ones nearer the area

if its so easy though why do city centre ones get raided?

there must be something that they can do you for

seanan37

the gards cant do anything unless they see drugs being taken at the place!! they need a warrent to step foot on the property and if they do so with out the warrent tell them u will have them done for tresspasssing!!! it worked for me last yr!

undergroundvibe

seanan37 wrote: »

the gards cant do anything unless they see drugs being taken at the place!! they need a warrent to step foot on the property and if they do so with out the warrent tell them u will have them done for tresspasssing!!! it worked for me last yr!

did you say it to them beforehand?

can they get a warrant straight away?

if you hire security and are seen to be trying to stop drugs ie searching on arrival would that help?

hans aus dtschl

Some helpful advice would be here if posters didn't have so few posts.

seanan37

undergroundvibe wrote: »

did you say it to them beforehand?

can they get a warrant straight away?

if you hire security and are seen to be trying to stop drugs ie searching on arrival would that help?

no said to them when they came!! na i say its takesquite a while to get a warrant!!
yh that wd defo help!!

undergroundvibe

hans aus dtschl wrote: »

Some helpful advice would be here if posters didn't have so few posts.

i dont understand what your saying?

sbsquarepants

I could be wrong, but i think you'd be subject to planning permission due to change of use from industrial premises to entertainment, also there would be public liability issues. But this is just what i reckon, i don't know for certain.

hans aus dtschl

Warrant comes from super. if super's on duty warrant comes fast.

hans aus dtschl

sbsquarepants wrote: »

I could be wrong, but i think you'd be subject to planning permission due to change of use from industrial premises to entertainment, also there would be public liability issues. But this is just what i reckon, i don't know for certain.

All correct

Public order 1994 & Licensing act 1997 are biggest obstacles though

hans aus dtschl

undergroundvibe wrote: »

i dont understand what your saying?

undergroundvibe

hans aus dtschl wrote: »

All correct

Public order 1994 & Licensing act 1997 are biggest obstacles though

see my ignorant argument would be that its a private party and everything is paid for so whats it got to do with them unless there is noise pollution

how is it different to having 300 people in your shed?

seanan37

hans aus dtschl wrote: »

Warrant comes from super. if super's on duty warrant comes fast.

do the warrants not come from judges??

hans aus dtschl

undergroundvibe wrote: »

see my ignorant argument would be that its a private party and everything is paid for so whats it got to do with them unless there is noise pollution

how is it different to having 300 people in your shed?

And my ignorant argument was why would anyone put the loopholes up on a very public forum. lol.
But basically public order act 4, 5, 8 will allow them to heckle everyone on their way to/from, til they get someone with contraband and use that in conjunction with licensing act section 14 to get a warrant, at which point you're shut down.

hans aus dtschl

seanan37 wrote: »

do the warrants not come from judges??

Fraid not, warrants can come from super, under the 1997 licensing act, and probably more areas that i don't know of. I'm not a lawyer, I'm afraid.

seanan37

how the **** do u no all this mumbo jumbo??

hans aus dtschl

From getting shut down enough times

seanan37

ah ir fair enough!!

undergroundvibe

hans aus dtschl wrote: »

And my ignorant argument was why would anyone put the loopholes up on a very public forum. lol.
But basically public order act 4, 5, 8 will allow them to heckle everyone on their way to/from, til they get someone with contraband and use that in conjunction with licensing act section 14 to get a warrant, at which point you're shut down.

so if you have people only allowed arrive on assigned buses who drive onto the private property before letting them off that eliminates them being heckled on the way??

just removed my last bit of this post i just realised what u meant regarding the posting of loopholes

emick

It sounds like you are thinking of having a 'private' party. Lot of legislation was brought in during the 1990's to stop raves. The Licensing( Combating Drug Abuse) Act 1997 states....


12. —(1) Where a member of the Garda Síochána not below the rank of superintendent reasonably believes that persons—

(a) are making preparation for the holding of an unlicensed dance,

(b) who are present at an unlicensed dance which is in progress, prepared or organised that dance, or

(c) are using the sound equipment at an unlicensed dance,

he or she may give a direction that those persons and any other persons who come to prepare for or organise the dance are to leave the place and remove any sound equipment or other property which they have with them at that place.

You can also receive a €10,000 fine or up to 3 years in jail for organising such an event.

Is mise le key

Alright heres my two cents on this........

There was an attempt to have a gig in the building that was formerly the ASYLUM back in 2008, the owner had consented to this, party was private by invitation only, no one was obliged to pay anything, they did not seize any contraband prior to the party. The shutters were down on the building & party going inside for best part of three hours & then the Garda raided it & stopped all proceedings.....



Now the licenceing laws in theory should not apply to this as it is not a public event open to anyone but a superintendant can issue a warrant to raid the party if he has reason to beleive that there 'May' be drugs on the premises. So if you approach your local Guard & get them on side & ensure him you are taking active measures to prevent any drugs being on the premises you may be able to proceed unhindered.

Hope this helps a little

undergroundvibe

emick wrote: »

It sounds like you are thinking of having a 'private' party. Lot of legislation was brought in during the 1990's to stop raves. The Licensing( Combating Drug Abuse) Act 1997 states....


12. —(1) Where a member of the Garda Síochána not below the rank of superintendent reasonably believes that persons—

(a) are making preparation for the holding of an unlicensed dance,

(b) who are present at an unlicensed dance which is in progress, prepared or organised that dance, or

(c) are using the sound equipment at an unlicensed dance,

he or she may give a direction that those persons and any other persons who come to prepare for or organise the dance are to leave the place and remove any sound equipment or other property which they have with them at that place.

You can also receive a €10,000 fine or up to 3 years in jail for organising such an event.

to many laws in this country

hans aus dtschl

Not sure if they can "suspect drug use inside" without "character profiling". Worth looking into, if you've a friendly lawyer.

EuskalHerria

Would there be an issue that could have the Gards step in on the basis of health and safety? Not certain but would assume after the stardust disaster, Gards must have been given more power to ensure that health and safety risks were clamped down on.

Also I know there was a thread on it before, can gards seize your set up if your DJ'ing at one of these events?

electrogrimey

I'd say your best bet would be to keep it away from any neighbours, if there's no-one to disturb then your only problem is drugs. To get rid of that problem, have a chat with the guards first, and them them you're all lovely individuals. Keep it as small as possible (obviously it's not going to be small), but the more people there are the more likely it is you'll run into problems.

francois

EuskalHerria wrote: »

Would there be an issue that could have the Gards step in on the basis of health and safety?

yes, a Creation rave in a warehouse was stopped, the police had a senior fire brigade officer who opined the place was a fire risk so the cops shut it down-there are many ways to stop the event-

g5fd6ow0hseima

Its a pity this country is ruled by donkeys.

emick

hans aus dtschl wrote: »

Not sure if they can "suspect drug use inside" without "character profiling". Worth looking into, if you've a friendly lawyer.

The Gardaí can enter if they want to and if you try and stop them ......that is also an offence.

The Licensing Act 1997 was implemented to stop the type of event that you are trying to organise.

It would appear that the only option is to apply for a dance licence.

vasch_ro

emick that is the key, you must apply for Public Dance Licence
and a public music and singing licence, as far as I am aware you cannot get same without an on licence

emick

EuskalHerria wrote: »

Also I know there was a thread on it before, can gards seize your set up if your DJ'ing at one of these events?

If you are convicted of organising an unlicenced dance event they can seize all the sound equipment and you won't get it back.

It does not matter if it is a private party in your warehouse on your land. If members of the public are in attendence then it is considered to be a public event.

ED E

hans aus dtschl wrote: »

Warrant comes from super. if super's on duty warrant comes fast.

AFAIK only a judge can issue a search warrant.

emick

Lethal_Bullet wrote: »

AFAIK only a judge can issue a search warrant.

The 1997 Licensing and Combating Drugs Law states

14. —(1) Any member of the Garda Síochána whether in uniform or not may enter without a warrant any place in respect of which a public dancing licence is not in force at any time while such place is being used for public dancing or at any other reasonable time and there make such inspection, examination and inquiry as he or she shall think proper for the prevention or detection of a drug trafficking offence

So it would appear that under the 'Powers of Entry and Seizure' sections of the law that no warrants are required.

jonnny68

Fu*k the Garda just go ahead and do it, for every 1 Rave that gets stopped another 10 go ahead no probs,you just need to be very selective and secretive about the location, and put a lot of planniong into it, don't charge people in instead ask for donations, if i had the time id be organising one myself (it's been done before you know;))

Táck

Matilda Low Grape wrote: »

Its a pity this country is ruled by donkeys.

i always thought it was builders, bars and bribes that ran the country. donkeys are the ones who think voting will get the carrot.

what about the raffle ticket loophole, is that gone too? people buy tickets but its for an internal raffle...i thought this worked in the past?

This was a topic a couple of weeks back.

The bottom line is that, between land owners being liable for any injuries, problems with liquor licences, public order issues and most significantly the gardai powers to enter without warrant and seize anything, imo you simply cannot hope to get around the law with much outside a house party. Or enough money to buy or lease a licensed premises. Outside that, I think one should just forget trying to comply with the law, keep it illegal. The best ones are illegal. Even when they are known to the Gardai, I have seen Gardai stand by and watch as car after car goes into a rave in the middle of nowhere, because they don't want to be causing grief and one raid could send people running off into the hills, which isn't ideal either.

old gregg

as an aside ... not sure if the term 'doof in the bush' means much in this part of the world but back in Oz it's the term used to describe similar events but obviously due to the weather they are mostly held outdoors.
Anyway, a mate of mine used to run them on a regular basis up in Queensland and the way of dealing with the police was simple. At the first sign of cops arriving a bunch of the best looking women at the rave would go and start flirting with them. Wouldn't take long for the cops to completely forget why they were there and off they'd go wagging their tails leaving everyone free to party.

Riesen_Meal

francois wrote: »

yes, a Creation rave in a warehouse was stopped, the police had a senior fire brigade officer who opined the place was a fire risk so the cops shut it down-there are many ways to stop the event-

I'll never forget that night as long as I live, you or Warren K played this when the sun came up.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kx2FeKtt3Fc

jiltloop

francois wrote: »

yes, a Creation rave in a warehouse was stopped, the police had a senior fire brigade officer who opined the place was a fire risk so the cops shut it down-there are many ways to stop the event-

I think I was at that rave actually, was that just across from the point?

SuprSi

It was Francois, I'll never forget it. It was bloody freezing, the sun started to come up, and that tune came on. The roar from the crowd was amazing! The Gardai were there - the music stopped for a short while before someone announced that we were going to be left alone as long as we all left around 8 or 9am. What a night!

francois

SuprSi wrote: »

It was Francois, I'll never forget it. It was bloody freezing, the sun started to come up, and that tune came on. The roar from the crowd was amazing! The Gardai were there - the music stopped for a short while before someone announced that we were going to be left alone as long as we all left around 8 or 9am. What a night!

Twas some night/morning a proper old style warehouse bash
I remember the crowd going mad at that moment, that's what DJing was all about for me
some pics of it here, if there are any more please send them on

http://www.flickr.com/photos/43703071@N00/84507350/sizes/o/in/set-72057594047309797/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/43703071@N00/84507349/sizes/o/in/set-72057594047309797/

http://picasaweb.google.com/fpittion/FlyersAndGigs#5077830423116959202

http://picasaweb.google.com/fpittion/FlyersAndGigs#5077833554148118162

http://picasaweb.google.com/fpittion/FlyersAndGigs#5077830491836435986

jiltloop

Yeah that was the party alright! Great night that was, it was completely surreal and the warehouse looked amazing! Great memories!

Riesen_Meal

Good times alright, that warehouse rave was brilliant, think I was only 20 or 21 at the time, had a quick flick through Francois' photostream, some great pictures from way back when....

Jev/N

undergroundvibe wrote: »

to many laws in this country

What a smart, well thought-out response :rolleyes: