Laser Refund Issue

cson

Story is thus so far;

Went to pay for a bus pass with my Laser Sunday night; whatever happened during the transaction, it was voided and the cashier gave me the voided receipts and asked me to re-do the transaction. All well and good says I.

Check my bank balance on Monday and lo and behold the 'voided' transaction was debited to my account. I go back into the shop with the receipts and ask for the matter to be resolved. The guy there was very cagey, attempted to take the receipts off me and requested a bank statement showing the above. I found this strnage as the shop should have the record of both transactions.

Go into the bank and for whatever reason the details of the voided transaction aren't showing - the second one is showing details and all but the voided one only shows the amount. So I can't get the statement showing the two amounts. The bank maintain the retailer should have cancelled the transaction at their end and this would have been avoided. They said it may be working its way through the system and to check on Friday. Failing that they will give contact details and tell me to get the retailer to contact them for confirmation.

Now to the point; what I'm looking for is the point of view of the retailer here - what exactly happens in this scenario? I'm convinced the retailer has it within his/her means to give me the refund as they'd have all applicable documentation and it seems to me they're just being awkward. Their mistake has caused me the considerable hassle of having to stop off their on my way home from work and of two trips, going to be 3 trips to the bank on my lunch. I'm quite annoyed and will actively publicise the shop and warn people off it based on my experience should I not have the refund by Friday.

jpb1974

it was voided and the cashier gave me the voided receipt

If this was a print out from the laser machine then you shouldn't really have an issue as you have proof of the voided transaction. I don't think the shop in question have done much wrong, sounds like they've followed the correct Laser procedure.

I've had this happen before, but the voided transaction usually appears on my account statement (online) fairly quickly.

cson

It's more the attitude from the employees I've encountered and their unwillingness to help or explain the procedure allied to the fact I've had to waste 2 lunch breaks in the bank already with a third on the way that's annoying me, over something relatively simple.

Gamesnash.ie: Pat

It's a quirk of the Laser system I suspect. When a retailers terminal "rings for authorisation" on any card it in effect freezes the funds that were authorised so that when the retailer later requests payment ( be that through the internet or by batching the terminal at the end of day ) the funds are there to meet the request.

With a credit card it doesn't show on your statement but you would find transactions in the mean time would be rejected if they tried to use the amount for want of a better word promised elsewhere. The laser card system though immediately debits the account and then refunds it should the retailer cancel or not request the completion. Some banks wait for 7 days before processing the cancellation. I think what has happened here is the first attempt was authorised (the bank debiting the account immediately) but was then voided (the bank may wait 7 days to void this) then a second transaction was performed (which the bank treated as a seperate event and immediately debited the account again) The retailer only has one set of funds and the bank have the other in the delay of cancelling the first one.

Fey!

If the docket that the retailer gave you shows a void, then your issue is not with the retailer, it is with the banks.

The retailer will not have gotten any money on a voided transaction, so therefore can and will not give you the refund you are demanding. There is nothing that the employee of the shop can do about it.

timmywex

I would imagine what happened here was that the funds were frozen by the retailer laser machine, but the end of day was not processed on the retailers laser machine, so therefore the funds remain frozen, and it shows up on your account. The money should have been released back though.

I know where i work this has happened, but after we've done the end of day (10 at night or so) the money is always just released back to the account

Gamesnash.ie: Pat

timmywex wrote: »

I would imagine what happened here was that the funds were frozen by the retailer laser machine, but the end of day was not processed on the retailers laser machine, so therefore the funds remain frozen, and it shows up on your account. The money should have been released back though.

I know where i work this has happened, but after we've done the end of day (10 at night or so) the money is always just released back to the account

This can actually take 7 days from experience.

gerrycollins

If it was a stand alone credit card machine ie not linked to a till then the retailer at this stage cannot prove either way to you as those units are like a phone and the retailer has no direct proof other than the same evidence you have as a copy receipt would have been printed too.

however where the credit card is linked he would have some kind of paper proof in his PC that can prove he was only credited with one amount of money. Like others said because you did the transaction on a sunday and checked it on a monday you cannot access those funds as they have been ear marked for that shop however when the shop doesnt request them they will be released into your account.

of you were in my shop i can print you the credit card numbers and the relative amounts so i could prove to you that i didnt charge you twice and dont worry it happens all the time.

cson

To be honest whats irking me is that I'm 75 quid out of pocket and I could do with it before the weekend, that and the blasé attitude of the staff towards me. Will not be going near the place again.

GerardKeating

cson wrote: »

To be honest whats irking me is that I'm 75 quid out of pocket and I could do with it before the weekend, that and the blasé attitude of the staff towards me. Will not be going near the place again.

But it is the banks "fault" not the shop, it's not an uncommon problem and maybe they are just fed up with getting grief/blame for something over which they have no control/responsibility.

gerrycollins

cson wrote: »

To be honest whats irking me is that I'm 75 quid out of pocket and I could do with it before the weekend, that and the blasé attitude of the staff towards me. Will not be going near the place again.

the staff couldnt help because they didnt know how to. I know for the ATM in my store people are always coming saying that they asked for money and it never came out "has the money been withdrawn from my account" the simple answer is no however they want proof off me, how can i access your account to prove myself.

as for my back up credit card machine which is one of those stand alone i never had anyone come back where the inital transaction was declined/not authorised.

you will have it back in your account before the weekend the bank just say 10 days as a just in case senario.

cson

I've been into the Bank 2 times and they are adament the fault is on the other end. I'm a bit hazy as to the exact reasoning they gave me but it was something along the lines of it should have been cancelled immediately and not waited until day end/week end to rectify it.

Now the shop owners here [and thanks for replying, its exactly what I wanted - a view from the other side] are saying it's the banks fault. I imagine the answer lies in between the two somehow.

I blame the staff not for the error but for their conduct and attitude toward me - it would have been simple for them to state what has been stated above and would have saved me two trips to the bank. Both staff claimed to be the person in authority when I asked for the manager so I can only assume they should be versed in such matters. At the end of the day they've annoyed me and wasted my time and as such I will avoiding the place and encouraging family, friends and colleagues to do likewise.

dudara

Moved to Banking & Insurance & Pensions

dudara

keithclancy

Gamesnash.ie (Pat) wrote: »

It's a quirk of the Laser system I suspect. When a retailers terminal "rings for authorisation" on any card it in effect freezes the funds that were authorised so that when the retailer later requests payment ( be that through the internet or by batching the terminal at the end of day ) the funds are there to meet the request.

With a credit card it doesn't show on your statement but you would find transactions in the mean time would be rejected if they tried to use the amount for want of a better word promised elsewhere. The laser card system though immediately debits the account and then refunds it should the retailer cancel or not request the completion. Some banks wait for 7 days before processing the cancellation. I think what has happened here is the first attempt was authorised (the bank debiting the account immediately) but was then voided (the bank may wait 7 days to void this) then a second transaction was performed (which the bank treated as a seperate event and immediately debited the account again) The retailer only has one set of funds and the bank have the other in the delay of cancelling the first one.

It shows on MBNA as "Pending Transactions"

Got worried once as there was a Pending Transaction for 1200 euros, didnt know what it was for, turns out Europcar has held 1200 euros during the time I rented a car from them

GerardKeating

Gamesnash.ie (Pat) wrote: »

It's a quirk of the Laser system I suspect. When a retailers terminal "rings for authorisation" on any card it in effect freezes the funds that were authorised so that when the retailer later requests payment ( be that through the internet or by batching the terminal at the end of day ) the funds are there to meet the request.

It is a Quirk with most card schemes, not just laser. Many card machine do not go back online when a transaction is voided or cancelled, so the bank has no way of knowing that it has been cancelled, so they have to wait for the authorisation to expire before they can release your funds again.

cson

Result, got it back. Happy out although I still woun't be going back to that shop because of the staff.