4-bed house is really 3-bed with study

taraken

I am in the process of buying a new build 4 bed house and solicitor has come back to say the planning permission is actually for a 3 bed with study. The study is big enough to be classed as a bedroom. I am now unsure as to what problems could arise in the furure about this and also why would the builder not have the correct planning permission. I'm really confused and would like some input please.

Victor

Legally, there might be a requirement for a bedroom to be a certain size based on the design standards in the city / county development plan.

The future problem would be you are selling a 3-bed, which won't get as much money as a 4-bed. the bank is also likely to only finance you for a 3-bed.

D3PO

If panning permission is for a 3 bed with study its illegal for them to advertise it for sale as a 4 bedroom.

Exactly the same way its illegal to sell a 3 bed with attic converison as a 4 bedroom unless certian planning guidlines have been adhered to.

Now if your still interested in buying thats fine there is nothing to stop you using the study as a bedroom but when you sell you will be selling a 3 bed and your also buying a 3 bed so Id be chopping a chunk off the asking price straight away to reflect the reality of the property you are buying and its realisitc value.

Id also be reporting the EA to the IAVI, these crooks would go to the end of the earth to make a sale. No scruples or morals at all.

aCA

Im sure someone will be along to correct me if Im wrong, but I have noticed lots of estates with 4 bedroom houses advertised as 3 + study.

I think that often when developers were building estates the local planning authorities would specify a rough mix of 2 / 3 & 4 bedroom houses that they would want to see built. The developer here may have wanted to build more 4 bedrooms houses and the 'skirt' the planners is advertising them this way.

As long as the house has planning permission and is built in compliance with the planning regulations there would be nothing to stop the op was advertising the house as a 4 bedroom house when selling it in the future. I dont think its the same as when people add small attic conversions that doesnt meet the building regulations.

D3PO

aCA wrote: »

As long as the house has planning permission and is built in compliance with the planning regulations there would be nothing to stop the op was advertising the house as a 4 bedroom house when selling it in the future. I dont think its the same as when people add small attic conversions that dont meet the building regulations.

I stand corrected but Im pretty sure your wrong. If its built and provided planning as a 3 bed thats what you have to advertise it as.

the number of bedrooms clearly has implications on the price and "value" if theres such a thing in the current market of the property. If I was the OP then theres no way Id be paying a 4 bed price for a 3 bed property, I dont care how big the study is.

Victor

aCA wrote: »

Im sure someone will be along to correct me if Im wrong, but I have noticed lots of estates with 4 bedroom houses advertised as 3 + study.

I think that often when developers were building estates the local planning authorities would specify a rough mix of 2 / 3 & 4 bedroom houses that they would want to see built. The developer here may have wanted to build more 4 bedrooms houses and the 'skirt' the planners is advertising them this way.

Generally planners want more larger (in bedroom terms) properties than small ones - an excess of 1-beds (not so much 2-beds) creates a ctycle of properties with residents moving every few years as their needs change, where as larger properties create stability - young couples can buy a larger property and rent out a room or two until they have children, thereby contributing to stability and community ownership.

Goesague

there was a time when local authorities had maximum density regulations. typically it was 24 bed spaces per acre. That meant 8 three bedroom houses or 6 four bedroom. A way to get more 4 bed houses is to build 8 three bed with study. There is now a lesser emphasis on the number of bedrooms and a greater emphasis on square footage. There is supposedly a minimum size allowed by planning law for a bedroom. Many old style box bedrooms do not meet this.

3DataModem

I've recently looked into this OP.

A bedroom must be 6.4 metres squared at least to be called a bedroom. And 2/3rds or more of the ceiling must be 7ft+ in height.

There are other requirements, but these are the key ones for studies and attics.

E.g. I recently converted the attic of a 3 bed house and to fit the new stairs in I moved a wall of the smallest room (exactly 6.4m^2 coincedentally!).

So I now technically have a 2 bed house with a large study and a huge converted attic!

For me that was not really a problem as I don't really plan on selling this house. If I had to I could move a stud wall between two rooms by 10cm to make it a legal room... but I don't envisage doing it.

D3PO

3DataModem wrote: »

I've recently looked into this OP.

A bedroom must be 6.4 metres squared at least to be called a bedroom. And 2/3rds or more of the ceiling must be 7ft+ in height.

There are other requirements, but these are the key ones for studies and attics.

E.g. I recently converted the attic of a 3 bed house and to fit the new stairs in I moved a wall of the smallest room (exactly 6.4m^2 coincedentally!).

So I now technically have a 2 bed house with a large study and a huge converted attic!


For me that was not really a problem as I don't really plan on selling this house. If I had to I could move a stud wall between two rooms by 10cm to make it a legal room... but I don't envisage doing it.

Im not sure thats 100% right. I think the size regulations depend on when the hosue was built. So the 6.4m2 doesnt apply to every bedroom again I could be wrong.

Del2005

D3PO wrote: »

Im not sure thats 100% right. I think the size regulations depend on when the hosue was built. So the 6.4m2 doesnt apply to every bedroom again I could be wrong.

Possibly. I doubt the box bedroom in my parents house, mid 70's built semi D, is that size and it's still classed as a 3 bed.

Victor

3DataModem wrote: »

A bedroom must be 6.4 metres squared at least to be called a bedroom. And 2/3rds or more of the ceiling must be 7ft+ in height.

I know here are height rules in the Building Regulations, but where are you getting the area from?

Jo King

Victor wrote: »

I know here are height rules in the Building Regulations, but where are you getting the area from?

From his head. 6.4 metres squared is the size of a small apartment.

ricman

Say you put it on daft.ie 3bed house with study ,x sq ft, with photos of all the rooms, then you,ll get a fair price.You,ll get more than a 3bed cos theres always people with kids looking for a house with tv room,or study .IF 1 buy a house i can put a sofabed in the study for visitors etc its not against the law .People will see all the rooms when the view it and they,ll
pay a bit more, but some 3 bed houses are bigger than a 4 bed ,
i,d go by the actual floor space eg 900 square foot and ceiling height .
IF a builder is designing a 3 bed the rooms have to be a minimum size under building regs, to get planning permission.
I THINK he means in future if you wanna sell ,you,d have to advertise it as a 3bed home with a study,or lounge.SO the builder got planning permission for a 3 bed ,and just built an extra room.
Just call it a study on documents etc you dont have a problem , unless the bank objects in regard to the mortgage ,which is very unlikely.
Tell your solicitor to make sure relevant documents describe it as a 3bed with study ,
just in case you wish to sell it in 25 years time.

taraken

Thanks for all the replies, they have been a great help. I think the problem may be the ceiling height in one of the bedrooms as its a dormer type room. I had the house revalued as a 3 bed and I am happy enough to go ahead. Thanks.